As promised I'm back on 20wt oil

Status
Not open for further replies.
I've been telling StevieC that any mainstream oil available at WalMart Australia would be preferable to any weight of Amsoil, but does he listen?

Nooooo....he just can't help himself, insists on this boutique nonsense.


Originally Posted by Shannow
Originally Posted by StevieC
My Journey ran 5w20 and I did mostly highway with that high revving 2.4L that was gutless and it had stellar UOA's and used no oil. My UOA is posted here for that vehicle.

20wt is fine if it's a normal application and the book calls for it. No need to get bent out of shape thinking your engine is running on "water" or will suffer premature wear in abundance with a lower HTHS than 3.5.


smirk2.gif
smirk2.gif
smirk2.gif


Can't help yourself can you...
 
LOL, no...Walmart was one of the highlights of our trip...just being in one and 98c flipflops.

Actually, the produce in the Nevada and NM Walmarts was very good.
 
Originally Posted by kschachn
Ahh OK, I see. Bottom line you don't know anything specific, you just think there could be a problem.


Well, if you want to be like that about it... I've been doing oil analysis on the Ford engine and it's obvious that wear is reduced with the 5W30. And, a Ford engineer who worked on the powertrain team stated in an article once off the record that he would "definitely use 5W30" in the engine, which he did on his own Mustang, despite the spec being lowered for fuel efficiency cycle testing. And, I've personally opened up engines from different brands used on different oils and I've seen the results.

So yeah, I know a lot of specific things. Just didn't think it was worth getting into all of that on a message forum.
 
Originally Posted by Patman
Originally Posted by OFFRD


I never said a 0W20 harms the engine. But the fact is that in most cases it is not chosen because it's the best for engine longevity. It's usually because of the quest for the highest EPA numbers possible that will also get the engine through warranty period.


And how many engines do you know of that are only living to just past the warranty period and no more than that? Do you really think car makers want their engines to die immediately after the warranty is up? Nobody would buy their cars, and they would tell all their friends not to buy their cars too.


Um, yeah, there's a term for that. It's called "planned obsolescence". Why do you think light bulbs only last 6 months when a hundred years ago they lasted almost forever? If a car lasted 500,000 miles on average, THAT is when an automaker wouldn't be selling any cars.

Again, you guys are twisting my words. I never said they "want their engines to die immediately after warranty is up". What I said is that once they get you through warranty period, it's your baby. They don't care anymore. They're ready for you to come back into the showroom so they can sell you another car, which they do frequently. Dealerships are littered full of used trade-ins that are barely out of warranty.
 
What a load of backpedaling and nonsense.

Who uses conventional light bulbs now anyway? Do you know anything about physics and engineering?

The longevity is related to the efficiency, you can make a very long lasting tungsten light bulb but it will be very inefficient. Run 240V bulbs in your house and you will have extremely long lifetimes, I guarantee it. Besides that though, a modern LED light bulb has a very long lifetime. How does that fit in with your planned obsolescence paradigm?

You really don't know what you're talking about, do you?
 
Modern day bulbs last so long that the replacement market suffers after the initial "change" to CF or LED … so much so that some of the big names are selling out …
 
Originally Posted by Patman
I don't believe "planned obsolescence" is something that automakers do, for the reasons I've already explained.

I know that life cycles are a factor, my brother (Mechanical Engineer) says it's something frequently discussed, but they do try to make it last as long as possible considering the application, safety and budget.
 
Originally Posted by Patman
I don't believe "planned obsolescence" is something that automakers do, for the reasons I've already explained.





I agree. The discussion on engine longevity is a very fluid one. What percentage of engines make it to that 500k mark? A better question would be what percentage of vehicles make it that far? There are too many variables to consider.
 
Originally Posted by Patman
I don't believe "planned obsolescence" is something that automakers do, for the reasons I've already explained.


"regular" engines last longer now than they ever have. I say "regular" because I am referring to port-injected engines which don't seem to be plagued with the bizarre issues that the DI mills are experiencing which may have an impact on overall lifespan.

An LSx is a far better engine than the SBC it replaced for example. The Modulars tend to last basically forever, look at the Million Mile Ford van or the thousands of insanely high mileage taxi and limo Panther cars out there
crazy2.gif
 
There is so much competition on the vehicles sales market today, that all of the manufacturers want their vehicle logos to last the longest.

However, what the industry is finding out - is that estimated expensive repairs like hypothetical ($2k-4k), is producing trade-ins of these sick vehicles and immediate purchases of another new vehicle.

So the dealer sees increased profit in dishing-out terrible trade-in value - fixing the sick vehicle - then reselling it at very high profit. Plus, they make another nice profit on selling you another new vehicle.

So does the manufacturer want your vehicle to die prematurely?...... heck no.
But does the dealer want your vehicle to get seriously sick and be traded-in for another new vehicle?...... heck yes.
 
Originally Posted by StevieC
It is operated like a fleet vehicle with stop-go traffic, periods of idling and sustained highway speeds for hours at times. Multiple re-starts daily.

That is, I would suggest a little easier than taxi service, and taxi service isn't as severe as its made out to be.
 
Originally Posted by 4WD
Modern day bulbs last so long that the replacement market suffers after the initial "change" to CF or LED … so much so that some of the big names are selling out …

I replace LEDs fairly regular. I actually need to change two right now in the bathroom. One went out a few days ago and another today. I do buy the El cheapo bulbs, maybe that's it.
 
Originally Posted by Patman
I don't believe "planned obsolescence" is something that automakers do, for the reasons I've already explained.


Design life IS a consideration in anything...in Eng design we were taught that you need to consider carfully the end use.
* selling to industrial customers - they don't want unplanned shutdowns
* selling to retail customers...they have to like it, and breakdown has to be beyond the point that they remember how much they paid for it and when they bought it, such that they almost look forward to the refresh and update.

Now to cars

In the '60s, Ford worked with Castrol to design a "fill for life" on a 25,000 mile life "disposable" low end vehicle. Castrol looked at it and told them that leaving the oil in for the 25,000 miles virtually fulfilled that need, both from getting to 25,000 miles, and not greatly exceeding that in a throwaway vehicle. Note to OP before he takes my comments and twists them...this is regular off the shelf oil in a purposely designed low end vehicle...not a comment on Amsoil, mobil and marketing claims.

Honda, in their papers refer to lower viscosities with "improved" efficiency/CO2 while "still providing acceptable" longevity.

GM tried to argue that 180,000km was the design life of a Commodore, and as such, regulations to limit operation of them beyond that point should be implemented (similar to Japan), and that life extension should be frowned on - that was purely to sell more cars, so bunk argument.

Design life IS an issue...but not many of us BITOGers have ever driven a car to the junkyard, so it's a factor that few of US ever worry about.
 
Originally Posted by hatt
Originally Posted by 4WD
Modern day bulbs last so long that the replacement market suffers after the initial "change" to CF or LED … so much so that some of the big names are selling out …

I replace LEDs fairly regular. I actually need to change two right now in the bathroom. One went out a few days ago and another today. I do buy the El cheapo bulbs, maybe that's it.

The more you turn them off & on, the faster they burn out.
 
It's not planned obsolesence, but rather planned lifetime of a component. Having to work on these things for a living, you can soon tell what parts are never designed to be removed for the lifespan of the vehicle, and which parts are planned to be servicable to some degree. That's what sends vehicles to the scrapheap now, when labour costs exceed it's value.
 
Originally Posted by Silk
It's not planned obsolesence, but rather planned lifetime of a component. Having to work on these things for a living, you can soon tell what parts are never designed to be removed for the lifespan of the vehicle, and which parts are planned to be servicable to some degree. That's what sends vehicles to the scrapheap now, when labour costs exceed it's value.


Yep, cars are becoming more and more disposable.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

T
Reduced oil consumption with Castrol Edge 5w-40 vs Mobil 1 0W-40
Replies
5
Views
264
The_Eric
Klutch9
Going back to 0w-20 for the winter
2 3 4
Replies
70
Views
3K
rondhol
9
2024 tacoma oil service question
2
Replies
38
Views
2K
edyvw
Don_M
MIA since 2016 ... I'm back - with a (subjective) observation
2
Replies
25
Views
3K
SimpleSyrup
C
Endurance Race Synthetic Oil
Replies
13
Views
289
CALencioni
Back
Top Bottom