My wife did this in my Durango. The engine never skipped a beat. I could hear her coming though, the exhaust at 5000rpm sounded pretty good!
50minutes in a 1st gear
- Thread starter parshisa
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A very thumbnail approximation here... Rotational stresses are typically influenced by the square of rotational velocity. Assuming the engine would have been rotating at 2000 RPM if driven normally, then the car was experiencing about 525% more stress at 5000 RPM.
2000 squared is 4 million. 5000 squared is 25 million. 100 x (25 - 4) / 4 = 525; therefore stress at 5k RPM is 525% more than at 2k RPM.
or, since 25 / 4 = 6.25, during that 50 minutes, she wore-out the engine 6.25 times as much by driving at 5000 RPM vs 2000 RPM.
Finally, these are 1st order approximations. Most likely, some engineer-type is going to nit-pic this. ... Yes, I'm well aware there are a whole host of coefficients to be applied here but as I said, these are first-order approximations. Aside from that, my 40 year old physics degree trumps your engineering degree -buzz off.
Ray
PS: If this were my wife's car, I'd change the oil just to be on the safe side.
2000 squared is 4 million. 5000 squared is 25 million. 100 x (25 - 4) / 4 = 525; therefore stress at 5k RPM is 525% more than at 2k RPM.
or, since 25 / 4 = 6.25, during that 50 minutes, she wore-out the engine 6.25 times as much by driving at 5000 RPM vs 2000 RPM.
Finally, these are 1st order approximations. Most likely, some engineer-type is going to nit-pic this. ... Yes, I'm well aware there are a whole host of coefficients to be applied here but as I said, these are first-order approximations. Aside from that, my 40 year old physics degree trumps your engineering degree -buzz off.
Ray
PS: If this were my wife's car, I'd change the oil just to be on the safe side.
Originally Posted by RayCJ
A very thumbnail approximation here... Rotational stresses are typically influenced by the square of rotational velocity. Assuming the engine would have been rotating at 2000 RPM if driven normally, then the car was experiencing about 525% more stress at 5000 RPM.
Yes, but that shouldn't matter as long as the higher stresses are still within safe limits.
The oil certainly would've become considerably hotter, but not necessarily enough to be a problem, especially if the trip was short and weather moderate or cool.
A very thumbnail approximation here... Rotational stresses are typically influenced by the square of rotational velocity. Assuming the engine would have been rotating at 2000 RPM if driven normally, then the car was experiencing about 525% more stress at 5000 RPM.
Yes, but that shouldn't matter as long as the higher stresses are still within safe limits.
The oil certainly would've become considerably hotter, but not necessarily enough to be a problem, especially if the trip was short and weather moderate or cool.
Italian tuneup
Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by RayCJ
A very thumbnail approximation here... Rotational stresses are typically influenced by the square of rotational velocity. Assuming the engine would have been rotating at 2000 RPM if driven normally, then the car was experiencing about 525% more stress at 5000 RPM.
Yes, but that shouldn't matter as long as the higher stresses are still within safe limits.
The oil certainly would've become considerably hotter, but not necessarily enough to be a problem, especially if the trip was short and weather moderate or cool.
That depends on the quality of the car. Assuming most cars redline at 6k RPM; this engine was driven for 50 minutes at 83% of full maximum. With some cars, that might be ok; yet with others -maybe not. Most gasoline engines in passenger vehicles spend the overwhelming majority of their life below 1/3 of their rated RPM range and when they go above, it's usually for a few fleeting moments. It's survival after 83% max RPM for 50 minutes is (in my opinion) an indication of good design, materials and build execution.
Originally Posted by PimTac
Everyone seems focused on the engine and the oil. What about the transmission and fluid? Should he do a early change out?
Same as above but, transmission fluid does not have the nasty problem of being exposed to products of combustion.
I'm not claiming to have detailed knowledge on the strengths or weaknesses of any particular vehicle or component thereof. My original post was just trying to shed some light on stress levels due to different RPM conditions.
Ray
Originally Posted by RayCJ
A very thumbnail approximation here... Rotational stresses are typically influenced by the square of rotational velocity. Assuming the engine would have been rotating at 2000 RPM if driven normally, then the car was experiencing about 525% more stress at 5000 RPM.
Yes, but that shouldn't matter as long as the higher stresses are still within safe limits.
The oil certainly would've become considerably hotter, but not necessarily enough to be a problem, especially if the trip was short and weather moderate or cool.
That depends on the quality of the car. Assuming most cars redline at 6k RPM; this engine was driven for 50 minutes at 83% of full maximum. With some cars, that might be ok; yet with others -maybe not. Most gasoline engines in passenger vehicles spend the overwhelming majority of their life below 1/3 of their rated RPM range and when they go above, it's usually for a few fleeting moments. It's survival after 83% max RPM for 50 minutes is (in my opinion) an indication of good design, materials and build execution.
Originally Posted by PimTac
Everyone seems focused on the engine and the oil. What about the transmission and fluid? Should he do a early change out?
Same as above but, transmission fluid does not have the nasty problem of being exposed to products of combustion.
I'm not claiming to have detailed knowledge on the strengths or weaknesses of any particular vehicle or component thereof. My original post was just trying to shed some light on stress levels due to different RPM conditions.
Ray
About once ever month or two I drive the roughly 15 miles home at 75+% of redline to keep the engine de-carboned. Never had a problem doing this. I have driven on the autobahn at more than 75% or redline at full power for miles on end...no damage there either. Much ado about nothing.
If anything happens it's more likely because it's a VW than the 5K run for almost an hour.
(J/K)
It's not ideal but I can't see it being catastrophic.
It's not ideal but I can't see it being catastrophic.
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edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Originally Posted by parshisa
My buddy's MIL is very inexperienced driver and obviously scared of everything that the car/road has to offer. Any how, few days ago, she was driving to work in her '14 Tiguan and accidentally switched to manual shifting and....drove for about 45-50 minutes in a first gear at 5K+ engine rpm. She said she though something was wrong with the car....
Now, the question is, did she cause and damage to engine/transmission? she's not sure if the engine ever overheated or not but I'd imagine it did. Oil/transmission fluid change at the very least??
Crazy, I know, but this has happened
Nothing will happen. I regularly push that engine up I70 to ski resorts above 4-5k. Those engines love to spin.
My buddy's MIL is very inexperienced driver and obviously scared of everything that the car/road has to offer. Any how, few days ago, she was driving to work in her '14 Tiguan and accidentally switched to manual shifting and....drove for about 45-50 minutes in a first gear at 5K+ engine rpm. She said she though something was wrong with the car....
Now, the question is, did she cause and damage to engine/transmission? she's not sure if the engine ever overheated or not but I'd imagine it did. Oil/transmission fluid change at the very least??
Crazy, I know, but this has happened
Nothing will happen. I regularly push that engine up I70 to ski resorts above 4-5k. Those engines love to spin.
Originally Posted by RayCJ
That depends on the quality of the car. Assuming most cars redline at 6k RPM; this engine was driven for 50 minutes at 83% of full maximum.
RPM is not the same as engine load. 5k RPM in first gear means the throttle was maybe 50% open.
True 83% of maximum output would mean driving at 5k RPM and fully open throttle.
That depends on the quality of the car. Assuming most cars redline at 6k RPM; this engine was driven for 50 minutes at 83% of full maximum.
RPM is not the same as engine load. 5k RPM in first gear means the throttle was maybe 50% open.
True 83% of maximum output would mean driving at 5k RPM and fully open throttle.
Originally Posted by KrisZ
Originally Posted by RayCJ
That depends on the quality of the car. Assuming most cars redline at 6k RPM; this engine was driven for 50 minutes at 83% of full maximum.
RPM is not the same as engine load. 5k RPM in first gear means the throttle was maybe 50% open.
True 83% of maximum output would mean driving at 5k RPM and fully open throttle.
Yes, I know. I was not referring to output. The sentence was clearly referring to full maximum of RPM.
Originally Posted by RayCJ
That depends on the quality of the car. Assuming most cars redline at 6k RPM; this engine was driven for 50 minutes at 83% of full maximum.
RPM is not the same as engine load. 5k RPM in first gear means the throttle was maybe 50% open.
True 83% of maximum output would mean driving at 5k RPM and fully open throttle.
Yes, I know. I was not referring to output. The sentence was clearly referring to full maximum of RPM.
Back when I was still driving an '80s car in the '90s, 50 minutes at 5k rpm would just have been a fast afternoon drive on the motorway. I'd hope a modern car could do that without any trouble, though it's going to have far less cooling available at 5k in 1st rather than 5k in 5th.
Originally Posted by clinebarger
How is a Mother In Law inexperienced at driving? She has a kid old enough to get married.
While the engine was at high RPM....Not much load was being put on it.
A friends Dad passed away a few weeks back. While giving my condolences to the family, my friend responded that his mother was really going to be lost. According to him his parents had been married over 50 years and his mother had never obtained her drives license. She had driven farm equipment in the fields but had never driven on a public highway. Hard to believe but I believe him.
How is a Mother In Law inexperienced at driving? She has a kid old enough to get married.
While the engine was at high RPM....Not much load was being put on it.
A friends Dad passed away a few weeks back. While giving my condolences to the family, my friend responded that his mother was really going to be lost. According to him his parents had been married over 50 years and his mother had never obtained her drives license. She had driven farm equipment in the fields but had never driven on a public highway. Hard to believe but I believe him.
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Originally Posted by parshisa
drove for about 45-50 minutes in a first gear at 5K+ engine rpm.
Except for the 1st gear, Germans drive their VWs at that rpm on the autobahn every day. Nothing to worry about.
drove for about 45-50 minutes in a first gear at 5K+ engine rpm.
Except for the 1st gear, Germans drive their VWs at that rpm on the autobahn every day. Nothing to worry about.
Originally Posted by P10crew
Oh man...is this an elderly person? Sorry to say but man it's time to start asking..... should this person really be driving.
Have you ever driven in Florida?
Oh man...is this an elderly person? Sorry to say but man it's time to start asking..... should this person really be driving.
Have you ever driven in Florida?
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