$50 billion bailout for the struggling big 3???

Status
Not open for further replies.
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Heck, scifi, what are you going to do with your Bagdad resort vouchers? I figure I've got a 2 week timeshare for life ..air fare included. GM should provide car rental


Use it of course!! Maybe they'll even throw in a Hummer to drive around in. According to a news outlet you can actually drive one without getting blown up now.

Could make do with a Suburban, though.
 
for the bailout money, the big 3 will have to be watched over by a government oversight board.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28108346

WASHINGTON - A bailout plan for the failing U.S. auto industry could include a Cabinet-level oversight board and a provision to withdraw the money if the overseers decide the companies are failing to take steps to overhaul themselves.

The plan would draw the emergency aid from an existing loan program meant to help the automakers build fuel-efficient vehicles. The size of the package hasn’t been finalized, but it is expected to be about $15 billion, several congressional aides said.

It would create a board composed of Cabinet secretaries from the departments of Treasury, Energy, Labor, Commerce and Transportation plus the Environmental Protection Agency administrator to oversee a broad auto industry restructuring. A congressional aide outlined the emerging measure on condition of anonymity because it is not yet completed.

In return for the money, the carmakers would have to agree to terms similar to those placed on banks that receive funds under the $700 billion Wall Street bailout: to limit their top executives’ pay packages, cease paying dividends, give the government a chunk of future gains and guarantee that taxpayers would be reimbursed before any other shareholders, the aide said.

The bill under discussion would place the special investigator overseeing the bank rescue in charge of keeping tabs on the auto bailout.

The White House and Democratic congressional leaders are narrowing their differences over the auto bailout, but had yet to agree on specific legislative details, officials said.

Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., chairman of the Banking Committee, said Sunday that General Motors Corp.’s chief executive, Rick Wagoner, “has to move on” as part of a government-run restructuring.

“I think you have got to consider new leadership,” Dodd said on CBS’ “Face the Nation.”

On Monday, Dodd said that “it’s not my job to hire and fire, but what I suggest is, you need to have new teams in place here ... if you’re going to convince the American public” that the financial relief plan is necessary and justified.

Dodd also said on ABC’s “Good Morning America” Monday that figures showing over a half-million people lost their jobs in November amounts to a “game-changer” in the debate over an aid package.

UAW President Ron Gettelfinger, appearing on NBC’s “Today” show, said his union is ready to go back to the bargaining table to help the auto companies, but he also said that workers should not be made “scapegoats” for their problems.

Criticized for staying on the sidelines until now, President-elect Barack Obama voiced support Sunday for the bailout legislation being drafted in Congress. He accused car industry executives of a persistent “head-in-the sand approach” to long-festering problems.

In an appearance on NBC’s “Meet the Press,” Obama said Congress was doing “the exact right thing” in drafting legislation that “holds the auto industry’s feet to the fire” at the same time it tries to prevent its demise.

GM spokesman Steve Harris said the company appreciates Dodd’s support for the loans, but added, “GM employees, dealers, suppliers and the GM board of directors feel strongly that Rick is the right guy to lead GM through this incredibly difficult and challenging time.”
 
Here's what Congress will vote on...Should they pass it?


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28108346

WASHINGTON - Majority Democrats and the Bush White House have finalized a deal to spend $15 billion on emergency loans for struggling U.S. automakers, congressional officials said Wednesday. Among some Republican lawmakers, stiff opposition lingered.

The White House did not go as far as to say the deal was final, although it did report “very good progress.” The measure could see a House vote later Wednesday and be enacted by week’s end.

It would create a government “car czar” to dole out the loans, with the power to force the carmakers into bankruptcy if they didn’t cut quick deals with labor unions, creditors and others to restructure their businesses and become viable.

Congressional Republicans, left out of negotiations on the package, are expressing grave reservations and may seek to block it.

Sen. David Vitter, R-La., promised to filibuster the measure, which could delay a final vote for days.

He said the package has an “[censored]-backwards” approach to curing what ails the U.S. auto industry.

Nevertheless, Democratic leaders were confident enough that a bill could advance that they set a procedural vote for the House floor later Wednesday. Even still, Sen. Mitch McConnell, the GOP leader, said in late morning that his side hadn’t seen the measure yet and wouldn’t agree to votes on the measure Wednesday.

“Republicans will not allow taxpayers to subsidize failure,” McConnell said, although he added that the auto situation would be addressed by the end of the week.

The congressional officials revealed agreement on a bill only on grounds of anonymity because the deal has not been formally announced.

At the White House, Deputy Chief of Staff Joel Kaplan said the administration and Congress have made “very good progress on a conceptual agreement.”

“We’ll be talking retail to individual senators to win their support,” said Kaplan, who said he expected President George W. Bush to lobby Republicans to vote for the package.

Kaplan said it was critical that the legislation have a clear definition of what is long-term viability for the companies.

A breakthrough came when Democrats agreed to scrap language — which the White House had called a poison pill — that would have forced the carmakers to drop lawsuits challenging tough emissions limits in California and other states, said congressional aides.

Environmentalists already were livid that the measure draws the emergency loans from an existing loan program to help carmakers retool their factories to make greener cars.

Kaplan also said the president was dispatching Chief of Staff Josh Bolten to Capitol Hill to make the case for the legislation with skeptical Republicans.

Kaplan said the Bush administration would work with President-elect Barack Obama’s team on choosing the so-called “car czar,” acknowledging that Bush’s tenure ends in 41 days and the automakers’ woes will continue well into 2009.

“We expect to work closely with the president-elect’s team on what is the most effective means of implementing this legislation,” Kaplan said.

Asked about the role of the “car czar,” Kaplan said: “This is not somebody who’s going to run the companies. This is someone who is going to bring them around the table, knock heads.”

“This is a bridge to either fundamental restructuring or bankruptcy,” he added. “They either have a long-term plan that’s viable or we get our money back. And if we call our money back, which is required under this bill, then those firms are not going to be able to survive.”
 
I like the idea of a car czar. GM doesn't know how to build cars at a profit, so get a government "czar" to do it.
33.gif


I'm thinking John DeLorean would have been a good pick. Well, then again, the 15 billion would likely end up in his nose...
 
Last edited:
Wow, I'm impressed with Ford. I was thinking the other day about a Ford F-150 as I will need a truck eventually.
wink.gif
 
Anyone else notice that there is NO talk about the morality or legality of Congress owning part of a major industry in our supposedly capitalist country?

Congress needs to vote no...but they will eventually vote yes. Whether it is this week or after change has come to Washington.
 
Originally Posted By: ToyotaNSaturn
I like this idea: rather than a car czar, we need to get a union czar.

How about a Czar for Illinois? It would appear they have a greedy, inept, and corrupt "CEO" making lots of money on broken system...
 
Originally Posted By: Tempest
Originally Posted By: ToyotaNSaturn
I like this idea: rather than a car czar, we need to get a union czar.

How about a Czar for Illinois? It would appear they have a greedy, inept, and corrupt "CEO" making lots of money on broken system...


We have him already. He's from Illinois, you know....
 
Auto bailout fails in the Senate!! I just saw on the news this morning that GM has hired bankruptcy lawyers.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28166218/

WASHINGTON - A bailout-weary Congress killed a $14 billion package to aid struggling U.S. automakers Thursday night after a partisan dispute over union wage cuts derailed a last-ditch effort to revive the emergency aid before year’s end.

Republicans, breaking sharply with President George W. Bush as his term draws to a close, refused to back federal aid for Detroit’s beleaguered Big Three without a guarantee that the United Auto Workers would agree by the end of next year to wage cuts to bring their pay into line with U.S. plants of Japanese carmakers. The UAW refused to do so before its current contract with the automakers expires in 2011.

The breakdown left the fate of the auto industry — and the 3 million jobs it touches — in limbo at a time of growing economic turmoil. General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC have said they could be weeks from collapse. Ford Motor Co. says it does not need federal help now, but its survival is far from certain.

Democratic leaders called on Bush to immediately tap the $700 billion Wall Street bailout fund for emergency aid to the auto industry.

Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., called the bill’s collapse “a loss for the country,” adding: “I dread looking at Wall Street tomorrow. It’s not going to be a pleasant sight.”

GM said in a statement it was “deeply disappointed” that the bipartisan agreement faltered. “We will assess all of our options to continue our restructuring and to obtain the means to weather the current economic crisis,” the company said. Chrysler, too, said it “will continue to pursue a workable solution to help ensure the future viability of the company.”

The White House said it was evaluating its options in light of the breakdown on Capitol Hill.

“It’s disappointing that Congress failed to act tonight,” Deputy Press Secretary Tony Fratto said in a statement. “We think the legislation we negotiated provided an opportunity to use funds already appropriated for automakers and presented the best chance to avoid a disorderly bankruptcy while ensuring taxpayer funds only go to firms whose stakeholders were prepared to make difficult decisions to become viable.”

That bill — the product of a hard-fought negotiation between congressional Democrats and the Bush White House — was virtually dead on arrival in the Senate, where Republicans said it was too weak in its demands on the car companies and contained unacceptable environmental mandates for the Big Three.

Thursday’s implosion followed yet another set of marathon negotiations at the Capitol — this time involving labor, the auto industry and lawmakers. The group came close to agreement, but it stalled over the UAW’s refusal to agree to the wage concessions.

“We were about three words away from a deal,” said Sen. Bob Corker of Tennessee, the GOP’s point man in the negotiations, referring to any date in 2009 on which the UAW would accept wage cuts.

The Senate rejected the bailout 52-35 on a procedural vote — well short of the 60 required — after the talks fell apart. Just 10 Republicans joined 40 Democrats and two independents in backing it. Three Democrats sided with 31 Republicans in opposition. Reid also voted “no” for procedural reasons.

Congress is not scheduled to return for legislative work until early January.

Some Senate Democrats joined Republicans in turning against the House-passed bill — despite increasingly urgent expressions of support from the White House and President-elect Barack Obama for quick action to spare the economy the added pain of a potential automaker collapse.

“In the midst of already deep and troubling economic times, we are about to add to that by walking away,” said Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., the Banking Committee chairman who led negotiations on the package.

Alan Reuther, the UAW’s legislative director, declined comment to reporters as he left a meeting room during negotiations. The union had no immediate reaction to the bailout’s defeat.

The stunning disintegration was eerily reminiscent of the defeat of the $700 billion Wall Street bailout in the House, which sent the Dow tumbling and lawmakers back to the drawing board to draft a new agreement to rescue financial institutions and halt a broader economic meltdown. That measure ultimately passed and was signed by Bush.

It wasn’t immediately clear, however, how the auto aid measure might be resurrected, with Congress now set to depart for the year.

Democratic House Speaker Nancy Pelosi called Senate Republicans’ refusal to support the White House-negotiated bill irresponsible and urged the Bush administration and the Federal Reserve to provide short-term relief for the automakers. “That is the only viable option available at this time,” she said.

Congressional Republicans have been in open revolt against Bush over the auto bailout. Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky joined other GOP lawmakers Thursday in announcing his opposition to the White House-backed bill, which passed the House on Wednesday. He and other Republicans insisted that the carmakers restructure their debt and bring wages and benefits in line with those paid by Toyota, Honda and Nissan in the United States.

Hourly wages for UAW workers at GM factories are about equal to those paid by Toyota Motor Corp. at its older U.S. factories, according to the companies. GM says the average UAW laborer makes $29.78 per hour, while Toyota says it pays about $30 per hour. But the unionized factories have far higher benefit costs.

GM says its total hourly labor costs are now $69, including wages, pensions and health care for active workers, plus the pension and health care costs of more than 432,000 retirees and spouses. Toyota says its total costs are around $48. The Japanese automaker has far fewer retirees and its pension and health care benefits are not as rich as those paid to UAW workers.

Republicans also bitterly opposed tougher environmental rules carmakers would have to meet as part of the House-passed version of the rescue package, and the Senate dropped them from its plan.

The House-passed bill would have created a Bush-appointed overseer to dole out the money. At the same time, carmakers would have been compelled to return the aid if the “car czar” decided the carmakers hadn’t done enough to restructure by spring.

The House approved its plan late Wednesday on a vote of 237-170.

A pair of polls released Thursday indicated that the public is dubious about the rescue plan.

Just 39 percent said it would be right to spend billions in loans to keep GM, Ford and Chrysler in business, according to a poll by the nonpartisan Pew Research Center. Just 45 percent of Democrats and 31 percent of Republicans supported the idea.

In a separate Marist College poll, 48 percent said they oppose federal loans for the struggling automakers while 41 percent approved.
 
Last edited:
Quote:
Democratic House Speaker Nancy Pelosi called Senate Republicans’ refusal to support the White House-negotiated bill irresponsible


There's the pot calling the kettle black. She's saying that it's irresponsible for choosing not to go into debt for billions of dollars.

This lady is DERANGED!
 
It failed all because the UAW wouldn't set a date certain for the concessions they've already agreed to.
smirk2.gif


Chapter 11 will be the best possible outcome for everyone involved.

Here's one thing I pondered this morning: we already gave the banks $700 billion to get the credit markets rolling and to get lending going again. Why not have one of the big banks lend the big 3 $15 billion from the bailout money, and have it insured by the government?
33.gif
 
the white house wants to give some of the original 700 billion bailout to the big 3; problem is, there won't be any restrictions on the bailout money like the financial companies got. so it's more money in the hole.
 
The UAW is unwilling to budge off of their ridiculously high pay. Even when the government is basically saying "take a pay cut or your company will go out of business and you will not have a job" and the fat union bosses are standing there with their arms crossed shaking their heads going "nuh-uhh".
 
Foreign-Based Automakers Support Big 3 Bailout


Quote:
...the risk that one of the U.S. car companies could collapse deeply worries Asian and German manufacturers with U.S. factories...

"We're joined at the hip with our Detroit brethren in manufacturing," said Irv Miller, group vice president and chief spokesman at Toyota Motor Corp.'s U.S. sales subsidiary. Whatever the U.S. government proposes to keep the U.S. automakers afloat, "we support it," Miller said.
 
Bush Approves $17.4 Billion Auto Bailout; Dec 19th, 2008

Quote:
WASHINGTON — President Bush announced $13.4 billion in emergency loans on Friday to prevent the collapse of General Motors and Chrysler, and said another $4 billion would be available for the hobbled automakers in February. The entire bailout is conditioned on the companies undertaking sweeping reorganizations to show that they can return to profitability.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom