1969 Mustang

[Ariff]

Hello guys this is my first post. Some friends told me about this site.. Lots of info here. I have a 1969 mustang with a 390 S code big block. I recently came across an article that stated In 2004, the government mandated motor companies to warrantee catalytic converters for 120,000
miles. This forced engine oil manufacturers to remove most of the zinc and manganese from their engine oil. Motor vehicle manufacturers counteracted this problem by changing the metal to metal contact of rocker arm feet and lifters to a newer style “roller rocker” and “roller lifter” arrangement. As you guessed, our antiques don’t have “roller” technology and have only one way to deal with this change of
oil formulation; dramatically increased wear at the rocker arms, lifters and camshafts. So my question to you pros here is what type of oil should I be using in a old non-roller rocker engine? I am getting ready to do a oil change and I want this enging to last another 30+ years..
Thanks.

 

[addyguy]

I don't have enough expertise to recommend the proper oil, but I just wanted to say congrats on a real nice ride! I think 390-powered Mustangs are a really over-looked musclecar gem - everyone concentrates on the 428 and 429 powered ones!

One recommendation that I think might work is Specialty Formulation (site sponsor) makes an oil additive, SX-UP, that is specifically designed for older musclecar engines...you might want to check that out....

 

[sunruh]

would not the high moly in VSOT really help this out?

 

[Steve S]

use any of the heavy duty motor oils,like delo 400 or mobil 1300 .

 

[steveh]

I would also run a good HDEO or a racing oil both have lots of zinc.

 

[Ariff]

Hey thanks for all the replies.. Yep that old 390 is very heavy in the front end.. Sucks no power steering also. It runs good as long as you are going down the road in a straight line. But any cornering and it is a pain. Any recommendations on a fuel additive like mentioned in Volvohead's post? I'll look around for a Heavy duty oil. I am assuing most auto stores will have this?
Thanks again.

 

[pastmaster]

Yup, HDEO oils, pick your favorite and you won't go wrong. Use the Ford Motorcraft Oil Filter FL81A, I think it's the right filter, and your set for another 30+ years. These Diesel Engine Oils are made to take the heat and power of the high horsepower with turbos, million mile Diesel Engines. And renew the PCV System, valve and hoses, it will cut your oil use or almost stop it! If you have any that is.

A question, Is the engine Stock and has it been rebuilt recently? The 15w40 oils are CONVENTIONAL or DINO. The 5w40 HDEO Oils are SYNTHETIC or SYN, around here. The Syn Oils, are better or maybe the BEST, to use with your 390, but cause leaks, usually. This is a whole other topic. If it has been rebuilt recently, use the 5w40 Syn. It still may leak, with old gasket technology and materials. Be Careful.

Use Marvel Mystery Oil, in your fuel tank as directed, 4oz. per 10 gals. This is a great additive for the 390, for it's upper cylinder and ring-packs. Keeps them free and clean. Good Luck,

[ January 25, 2006, 04:54 PM: Message edited by: pastmaster ]

 

[Ariff]

No the engine has not been modified much. The guy I bought it from had it some what rebuilt. New rockers lifters push rods etc. So I will most likely stick with dino oil. So I am assuming any diesel 15w 40 oil is considered HDEO is this a fair assumotion. I am a bit of a newbie when it comes to different types of oil. I can not use the fl81a since it is too "fat" for the front swaybar. I can't even fit one under there without denting it on the swaybar. So I am using a fl400 I believe same filter the ford ranger uses. It in not as wide and fits just right. Hopefully this is ok to do..

 

[pastmaster]

Yup Ariff, All HDEO Dino Oils, are for the most part 15w40, the most common one's in use. There is 10w30 and w30, too, but are harder to find and are not as common.

Chevron Delo, Mobil Delvac Super 1300, Shell Rotella, etc. are some of the most common brands. Walmart, seems the cheapest place to find them and watch for sales.

The fl400 Motorcraft, should be fine, but others will know more about this, and should post to you on this. Check out the oil filter heading on the site. Use the SEARCH, feature on all your questions, it will take days to read, but I learned a lot from it. Enjoy!

 

[glennc]

What you read was correct, although whether there is actually a wear problem in a given engine depends on many things. This is one area where a periodic UOA is very important, to make sure the oil you choose is working well in the engine.

There are several things to consider with the new lower additive levels. I believe the lowest levels are only required on the lighter weight oil used by newer cars, and that 10W-40 and heavier grades have higher limits. Also the oil formulations have evolved to include new anti-wear technologies, with Moly and Boron being common protective additives. Then too, using an HDEO allows you to avoid the requirements almost completely, as these oils don't have any catalytic converter limits other than those for the gas-engine grade they are certified at, typically SL. Finally, there are OTC oil additives on the market that contain large amounts of the limited agents, which you can pour in to boost your oil. One that is popular here is Valvoline Synthetic Oil Treatment (VSOT), a VOA of which you can see in that section of the website. A lot of people add an ounce per quart of motor oil, or up to the whole bottle with an oil change - although it's very heavy so watch the viscosity.

- Glenn

 

[Volvohead]

Know all about those engine families.

The 390/428 was a nice street block, but the 427 and 429 are what Ford took to the track to cope with the Hemis. I always thought the big blocks were too heavy for the front ends of the pre '70 Mustangs if you wanted any handling. On the bigger Galaxies, people didn't even think about handling anyway.

Despite the lack of roller arms, these engines are not that hard on oil by today's standards, unless its blown, you're tracking it, or you've messed heavily with the cam. The main journals are just enormous.

Any HDEO 15w40 is fine. You can add in a supplement if you want, but I don't think you'll need it unless you're doing one of the above things with the car.

I'd go with Delo, as it has plenty of old school chemistry (i.e. moly).

The valve train is the biggest concern anymore on the pre '70 engines. Try to run a lubricating additive in the fuel if you can.

 

[GoldenRod]

Ariff,

I would also recommend the Delo 15W40 as previously stated. What (pastmaster) said about using the Mystery Oil sounds like a very good idea since your 390ci was made back when gasoline was leaded. I wish I would have known this when I had my '70 Cougar.

 

[eljefino]

Roller rocker/lifters became widespread in the 80s-90s for smog reasons but not necessarily so people could run cheaper oils. Cam profiles got steeper for reduced overlap (improved emissions, mileage) and it was hard with scraping parts. Added durability is nice too.

Although you are right to be paranoid, because now the oil companies say, jeez, the average car has rollers, we can cut the additives like the makers want now...

What the other posters say about finding AW adds in other products is right. Have fun with the car.

And it's not a FL81A. Drop the 8.

 

[Volvohead]

Yeah, I was going to recommend the MMO for the fuel, as that's what I used on my 429s. Worked great and kept the carb jets nice and clean, too.

I'll still use it on our marine engines from time to time, even though they have hardened seats.

The MC or Wix are the perfect filter choice on these engines. Way back when, I would run Frams, they were nice filters then.

Ahhh . . . 429s and C6s . . . good memories.

 

[Ariff]

Cool I'll look for some MMO.. I do think the seats have been swapped out for hardened seats. yep I love my FE big block.. I also have a 3 speed C-6 aout trans to back it up.. It is a Hoss, pain to work on with the Hooker long tube headers..Takes a few hrs just to change the spark plugs :>)

 

[mechtech]

Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment [VSOT] is a great additive.
It's very reasonable, and would suit your engine perfectly.

 

[Dart-Swinger]

My 69 dart has been on Mobil one 15w50 for years now and is the best I have ever used in it.I have had it since 1981 and built the engine in 1984 and have no oil leaks.

 

[Volvohead]

M1 15W-50 is a superb oil in these older powerplants. Great in a marine application, too.

However, I took from the tenor of the gentleman's post that he wanted a conventional (I could be wrong).

With all synthetics, the engine should be clean in advance of the changeover to best prevent seal leaks. And unless the vehicle is being tracked or is blown, you won't necessarily need the added protection considering how easily a conventional HDEO satisfies these engines.

 

[Ariff]

Yep I am looking for a conventional oil not syn.. I have heard really good things about Shell Rotella.. Now if I can just find it around here ;>)

 

[goatdude]

I always had great results with HDEOs in my old school '67 GTO.