17 Civic 1.5T, 81K on ODO, Pennz Euro L 5W30, 7,395 ODI

[chinee]

You know, AFTER purchasing the Civic for my daughter, I found out that these Honda 1.5 turbo engines had fuel dilution issues... I thought this was the end of Honda reliability and I was going to have a major headache on my hand with this car. So I faithfully conducted UOAs, did a little research as to what might be the best oil for this engine, for the South Florida climate we inhabit and my daughter's not-too-aggressive driving style... and these UOAs have been boring.

So for those of you interested, or looking for a cure for your insomnia... here's the most recent UOA and a history of UOAs over the last 4 1/2 years.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Seems odd that you had better flashpoint numbers running Dexos 1 versus the more recent Euro L's..... in a dilution polluter like the 1.5 engine.

I enjoy reading your 4-5 comments per year Chinee, Show yourself a little more in 2024. Shoot for 10-15.
.... and thank you for buying your daughter a car. I did the buying cars for my kids. Now I'm doing the same for my three grandsons, as they eventually all turn 18.
Go Pennzoil too! I stuck with them for over 25 years...... until a few years ago. My HyunKia's started consuming SOPUS oils, so I switched. Now the consumption stuff has basically stopped.

 

[CharBaby]

WOW, a lot to look at here and very nice reporting I must say.
Have you decided to stay with one oil in particular?
One sample in particular(@ 50513 miles) seemed to hold up well also.
Will you be trying 9000 mile OCIs?

 

[The Critic]

Has it needed injectors yet?

 

[kschachn]

Perhaps I’m the only one but I wouldn’t trust any flash point (and subsequent fuel dilution estimate) from Blackstone. They have been shown to be consistently and sometimes wildly inaccurate.

 

[Slick3914]

Seems odd that you had better flashpoint numbers running Dexos 1 versus the more recent Euro L's..... in a dilution polluter like the 1.5 engine.

I enjoy reading your 4-5 comments per year Chinee, Show yourself a little more in 2024. Shoot for 10-15.
.... and thank you for buying your daughter a car. I did the buying cars for my kids. Now I'm doing the same for my three grandsons, as they eventually all turn 18.
Go Pennzoil too! I stuck with them for over 25 years...... until a few years ago. My HyunKia's started consuming SOPUS oils, so I switched. Now the consumption stuff has basically stopped.

What oil did you switch to?

 

[wemay]

Perhaps I’m the only one but I wouldn’t trust any flash point (and subsequent fuel dilution estimate) from Blackstone. They have been shown to be consistently and sometimes wildly inaccurate.

I tend to agree

 

[himemsys]

Now that you've run two straight instances of Euro L, the numbers are more representative due to the carryover being the same. When a different/thinner oil is carrying over from previous run, it skews the current results. Notice how the previous run the viscosity was only 10.01 and now it is 10.53? The 10.01 run was preceded by a much thinner oil, which skewed results. Also, compare Ca, Mg, P, and Zn. See how they seem less robust in the previous OCI? Also due to carryover from previous oil with lower values across the board.

So, now that we've run the same oil twice, the numbers are more representative of Euro L (which has a virgin viscosity of 11.9). The viscosity dropping almost 1.5 cSt tells me there is way more than 0.5% fuel in the oil. I agree with @kschachn about BS's flashpoint. It can still be looked at, but if you know the virgin viscosity, use that to compare to as a 2nd data point.

The TBN suggests a run of 12k is quite doable. Personally, I'd stick with Euro L for the rest of the car's life and do easy 10k OCIs.

edit: just checked your wear and it is averaging around 2ppm per 1000 mi for all wear metals in the last several OCIs. That just confirms to me that the fuel is not at a point where it is adversely affecting wear, so I think this is a rare instance where a fuel diluting vehicle does not need a shorter OCI. I suppose if the driving pattern changes (shorter trips, colder weather), then my comments wouldn't apply.

 

[chinee]

Now that you've run two straight instances of Euro L, the numbers are more representative due to the carryover being the same. When a different/thinner oil is carrying over from previous run, it skews the current results. Notice how the previous run the viscosity was only 10.01 and now it is 10.53? The 10.01 run was preceded by a much thinner oil, which skewed results. Also, compare Ca, Mg, P, and Zn. See how they seem less robust in the previous OCI? Also due to carryover from previous oil with lower values across the board.

So, now that we've run the same oil twice, the numbers are more representative of Euro L (which has a virgin viscosity of 11.9). The viscosity dropping almost 1.5 cSt tells me there is way more than 0.5% fuel in the oil. I agree with @kschachn about BS's flashpoint. It can still be looked at, but if you know the virgin viscosity, use that to compare to as a 2nd data point.

The TBN suggests a run of 12k is quite doable. Personally, I'd stick with Euro L for the rest of the car's life and do easy 10k OCIs.

edit: just checked your wear and it is averaging around 2ppm per 1000 mi for all wear metals in the last several OCIs. That just confirms to me that the fuel is not at a point where it is adversely affecting wear, so I think this is a rare instance where a fuel diluting vehicle does not need a shorter OCI. I suppose if the driving pattern changes (shorter trips, colder weather), then my comments wouldn't apply.

Going to try inching up to a longer OCI, probably to 9K then 10 and eventually 12K. It all depends on remembering to do so. The Civic averages anywhere from 1,300 to 2,000 miles per month... young folks haven't developed a pattern of life yet so I can't create a reminder to prompt me to change the oil. Planning to stick with Euro L for the next 2 OCIs.

WOW, a lot to look at here and very nice reporting I must say.
Have you decided to stay with one oil in particular?
One sample in particular(@ 50513 miles) seemed to hold up well also.
Will you be trying 9000 mile OCIs?

Bought another 5 gallon jug of the Euro L and together with the 2.5 gallons left over from this fill, I have another 2 Euro L changes to go. Goal is to extend the OCI. It will likely take another year and a half and 30k miles to finish using up the Euro L, at which point I'm thinking of switching to a HM synth blend or a Pennzoil dino. In an aging car, with lower value, I do not mind saving a few pennies here and there, so long as the new oils still perform.

Has it needed injectors yet?

Whoa... why would it need injectors? None of the cars I've owned in the past (most recently a 2002 Toyota Sequioa with 340K and Infiniti G35 with 276K) have needed injectors. Hopefully that trend won't change (knock on wood).

Perhaps I’m the only one but I wouldn’t trust any flash point (and subsequent fuel dilution estimate) from Blackstone. They have been shown to be consistently and sometimes wildly inaccurate.

I've read this about BS in other threads so I take the fuel dilution and flashpoint numbers with a grain of salt.

 

[fantastic]

There's good data on this BS report. I will ask about the 5/21/2022 sample looking like the Euro but you list a non Euro? The add pack is different from the rest. This report is excellent & I think the 10.5 Viscosity is quite good for the 7,400 miles you've put on it. A temperate climate such as FL is ideal for engines. Keep it up!

 

[FZ1]

You know, AFTER purchasing the Civic for my daughter, I found out that these Honda 1.5 turbo engines had fuel dilution issues... I thought this was the end of Honda reliability and I was going to have a major headache on my hand with this car. So I faithfully conducted UOAs, did a little research as to what might be the best oil for this engine, for the South Florida climate we inhabit and my daughter's not-too-aggressive driving style... and these UOAs have been boring.

So for those of you interested, or looking for a cure for your insomnia... here's the most recent UOA and a history of UOAs over the last 4 1/2 years.

View attachment 195141
View attachment 195142

Looks good. Vis is ok on all samples, net of the thinning. Good oci. Now I can sleep! Thanks man.

 

[VTECOverRated]

Fuel dilution is a known issue with the Honda GDI Turbo engines. As my own UOA's show.
The trick is quality oil and changing the oil on time before it falls to useless levels of viscosity.

 

[The Critic]

Whoa... why would it need injectors? None of the cars I've owned in the past (most recently a 2002 Toyota Sequioa with 340K and Infiniti G35 with 276K) have needed injectors. Hopefully that trend won't change (knock on wood).

GDI Injectors have been very problematic on the Honda 1.5T's....actually across the entire Honda line-up.

Also headgaskets on the 1.5T, though it seems to affect the Accord application more.

 

[CharBaby]

In an aging car where the value is getting lower & lower I would still stay with synthetic oils as the cost is minimal.

 

[chinee]

In an aging car where the value is getting lower & lower I would still stay with synthetic oils as the cost is minimal.

The cost savings is minimal (~$4 per 6-month period), actually lauhgable but experimenting with other oils can be interesting. So in truth, the cost savings may not be my primary motivator.

 

[MParr]

In an aging car where the value is getting lower & lower I would still stay with synthetic oils as the cost is minimal.

I agree. The Euro L oil comes at a decent price point.

 

[chinee]

GDI Injectors have been very problematic on the Honda 1.5T's....actually across the entire Honda line-up.

Also headgaskets on the 1.5T, though it seems to affect the Accord application more.

Good info to know. I'll be perusing those Honda forums to learn about this issue. Thanks!

 

[Triple_Se7en]

What oil did you switch to?

I'm guessing you cannot see our Signatures below our posts.

Amsoil Euro 0w30 (12.3cst) for the Kia MPI
50/50 Blend of Mobil-1 EP Triple Action 10w30 + Mobil-1 Euro 0w40 currently in the Hyundai GDI

 

[dbias]

Good info to know. I'll be perusing those Honda forums to learn about this issue. Thanks!

I have 126k miles on my 2016 Honda Civic Coupe with original injectors. CVT still works fine with three fluid changes in the books, next change due in the spring. Being in WV mine sees colder weather and is prone to rising levels on the dipstick. I just change oil every 5k and don’t look back.

 

[Danh]

Late response, but with the Euro L’s high calcium level it can’t be great at preventing LSPI. And it isn’t SN+ or SN, iirc. To my way of thinking this is a bad choice for a TGDI engine.