'13 Honda 3.5L replacement filter--my head hurts.

[Falken]

I always stick to the OEM factory filter for at least the first or second change.

That way, if you have a horribly defective engine they can't even attempt to blame the filter.

Then, when I have confidence that the engine runs well I stick to WIX, but wouldn't hesitate for a Purolator.

 

[Fission]

More and more of this flow over filtration tripe. I've got a Fram Tough Guard 7317 on my J35 (non-VCM) engine now, and there's no tick, no startup noise. Internally, it's nearly identical to the A02, except it's 99% efficient @ 20 microns (exceeding an efficiency metric that I set for myself when shopping for filters, but certainly not required in the slightest), vs. the 66.5% @ 20 microns of the A02 (according to Amsoil's test).

Use OEM or any name-brand aftermarket filter spec'd for your vehicle and rest easy.

 

[gregk24]

Originally Posted By: danthaman1980

Here's real bench data with hot oil. As you can see the delta-P (PSID) across the media isn't very much with hot oil.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...451#Post1619451


Exactly...with HOT oil. But when the oil is thicker and cold (when the engine actually wears), its a lot more restrictive. I like the Honda filters because everytime I start my car I know the oil is getting around my engine ASAP. The OEM filters are best for my 1 mile short trip driving. Not knocking the non OEM filters as there are many good ones out there, just not for my application.

 

[danthaman1980]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: danthaman1980
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Here's real bench data with hot oil. As you can see the delta-P (PSID) across the media isn't very much with hot oil.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...451#Post1619451


I've seen that thread before, and it still does not look like comparative bench test data on hot oil to me... all I see there is flow data for one filter with hot oil; it doesn't do much good if there aren't other filters in the test to comare it to.

Trust me, I really want to like the super high efficiency P1, but in my application I have not been satisfied. I keep going back to Wix/Napa Gold, K&N, and Mobil 1 (and AC Delco PF59, when I can find them).


Other good brand name oil filters will be within a few PSID over that flow range of that PureOne in the test. The difference in PSID will not be noticed by 99.9% of the engines.

And frankly, I don't really understand the KIA/Hyundai ticking engine issue ... the only conclusion I've come to is that their oil pumps are weak, and/or the people that have experience bad ticking have gotten some Chinese counterfeit filter made with recycled cardboard for media that is super restrictive, or something crazy like that.


I must be in that 0.1%... In the 9 years since I bought my truck, I've tried 2 P1s and one Puro-made Bosch Prem and all 3 gave me localized valvetrain noise... I get tired of it after a week or two, switch to a different filter, problem goes away.

I used P1s on my previous truck occasionally, and never had a problem (I was a poor college student back then, and a $6 filter was a luxury ; )

Maybe I'm mostly just ticked off that my truck doesn't like these things... I do want the best filtration possible, and wish there was some hard comparative data so I could test the second best filter and see if that works...

 

[JOD]

Originally Posted By: atoalson
Hey guys, I'll be picking up my ordered '13 Accord EX-L V6 in several weeks. I have looked at oil filter info till I'm blue in the face and my head hurts. I see synthetic media as well as cellulose. It seems that better filtration sacrifices flow.


Not necessarily. The synthetic filters offer better flow and excellent filtration. The literature from Donaldson does a good job of explaining it.

Will this make a difference to the functional life of the vehicle? Probably not, but if you want a "better" filter, a with a filter with synthetic media won't be sacrificing anything except some $$ from your wallet. Honda specs a fairly inefficient filter because it also spec's changing the filter every other change. I'm not sure I'd want to us a 99% efficient cellulose-media filter for 2 OLM oil changes. If I were in your shoes, I'd go with a full-synthetic media filter and change it every other change (actually, that's what I'm doing on my own car).

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: gregk24
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Here's real bench data with hot oil. As you can see the delta-P (PSID) across the media isn't very much with hot oil.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...451#Post1619451


Exactly...with HOT oil. But when the oil is thicker and cold (when the engine actually wears), its a lot more restrictive.


Not really ... because with a positive displacement oil pump the engine still gets all the oil coming out of the oil pump if the pump isn't in pressure relief. On cold starts, if you keep the engine revs down, the pump will not build enough pressure to hit relief - so the engine is still getting all the oil volume it would if the engine was hot. On the other hand, the filter MAY go into bypass if the oil is pretty thick and the revs are up some.

What keeps the wear down on cold starts is using a full synthetic oil that will flow easily when cold.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: danthaman1980
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix

And frankly, I don't really understand the KIA/Hyundai ticking engine issue ... the only conclusion I've come to is that their oil pumps are weak, and/or the people that have experience bad ticking have gotten some Chinese counterfeit filter made with recycled cardboard for media that is super restrictive, or something crazy like that.


I must be in that 0.1%... In the 9 years since I bought my truck, I've tried 2 P1s and one Puro-made Bosch Prem and all 3 gave me localized valvetrain noise... I get tired of it after a week or two, switch to a different filter, problem goes away.


It's so strange that some engines tick with certain filters and not others. Are you talking just ticking on a cold start and then the tick goes away in a few seconds, or are you talking about the engine ticking all the time?

I have never owned a vehicle that ticks on cold start-up or any time for that matter. Not even after doing a start-up after an oil change and the whole oil gallery system and new filter are dry.

 

[Sayjac]

I've used many different oil filters on my Hondas, including many P1 PL14610's, and never once experienced any difference in start up noise/engine noise in that time. And I've used the dealer installed Fram made Honda rock catcher when vehicle was new, and when there was a oil/filter change special.

Also used a 99.9% rated Bosch Distance Plus to 13.5k mi. over two oci's as shown in the link. https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/bosch-dist-plus-3323-2ocis-13-5k-mi-pics.189844/

Bottom line, most any silicone adbv oil filter should easily handle a 5-15% MM oci. I've yet to see any scientific study or empirical data showing oil filter flow to be anything other than an insignificant consideration 'in pc use'. And I don't buy that Honda knows more about oil filters than the aftermarket oil filter makers of the high quality filters. My anecdotal oil filter experience on Hondas has done nothing to dissuade me from that thought.

 

[JethroBodine]

Originally Posted By: atoalson
Hey guys, I'll be picking up my ordered '13 Accord EX-L V6 in several weeks. I have looked at oil filter info till I'm blue in the face and my head hurts. I see synthetic media as well as cellulose. It seems that better filtration sacrifices flow. Better flow lets biggger particulates thru the filter. I'm need help divulging all this info, I kinda like the way the WIX XP/Napa Platinum sound but cant find any real data for them. The Purolator PureOne and Synthetic also peeked my interest as well as the Mobil 1 filter.

Can you guys pull me out of this state of confusion and get me on the right track. I want to pick a oil/filter combo and stick with it.


OEM filter and DO NOT change the factory fill for at least 5000 miles in a Honda.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: JethroBodine
OEM filter and DO NOT change the factory fill for at least 5000 miles in a Honda.


Why? ... special juice in the factory fill?

 

[OriginHacker21]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: JethroBodine
OEM filter and DO NOT change the factory fill for at least 5000 miles in a Honda.


Why? ... special juice in the factory fill?


Honda's Factory Fill contains a [censored] load of molybdenum from the assembly lube that the manufacturer wants coating the entire engine. They recommend running a full OCI on the factory fill for this reason. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[atoalson]

I have heard many times the same exact thing.

 

[Sayjac]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Quote:
OEM filter and DO NOT change the factory fill for at least 5000 miles in a Honda.

Why? ... special juice in the factory fill?

As mentioned the FF is shown to be high in moly combined with the high moly asssembly lube. That and if you buy a Honda you must drink the Honda kool-aide or your engine and automatic transmission will fail early. OOP's, forget the latter as that didn't work so well for early to mid 2000 Accord AT's especially the V6's, and the 01 Civic AT's.

And, no Honda engine ever lasted after changing the FF early or before 15%MM and/or using other than the oem rock catcher oil filters.