05 Acura TSX 6spd/ 60000mi factory Honda MTF

[thomas3524]

Hi everyone, its my first post here. Great site with lots good info.

I started to notice a bearing noise from the transmission when cold and clutch engaged, but goes away when clutch is pressed in. I think it the input shaft bearing but dealers deny it as it is still under warrenty. Its nothing that hurts operation, just a noise at idle. Anyway, I got the trans fluid analyzed when I changed it at 60000mi, which is the recomended intervel. Here is the data. The aluminum reads high according to the lab, they classified it as abnormal, but not severe:

Lab: Wear Check Canada, Mississauga Ontario
Car: 2005 Acura TSX 6spd manual
Fluid: Factory Honda MTF 60000mi/3 years (never changed previously)

A bit of info about the driving. This car is driven moderately hard, but not excessive, maybe a 6-7 out of 10 average. I am easy on the transmission meaning no crazy downshifts and always rev-match when if i do. About 2/3 highway driving.

(All numbers in ppm)

silicon 34
potassium 0.6
water(%) dirt, debris, precipitate None

white metal light
babbit None
iron 147
nickel 1.4
chromium 2.2
titanium 0.1
copper 74
aluminum ***42
tin 4.9
lead 18
silver 0.2

boron 3.5
barium 16
calcium 2561
magnesium 800
molybdenum 1.9
sodium 8.7
phosphorus 1084
sulfer 4284
zinc 1167

visc@40C 35.1


The lab has aluminum catagorized as "abnormal" at 25ppm and "severe" at 75. So the reading is not severe but still above normal. What do you guys think, Could it be a bearing? Thanks for any feedback, much appreciated.

 

[unDummy]

Looks good. Practice a more frequent 30k interval to remove the wear floating around the fluid. 281ppm total wear isn't bad for 60k miles which is a result of your driving style.

Many transmissions develop minor noises that do not affect the longevity or function of the transmission. Its just simple wear/tear over the mileage/time. A more aggressive maintenance interval can sometimes prevent those issues.

Visc at 100c would've been interesting.

Is the noise any better/worse withe the new fluid? What new fluid was used?

 

[Steve S]

Try another dealer, call honda factory rep.

 

[BarkerMan]

Steve S +1

If the dealer went to the training course he knows the difference between an automatic and a stick-shift and can tell you which is whick after only a short test drive. If he came up through the ranks as opposed to being the nephew of the owner he can tell the difference by just counting the pedals. You need to get another sample off to a different lab, get a note book and start going up through the chain-of-command to get answers. Your first answer will be, "that's normal for this car". Noise at 60k miles is not normal. Noise at 100k can be normal because roller or needle bearings wear and start talking to you no matter what the lube or intervals or kind of oil you use beause they are contact bearing. Keep us posted on your quest for truth.

 

[Palut]

My fiancee has a '97 Civic on which the input shaft bearings were shot. It had the same symptoms your TSX does, noise when the clutch is engaged and in neutral which goes away when the clutch is disengaged. Over time the noise gradually got louder and louder and the shifting became rougher and rougher.

She had it fixed last week and it's like a new car. Shifting is vastly improved (I drive it too, so I have direct experience). Even when sitting in the passenger seat the car feels better, like a totally different car.

Get your dealer (or another one) to fix it, if you don't it will eventually destroy your transmission.



P.S. Consider reporting the lousy dealer to corporate if they don't take care of you. One of my coworkers was being abused by his dealer, and he didn't know what to do. I told me to report them, he did, and now they kiss his feet when he walks in!

 

[MolaKule]

Most likely the noise is the clutch throw-out bearing since you stated the noise was present only when engaged.

The Fe levels are not too bad for 60k, but I would certainly change fluids from now on no later with OCI's no longer than 30k.

The aluminum is from the case, maybe from acids. Too bad we don't have TAN number.

I would recommend the Nissan 75W85 or the Amsoil MTF for synchromesh transmissions.

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: MolaKule
but I would certainly change fluids from now on no later with OCI's no longer than 30k.

Why?

 

[unDummy]

Why not?

Total suspended wear is high.
Visc @100 and TAN are unknown.
Tranny has developed a noise.
Vehicle is driven moderately hard.

How much do you need to adapt a more aggressive maintenance program? is 30k too difficult?

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: unDummy
Why not?

Total suspended wear is high.
Visc @100 and TAN are unknown.
Tranny has developed a noise.
Vehicle is driven moderately hard.

How much do you need to adapt a more aggressive maintenance program? is 30k too difficult?


Yes.

There is only one fluid sample and it doesn't tell much, aside from the fact that the transmission isn't about to explode.

The cause of the noise is unknown. Don't be so quick to blame everything on the fluid.

 

[JSRT4]

for years Honda always recommended changing manual tranny fluid once per year or 24,000 kms. Then the manufacturers got concerned about statistics on lowest cost of ownership within the first five years (or some time frame like that). Honda then re-vamped all of their maintenance recommendations and extended things further out in terms of mileage/time. Hondas used to be very expensive to maintain on a yearly basis as they had lots of recommended maintenance items, but they were bulletproof and rarely broke because of that. I'm not so sure that still applies to them though, I think this lowest cost of ownership statistic is causing some higher parts failures further down the road. I still change my tranny fluid once per year, it's cheap maintenance. I don't believe the parts suddenly got better, I believe the manufacturer extended service levels to help sell more new cars in order to compete with less expensive rivals. I've owned 7 Hondas/Acuras since 1992 and I've been able to see the major changes in their maintenance schedule over that period of time.