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#2419168 - 10/28/11 08:02 PM Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE
barlowc Offline


Registered: 03/16/09
Posts: 2065
Loc: Southeast Michigan
This is the second UOA I've had done for my 2008 Nissan Altima Coupe 2.5 S. (The first one can be found here .) It has the 4-cylinder QR25DE engine and a CVT transmission. This car is my daily driver, driven about 70% highway and 30% city.

Some history… The factory fill came out at 4K miles. It was followed by two 6K mile intervals using Valvoline SynPower 5W-30 and then two 6K mile intervals using Castrol Edge 5W-30. (That was Edge when it was simply known as “Edge”, before Castrol changed their lineup to Edge w/ Syntec and Edge w/ Titanium.) The UOA done (on Edge) at 28K looked good so I decided to try 7,500 miles. This sample of Pennzoil Ultra 5W-30 was the second consecutive fill of Ultra run for that interval. There shouldn't be any mixing or cross-contamination issues affecting the results.



RE: their comments about the sample, I'd let them know that I messed up a bit while taking the sample. I only filled the container about one-third of the way when it was streaming out of the vehicle’s oil pan. I then saw the sampling procedure page on their web site and realized that I needed to fill the container. So using a clean, disposable paper cup I scooped the rest from the drain pan.

RE: their comment about the K&N filter, I'd mentioned to them that I installed a K&N filter immediately upon getting the vehicle home from the dealer, when only 56 miles were on the odometer. I haven’t cleaned/re-oiled it yet. I’ll probably do that at 50K miles. Since a lot of folks on here talk bad about K&N air filters and how UOAs often show high silicon particle counts and other signs of poor filtration, I asked them if there were any signs of less than great air filtration.

Some observations...
  • I wonder why Boron is so high in this sample. It's much higher than both my previous sample and the universal average.
  • I wonder why Magnesium, in both samples, is so much lower than the universal average.
  • Ultra didn't seem to shear as much as Edge.
  • I used the same kind of oil filter in both samples; a DENSO 150-1010. I wonder if the increase in insolubles is from the longer OCI or if dust that was likely in the oil pan caused the slight increase.

Upon draining the fill of Ultra from which this sample was taken, Green Earth Technologies G-OIL 5W-30 went in. Given that it is a relatively new and unproven oil (i.e. there are only a couple UOAs posted on here thus far), I am hesitant to let it go 7,500 miles, even though it is a Group IV synthetic. I might go back to 6K mile intervals, sample after the second, and then consider extending my interval from there, informed by the UOA. Do you guys have any thoughts on that? Am I being too conservative?
_________________________
2013 Cadillac ATS
- 2.0T RWD 6AT, 39K Miles
- Dealer Fill (5W-30 dexos1) w/ OE Filter

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#2419176 - 10/28/11 08:07 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
Towncivilian Offline


Registered: 01/07/11
Posts: 918
Loc: Florida, USA
Thanks for this UOA! I have PU 5W-30 + M1-110 in my mom's '07 Altima QR25 and was planning to run it for 7.5k. Though she drives 100% city, I'm still confident that PU (and the M1 filter) is up to the task.

A VOA of PU 5W-20 shows quite a lot of Boron and not much Magnesium, FWIW.
_________________________
2001.5 Pathfinder SE 3.5L A/T 2WD - ML NG 5W-30/PL14610
2007 Altima S - PU 5W-30/M1-110
2009 G5 - PU 5W-30/XG9018
2012 G37 S - ST 5W-30/PL14612

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#2419183 - 10/28/11 08:10 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
mongo161 Offline


Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 3463
Loc: Coney Island, NY
Looks great and thanks for your post. Boron, as I understand, is a detergent and/or anti-wear additive. Magnesium is also used for anti-wear in the add packs.

Your run with PU shows great results with the 4 banger Nissan Altima.

Thanks again for sharing....

Cheers!
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#2419219 - 10/28/11 09:09 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
Donald Offline


Registered: 03/21/04
Posts: 15594
Loc: Upstate NY
Nice UOA. I have PU in my Jeep now.

Why did you pull a new paper media filter and replace it with a K&N? Amsoil use to sell similar filters and discontinued them. The oil needs to be somewhat right when its cleaned and re-oiled. Not enough and the air will not be properly cleaned, too much and it can blow off onto the MAF and cause major problems.

I think oiled foam is good for pre-filters on equipment used in dusty areas, but thats about it.
_________________________
2015 Subaru Forester 2.5 engine/CVT PP & M1
2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 4.0 - PP & M1
1999 Dodge Ram 2500 w/Cummins - Rotella T6 & M1


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#2419232 - 10/28/11 09:23 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
JAG Offline


Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 4550
Loc: Fredericksburg, VA
Ultra uses a lot of boron as part of the additive package for seal and copper corrosion protection. The magnesium is not lower than universal averages. Anyhow, it comes along with the calcium as part of the detergent package. Universal averages are pretty much useless. The Edge you used had a lower virgin viscosity Ultra did. Insolubles probably increased due to the longer OCI and it can vary by 0.1 easily anyway. Nice UOA!

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#2419263 - 10/28/11 10:14 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
ltslimjim Offline


Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 5487
Loc: WatUpDoc
Some thoughts:

Yes, Boron is from Ultra's formulation.

Insols went up, could indicate some cleaning? If insols don't go back down, consider using a high-end oil filter for a couple OCIs. EaO/RP/M1/BD+/K&N/NP etc, all good choices.

Great to see Silicon where it's at for over 7,000 miles. That's less than 2 ppm/1,000 miles(a general rule of thumb I go by)...

Lastly, I'd only go UP TO 5,000 miles on G-OIL.
_________________________
92 Civic Hatch (stolen frown RIP)
07 Honda Fit Sport (A/T) WELCOME thumbsup

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#2421163 - 10/31/11 07:13 AM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
pcfxer Offline


Registered: 10/21/09
Posts: 391
Loc: Canada
Wow looks great! I'm hoping the High Output version of this motor wears just as well. I just dumped my second fill of XL at 4200kms (8 months) to appease the dealership; don't worry I'll use a UOA to win them over.

You could always get a UOA done at the 5000 mile mark and see what they say as well as getting another at the end of the interval. You'd probably only want to do that if you wanted to run Green Earth oil for a while.
_________________________
2011 Daytona Blue Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec-V
1100km Amsoil Dominator Coolant Boost
8200km Amsoil XLF + Royal Purple Oil Filter

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#2421346 - 10/31/11 11:43 AM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
buster Offline


Registered: 11/16/02
Posts: 29604
Loc: NJ
Impressive report!!
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#2423608 - 11/02/11 08:31 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: buster]
barlowc Offline


Registered: 03/16/09
Posts: 2065
Loc: Southeast Michigan
Originally Posted By: Donald
Why did you pull a new paper media filter and replace it with a K&N?

I didn't know any better at the time. I did it in 06/2008 and joined BITOG in 03/2009. I ran K&N filters on the two GM 3800 engines I had prior to buying this car, had no problems with them, and bought in to the marketing. Today, of course, I'd make a different decision. But with there not being any signs of poor filtration, it doesn't make sense to me to change anything right now. I'm running a K&N on our Saturn too, which will hit 50K shortly. That's the interval I've always cleaned my K&N filters, so I'll probably pull it, clean it, and inspect it carefully. If I see anything that concerns me, it'll go in the garbage and I'll drop a good paper filter in.

Originally Posted By: JAG
The Edge you used had a lower virgin viscosity Ultra did.

True. According to my notes, Edge was 9.8 @ 100* and 54.17 @ 40*. Ultra was 10.3 @ 100* and 57.5* at 40*. But doing the math, Ultra still stayed closer to the virgin viscosity specs.

Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
I'd only go UP TO 5,000 miles on G-OIL.

How come? The two UOAs that I've seen posted so far had pretty good results. And one of them was a high-mileage Volvo turbo.

G-Oil 5w30, 2005 Ford Explorer 4.0 5k
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2361448

G.E.T. G 5w30, 10,053 miles, 96 Volvo 850 Turbo
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2303865

The only thing that stands out to me is some apparent shearing. According to its MSDS, it specs 10.4 @ 100* and 59.0* at 40*.
_________________________
2013 Cadillac ATS
- 2.0T RWD 6AT, 39K Miles
- Dealer Fill (5W-30 dexos1) w/ OE Filter

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#2423621 - 11/02/11 08:40 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
ltslimjim Offline


Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 5487
Loc: WatUpDoc
^Shearing and TBN retention. 5,000 from G-OIL, if you got it free especially, is about what it's value is. 6,000-7,500 would be my max range unless all highway, super easy on oil vehicle.
_________________________
92 Civic Hatch (stolen frown RIP)
07 Honda Fit Sport (A/T) WELCOME thumbsup

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#2423738 - 11/02/11 11:27 PM Re: Pennzoil Ultra 5W30 - 7500 Mile - 08 Nissan QR25DE [Re: barlowc]
HTSS_TR Online   content


Registered: 04/17/06
Posts: 15615
Loc: Lake Forest, CA
Originally Posted By: barlowc
I'm running a K&N on our Saturn too, which will hit 50K shortly. That's the interval I've always cleaned my K&N filters, so I'll probably pull it, clean it, and inspect it carefully. If I see anything that concerns me, it'll go in the garbage and I'll drop a good paper filter in.

Put it on Craigslist or eBay, you may get $20-25 bucks for it. A cleaned and oiled K&N filter is easy to sell.
_________________________
'94 Lexus LS400
'00 MB E430
'04 Honda S2000
'06 Volvo V70
"Throwing food away is like stealing it from the poor and hungry" Pope Francis

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