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#2093203 - 12/02/10 12:50 PM Oil for a Detroit Diesel
Mokanic Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 1563
Loc: North Carolina, USA
Is the Detroit V-8 in an old Silver Eagle bus a 2-stroke? If so, is Delo 40 the oil to use?

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#2093211 - 12/02/10 12:53 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10416
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
Originally Posted By: Mokanic
Is the Detroit V-8 in an old Silver Eagle bus a 2-stroke? If so, is Delo 40 the oil to use?



http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1193393
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

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#2093250 - 12/02/10 01:39 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
SteveSRT8 Online   content


Registered: 10/10/08
Posts: 13642
Loc: Sunny Florida
OMG, I just LOVE the old Detroit diesels!
_________________________
"In a democracy, dissent is an act of faith."
J. William Fulbright
Best ET-12.79 @ 111 mph
4340 pounds, Street tires
Just like we go to Publix

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#2093253 - 12/02/10 01:41 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 10575
Loc: apple valley, ca
These engines need to be ran at near maximum rpm. Run them at too low of an rpm and the bearings will get pounded and the liners will rattle out.

The proper way to drive them is to smash your thumb in the door and drive it like your mad.
_________________________
02 Jeep Wrangler QS 5w30
87 F250 Diesel Delvac 15w40
04 Tahoe STHM 10w30
Z400 napa 15w50
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer Polaris 5w50

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#2093281 - 12/02/10 02:05 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
Steve S Offline


Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18449
Loc: East of IGO
Delo 100 straight 40. What is the output 430 hp or 360hp? The 360 hp is governed at if I remember 1900 ish rpm and the 430 hp 2300 ish rpm. Lots of low end and if driven properly they get good mpgs all things considered. The marine versions are cranked up and put out serious HP.


































_________________________
Why do people post I want the best for my car,,, When there isn't anything that is the best on the car to begin with.

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#2093331 - 12/02/10 02:45 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Steve S]
maineiac Offline


Registered: 12/09/06
Posts: 9
Loc: United States
I've taken the liberty of copying/pasting this:

Detroit Diesel Allison® Lube Oil Recommendations for

Detroit Diesel® 2-Cycle Engines
DDC publication 6SA314 8901
Function of Lubricating Oils
All diesel engines require heavy duty lubricating oils. Basic requirements of such oils are:
Lubricating quality
High heat resistance
Control of contaminants
Lubricating Quality
The reduction of friction and wear by maintaining an oil film between moving parts is the primary requisite of a lubricant. Film thickness and its ability to prevent metal-to-metal contact of moving parts is related to oil viscosity. The optimums for Detroit Diesel® two-cycle engines are SAE 40 grade oils.

High Heat Resistance
Temperature is the most important factor in determining the rate at which deterioration or oxidation of the lubricating oil will occur. The oil should have adequate thermal stability at elevated temperatures, thereby precluding formation of harmful carbonaceous and/or ash deposits.

Control of Contaminants
The piston and compression rings must ride on a film of oil to minimize wear and prevent cylinder seizure. At normal rates of consumption, oil reaches a temperature zone at the upper part of the piston where rapid oxidation and carbonization can occur. In addition, as oil circulates through the engine, it is continuously contaminated by soot, acids, and water originating from combustion. Until they are exhausted, detergent and dispersant additives aid in keeping sludge and varnish from depositing on engine parts. But such additives in excessive quantities can result in detrimental ash deposits. If abnormal ash deposits form on the exhaust valve seats, early engine failure may result. Oil that is carried up the cylinder liner wall is normally consumed during engine operation. The oil and additives leave carbonaceous and/or ash deposits when subjected to the elevated temperatures of the combustion chamber. The amount of deposits is influenced by the composition, additive content, engine temperature, and oil consumption rate.

Oil Quality
Oil quality is the responsibility of the oil supplier. (The term "oil supplier" is applicable to refiners, blenders, and re branders of petroleum products). Oil quality can also be affected by handling cleanliness, contamination, dirt, water, etc.

Lubricant Recommendation for Detroit Diesel® Two-Cycle Engines
SAE Viscosity Grade 40
API Classification: CD-II, (Note: CD-II is an obsolete designation replaced by the current API Rating CF-2)
Military Spec: MIL-L-2104D
Sulfated Ash: Less than 1.0%


Sulfated
Ash Rate

Comparison
Chart

Updated 08/30/06 Chevron Delo 100 40 WT = 0.76 (24% BELOW benchmark)

Exxon XD-3 40 WT = 0.80

Citgo Mystik Premium (Citgo is owned by Venezuela)
Fleet Engine Oil 40 WT = 0.90 CLICK here for History of Citgo

Shell Rotella 40T 40 WT = 1.00 (Shell Rotella 40T is borderline)

Delo 400 40 WT = 1.35 (35% OUT of TOLERANCE)
This is the only engine oil recommended for Detroit Diesel® two-cycle engines. Lubricants meeting these criteria have provided maximum engine life when used in conjunction with recommended oil drain and filter maintenance schedules. (For additional oil selection criteria, see publication 7SE270.) The API category CD-II (CF-2)(Note: CD-II is an obsolete designation replaced by the current API Rating CF-2) is relatively new and may not be fully in use at the time of this publication. (NOTE: This publication was published in 1989) API category CD may be used provided the recommended military specification is satisfied. Oils with API designation "CE" are not recommended in DDC two-cycle engines unless accompanied by CD-II (CF-2) (Note: CD-II is an obsolete designation replaced by the current API Rating CF-2)

Single Grade-High Ash Content Lube Oils
High ash oils (greater than 1,000 mass % ASTM D-874) tend to form excessive deposits on engine parts, resulting in impairment of their function (exhaust valve closure, for example). These are NOT recommended, except where the continuous use of high sulfur content diesel fuels (greater than 0.5 mass %) is unavoidable and where a high TBN, LOW ASH oil is not available.

Multi-Vis Oils
Less than optimum engine life must be expected when using 15w-40 oils. Multi-vis oils tend to break down due to mechanical and thermal stress which results in a loss of viscosity and premature engine wear. Multi-vis oils do help cranking when temperatures are below 32 degrees F (0 degrees C). However, once the engine starts, the major advantage of the multi-vis oils is exhausted. When the engine reaches operating temperature, the internal engine temperatures and pressures vary little from an engine operating in much warmer climates. This is when the 2 cycle engine benefits from the superior protection of a 40 wt.

Starting aids such as automatic ether systems and /or on-board auxiliary heaters provide more reliable starting without sacrificing engine life.

Engine Parts Can Tell The Difference in Oils
The following oil performance parameters should be compared:

Ring Sticking tendencies and/or ring conditions
Piston skirt scuffing and cylinder liner wear and scuffing
Exhaust valve face and seat deposits
Piston pin and slipper bushing wear
Overall valve train and bearing wear levels
Shown are several component comparisons taken after a lube oil performance test.


Click on image for enlarged photo


Special Bulletin!
Re:
Scarcity of Availability
of
Straight 40 WT. Oils Information is now posted in at TEJAS OIL.

Instructions where to find Locations with MAP & PHONE links.
A word of Caution
There are hundreds of commercial crankcase oils marketed today. Obviously, engine manufacturers or users cannot completely evaluate the numerous commercial oils. The selection of a suitable lubricant in consultation with a reliable oil supplier and observance of his oil drain recommendations (based on used oil samples analysis and experience), and provide filter maintenance, will provide the best assurance of satisfactory oil performance.

It should be noted that lube oil manufactures may reformulate and oil while maintaining the American Petroleum Institute classification, or may reformulate to a new API classification and continue the brand name designation. For example, SE oils being reformulated to SF letter code classification may perform differently after this reformulation. A close working relationship with the lube oil manufacturer should be maintained so that any reformulation can be reviewed and a decision made as to its effect on continued satisfactory performance.

Detroit Diesel® Used Lube Oil Analysis Program
The Detroit Diesel® lube oil analysis program is recommended for monitoring the condition of the crankcase oil in all engines.

Primarily, used lube oil analyses indicate the condition of the oil but not necessarily the condition of the engine. Never tear down an engine based solely on the analysis results obtained from a single used oil sample. However, the condition of the engine should be investigated using conventional mechanical and/or electronic diagnostic instruments. Frequently, visual inspections are all that is required to detect problem areas related to engine wear. It is also prudent to obtain another oil sample from the suspected distressed unit for analysis.

Abnormal concentrations of some contaminants such as diesel fuel, coolant, road salt, or airborne dirt cannot be tolerated for prolonged periods. Their presence will be reflected in accelerated engine wear, which can result in less than optimum engine life. The oil should be changed immediately if any contamination is present in concentrations exceeding the warning limits.

6SA314 8901

To view the API complete listing of oils that meet the classification of 40 wt. and CF-2 click on the following link:
API Oil Classification

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#2093359 - 12/02/10 03:10 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Steve S]
Mokanic Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 1563
Loc: North Carolina, USA
It's in an old Silver Eagle bus. A friend has purchased the thing and asked me to help with oil changes. Delo 100 seems to be what most advise to run in it. I wonder how many gallons of oil the thing holds.

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#2093442 - 12/02/10 04:19 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
Ken2 Offline


Registered: 12/02/02
Posts: 5922
Loc: Washington St.
Chevron Delo 100 is a very good choice, but it doesn't have to be Delo. Any diesel engine oil rated CF-2, probably 40 wt, is the right oil.
_________________________
Every gun that is made, every warship launched..a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Gen. Eisenhower


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#2093640 - 12/02/10 07:54 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
roadrunner1 Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 742
Loc: oh
just remember whatever the spec it must end in "2". this specifies 2 stroke.
I now wear hearing aids, partially attributed to too many years listening to a 671 "sing"
_________________________
'07 f350 6.0

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#2093651 - 12/02/10 08:06 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: roadrunner1]
daman Offline


Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 10416
Loc: Bad Axe, MI
Originally Posted By: roadrunner1
just remember whatever the spec it must end in "2". this specifies 2 stroke.
I now wear hearing aids, partially attributed to too many years listening to a 671 "sing"

Huh whad ya say?? smile
_________________________
"Always"....Mobil 1

Current fill: AFE 0w30

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#2096275 - 12/05/10 01:09 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 10575
Loc: apple valley, ca
Originally Posted By: Mokanic
It's in an old Silver Eagle bus. A friend has purchased the thing and asked me to help with oil changes. Delo 100 seems to be what most advise to run in it. I wonder how many gallons of oil the thing holds.
I'd guess around 8
_________________________
02 Jeep Wrangler QS 5w30
87 F250 Diesel Delvac 15w40
04 Tahoe STHM 10w30
Z400 napa 15w50
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer Polaris 5w50

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#2096733 - 12/05/10 07:24 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Mokanic]
440Magnum Offline


Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5758
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Mokanic
It's in an old Silver Eagle bus. A friend has purchased the thing and asked me to help with oil changes. Delo 100 seems to be what most advise to run in it. I wonder how many gallons of oil the thing holds.


The better question is how many gallons it burns. Detroit 2-strokes love to drink oil. In generator sets its not too unusual to see a detroit burn through 5 or more gallons in a 24 hour run. I'm sure it would be less in something like a bus, but they still consume much more oil than 4-strokes do. Just the nature of the fact that only 1 oil control ring separates the inlet port from the crankcase when the piston is at the top part of its travel. Oil slobbers into the intake ports, then when the piston comes back down it gets blasted into the combustion chamber along with the air coming in from the blower.

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#2096885 - 12/05/10 10:14 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: roadrunner1]
Steve S Offline


Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18449
Loc: East of IGO
Originally Posted By: roadrunner1
just remember whatever the spec it must end in "2". this specifies 2 stroke.
I now wear hearing aids, partially attributed to too many years listening to a 671 "sing"
thumbsup I am there as well
_________________________
Why do people post I want the best for my car,,, When there isn't anything that is the best on the car to begin with.

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#2096891 - 12/05/10 10:24 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: 440Magnum]
Steve S Offline


Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 18449
Loc: East of IGO
Hayward Calif. to Los Angles Calif area about a gallon of oil with the 71 series engines in the freight trucks. The 92 series 6v or 8v engines reguardless of power output use way less oil I have done it enough to remember. The 92 series were really nice engines to drive tons of low end power great mpgs and they were real quiet to operate due to having the a turbo allowed a reduction in the blower RPMs. During that time I would have bought a Cummins though.
_________________________
Why do people post I want the best for my car,,, When there isn't anything that is the best on the car to begin with.

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#2099693 - 12/08/10 04:19 PM Re: Oil for a Detroit Diesel [Re: Steve S]
AITG Offline


Registered: 12/22/06
Posts: 290
Loc: USA
Be sure you pay attention to meeting the oil spec - particularly sulfated ash content.

I worked for a fleet of 100 8V-71s, 6-71s and 6V-92s where a salesman talked the manager into trying 15W-40 oil ... with an unacceptable ash level. Things went well for about six months. Then we found out that exhaust valve deposits resulted in valves burning.

We suggested to the boss that we start putting the heads on with Velcro to save time. He failed to see the humor in that.

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