Honda is having a hard time competing in F1

[sirgerman]

Well for those who dont not follow F1, Honda is dead last in F1 with their latest hybrid engine, they dont have the personnel, technology or even the capital to compete with Mercedes, Ferrari and even Renault, as a Honda fan I am sad that they have the worst engine in F1 right now.

 

[Bud_One]

At least they're finishing races... last year was a disaster.
They'll get there.

 

[IndyIan]

Originally Posted By: sirgerman
Well for those who dont not follow F1, Honda is dead last in F1 with their latest hybrid engine, they dont have the personnel, technology or even the capital to compete with Mercedes, Ferrari and even Renault, as a Honda fan I am sad that they have the worst engine in F1 right now.

They did get 10th last race with a total rookie... With button or Alonso in that car it's likely they wouldve got a few more points.
Atleast they are competing, most manufacturers don't have guts to even try.

 

[sirgerman]

Well they still the suck, they are worst than Renault

 

[benjamming]

We're only 2 races into the season. Give it some more time to see where they are say around Monaco.

 

[CT8]

F1 is just plain too strange for me.

 

[HTSS_TR]

It may take them few years to be competitive, let say 2017 or 2018.

 

[Garak]

Be patient. I expected them to be having this much trouble. We'll see this year. The recovery was their big issue, not the ICE itself. It's not as bad as all that. Red Bull would have rather been running a Honda this year than a Renault. Ron Dennis simply vetoed that idea.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted By: CT8
F1 is just plain too strange for me.


It sure seems to be getting that way, doesn't it? Leave it to Europeans. They could over complicate a cup of coffee.

 

[A_Harman]

I have my doubts. Honda isn't the Honda of the 1.5L turbo era or 3.5L V10/V12 era. They weren't competitive the last time they were in F1. Maybe all the people that could produce innovative technology within the accelerated timing that racing demands have retired.

The engine that I'm wondering about is the TAG-badged Renault. I read someplace that Mario Ilien redesigned the top half of the engine, so maybe he came up with something in the heads or heat recovery system. Red Bull has not been embarrassed on the straightaways so far this year. They'll always have a good chassis, and would be competitive if they could get close on power.

 

[BikeWhisperer]

Originally Posted By: sirgerman
Well they still the suck, they are worst than Renault


According to Mercedes the 2015 Ferarri in the back of the STR is the lowest powered unit in F1 right now.

http://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/15138570/mercedes-data-shows-toro-rosso-least-powerful-engine-f1

Shows how good that STR chassis and their young drivers are.

 

[supercity]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman


The engine that I'm wondering about is the TAG-badged Renault. I read someplace that Mario Ilien redesigned the top half of the engine, so maybe he came up with something in the heads or heat recovery system. Red Bull has not been embarrassed on the straightaways so far this year. They'll always have a good chassis, and would be competitive if they could get close on power.


Renault are working with Ilmor, not just Red Bull/Tag Heuer, they have made a big step forward. Honda have made an even larger step forward and they still say they have compromised max power/compressor size for better packaging for aero efficiency.

 

[A_Harman]

Originally Posted By: supercity
Originally Posted By: A_Harman


The engine that I'm wondering about is the TAG-badged Renault. I read someplace that Mario Ilien redesigned the top half of the engine, so maybe he came up with something in the heads or heat recovery system. Red Bull has not been embarrassed on the straightaways so far this year. They'll always have a good chassis, and would be competitive if they could get close on power.


Renault are working with Ilmor, not just Red Bull/Tag Heuer, they have made a big step forward. Honda have made an even larger step forward and they still say they have compromised max power/compressor size for better packaging for aero efficiency.


Yes, Mario Ilien is the IL of Ilmor. TAG is paying the bills. I'm speculating that Renault still builds the shortblocks, but puts Ilmor spec pistons in them to match the valve angles/combustion chamber design of the Ilmor heads.

Based on the results of the Chinese Grand Prix, Red Bull now has one of the most powerful engines out there. Kvyat and Ricciardo were definitely factors throughout the race yesterday, finishing 3rd and 4th. Meanwhile, Button and Alonso finished 12th and 13th with the "improved" Honda. Honda still has much work to do.

 

[whip]

Originally Posted By: sirgerman
Well they still the suck, they are worst than Renault

Do you still believe that after the Chinese GP?

 

[BikeWhisperer]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: supercity
Originally Posted By: A_Harman


The engine that I'm wondering about is the TAG-badged Renault. I read someplace that Mario Ilien redesigned the top half of the engine, so maybe he came up with something in the heads or heat recovery system. Red Bull has not been embarrassed on the straightaways so far this year. They'll always have a good chassis, and would be competitive if they could get close on power.


Renault are working with Ilmor, not just Red Bull/Tag Heuer, they have made a big step forward. Honda have made an even larger step forward and they still say they have compromised max power/compressor size for better packaging for aero efficiency.


Yes, Mario Ilien is the IL of Ilmor. TAG is paying the bills. I'm speculating that Renault still builds the shortblocks, but puts Ilmor spec pistons in them to match the valve angles/combustion chamber design of the Ilmor heads.

Based on the results of the Chinese Grand Prix, Red Bull now has one of the most powerful engines out there. Kvyat and Ricciardo were definitely factors throughout the race yesterday, finishing 3rd and 4th. Meanwhile, Button and Alonso finished 12th and 13th with the "improved" Honda. Honda still has much work to do.


Red Bull has never had one of the most powerful engines in F1. What they do have is the most talented car designer in the history of F1 at their disposal. You put that Honda in the back of the Red Bull and they still outrun the McLarens by a considerable margin.