Synthetic oils in Germany
- Thread starter toyota62
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http://www.mobil1.de/produkte/esp-formula-5w-30.aspx
Mobil 1™ ESP Formula 5W-30
Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie™
Mobil 1 ESP Formula 5W-30 ist ein Hochleistungsmotorenöl auf Basis der innovativen Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie und wurde speziell entwickelt, um die Wirksamkeit von wartungsfreien Dieselpartikelfiltern und Benzin-Katalysatoren zu unterstützen. Durch seine fortschrittliche Additiv-Technologie sorgt es für außergewöhnliche Motoren-sauberkeit und optimalen Verschleißschutz auch unter extremen Belastungen und bei verlängerten Ölwechselintervallen Die ausgezeichneten Leichtlaufeigenschaften sorgen für einen geringeren Kraftstoffverbrauch, reduzierte Schadstoff-Emissionen und helfen damit auch die Umwelt zu schonen.
above from Mobil1 oil Germany.
It seems to be Mobil1 ESP 5w-30 is not a Fully Synthetic(PAO/Ester.).Its call Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie here.
Mobil 1™ ESP Formula 5W-30
Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie™
Mobil 1 ESP Formula 5W-30 ist ein Hochleistungsmotorenöl auf Basis der innovativen Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie und wurde speziell entwickelt, um die Wirksamkeit von wartungsfreien Dieselpartikelfiltern und Benzin-Katalysatoren zu unterstützen. Durch seine fortschrittliche Additiv-Technologie sorgt es für außergewöhnliche Motoren-sauberkeit und optimalen Verschleißschutz auch unter extremen Belastungen und bei verlängerten Ölwechselintervallen Die ausgezeichneten Leichtlaufeigenschaften sorgen für einen geringeren Kraftstoffverbrauch, reduzierte Schadstoff-Emissionen und helfen damit auch die Umwelt zu schonen.
above from Mobil1 oil Germany.
It seems to be Mobil1 ESP 5w-30 is not a Fully Synthetic(PAO/Ester.).Its call Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie here.
This is very interesting. The comments made on this German website is in direct contradiction to what many here claim, when they tell us that the U.S. definition of synthetic motor oil allows an inferior product to be sold to the consumer, when compared to the German definition of synthetic. Very informative.
It seems however, that we need to take into consideration that the information here is on a commercial website.
"However, some synthetic oils are made from highly refined crude oil. A process known as severe hydrocracking breaks the long chain hydrocarbons into shorter, more uniform molecules and at the same time reduces the level of impurities in the oil. The oil produced, known as API Group III oil, has almost identical properties to synthetic PAO oil and in the U.S. is regarded as synthetic. In Germany, it is often referred to as HC synthesis oil."
"The breakthrough in producing API Group III oils came when it was realized that severe hydrocracking would produce a base oil with a viscosity index above 120. This was now comparable with the viscosity index range of PAOs, and the severe hydrocracking further unified the molecular structure of the base oil so it achieved similar high performance levels to the PAO oils. After a legal wrangle, it was agreed API Group III oils were considered synthetic oils as their performance compared to that of fully synthetic oils in all important respects. As indicated, synthetic oils are derived from two sources: synthetic production and highly refined API Group III crude base oils. The two primary synthetic oils are polyalphaolefins (PAO) and esters."
It seems however, that we need to take into consideration that the information here is on a commercial website.
"However, some synthetic oils are made from highly refined crude oil. A process known as severe hydrocracking breaks the long chain hydrocarbons into shorter, more uniform molecules and at the same time reduces the level of impurities in the oil. The oil produced, known as API Group III oil, has almost identical properties to synthetic PAO oil and in the U.S. is regarded as synthetic. In Germany, it is often referred to as HC synthesis oil."
"The breakthrough in producing API Group III oils came when it was realized that severe hydrocracking would produce a base oil with a viscosity index above 120. This was now comparable with the viscosity index range of PAOs, and the severe hydrocracking further unified the molecular structure of the base oil so it achieved similar high performance levels to the PAO oils. After a legal wrangle, it was agreed API Group III oils were considered synthetic oils as their performance compared to that of fully synthetic oils in all important respects. As indicated, synthetic oils are derived from two sources: synthetic production and highly refined API Group III crude base oils. The two primary synthetic oils are polyalphaolefins (PAO) and esters."
OVERKILL
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And we know PAO has superior cold temperature performance to group III, so that's not entirely truthful. I'm guessing they sell Group III oils and so are trying to downplay the advantages of PAO (IMHO).
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: toyota62
http://www.mobil1.de/produkte/esp-formula-5w-30.aspx
Mobil 1™ ESP Formula 5W-30
Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie™
Mobil 1 ESP Formula 5W-30 ist ein Hochleistungsmotorenöl auf Basis der innovativen Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie und wurde speziell entwickelt, um die Wirksamkeit von wartungsfreien Dieselpartikelfiltern und Benzin-Katalysatoren zu unterstützen. Durch seine fortschrittliche Additiv-Technologie sorgt es für außergewöhnliche Motoren-sauberkeit und optimalen Verschleißschutz auch unter extremen Belastungen und bei verlängerten Ölwechselintervallen Die ausgezeichneten Leichtlaufeigenschaften sorgen für einen geringeren Kraftstoffverbrauch, reduzierte Schadstoff-Emissionen und helfen damit auch die Umwelt zu schonen.
above from Mobil1 oil Germany.
It seems to be Mobil1 ESP 5w-30 is not a Fully Synthetic(PAO/Ester.).Its call Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie here.
The best way to find out how "synthetic" a particular Mobil product is does not involve just looking at the descriptions on the website(s). The reason for this is simple: Mobil changes the formulas of their lubricants and IMHO, they don't want to be regularly updating their descriptions if the base oil blend changes.
I (and others on here) simply go and find the MSDS for the Mobil product in question (and you may have to look at a few different versions before you find one that shows you what you are looking for) and see what it lists, you are looking for something like this:
Which is for M1 EP 0w-20, indicating a PAO percentage of 60-70%.
http://www.mobil1.de/produkte/esp-formula-5w-30.aspx
Mobil 1™ ESP Formula 5W-30
Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie™
Mobil 1 ESP Formula 5W-30 ist ein Hochleistungsmotorenöl auf Basis der innovativen Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie und wurde speziell entwickelt, um die Wirksamkeit von wartungsfreien Dieselpartikelfiltern und Benzin-Katalysatoren zu unterstützen. Durch seine fortschrittliche Additiv-Technologie sorgt es für außergewöhnliche Motoren-sauberkeit und optimalen Verschleißschutz auch unter extremen Belastungen und bei verlängerten Ölwechselintervallen Die ausgezeichneten Leichtlaufeigenschaften sorgen für einen geringeren Kraftstoffverbrauch, reduzierte Schadstoff-Emissionen und helfen damit auch die Umwelt zu schonen.
above from Mobil1 oil Germany.
It seems to be Mobil1 ESP 5w-30 is not a Fully Synthetic(PAO/Ester.).Its call Mobil SHC Synthese Technologie here.
The best way to find out how "synthetic" a particular Mobil product is does not involve just looking at the descriptions on the website(s). The reason for this is simple: Mobil changes the formulas of their lubricants and IMHO, they don't want to be regularly updating their descriptions if the base oil blend changes.
I (and others on here) simply go and find the MSDS for the Mobil product in question (and you may have to look at a few different versions before you find one that shows you what you are looking for) and see what it lists, you are looking for something like this:
Which is for M1 EP 0w-20, indicating a PAO percentage of 60-70%.
Even then, OVERKILL, you must exhibit caution. They don't always list anything useful, even for oils where we are fairly certain of the formulation. I suspect what gets listed depends upon who is actually filling out the data sheet for any given product on any given day.
The enforcement people certainly don't give two hoots whether a finished oil is Group III or Group IV or I or II. A highway spill of a barrel of PYB makes just as much of a mess as RP HPS or Red Line.
The enforcement people certainly don't give two hoots whether a finished oil is Group III or Group IV or I or II. A highway spill of a barrel of PYB makes just as much of a mess as RP HPS or Red Line.
Actually that looks about right to me...
70% PAO; say about, 12% DI; maybe 10% VII (with Group III the most likely dil oil) and the balance being some kind of ester to mitigate against seal shrinkage.
70% PAO; say about, 12% DI; maybe 10% VII (with Group III the most likely dil oil) and the balance being some kind of ester to mitigate against seal shrinkage.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Garak
Even then, OVERKILL, you must exhibit caution. They don't always list anything useful, even for oils where we are fairly certain of the formulation. I suspect what gets listed depends upon who is actually filling out the data sheet for any given product on any given day.
The enforcement people certainly don't give two hoots whether a finished oil is Group III or Group IV or I or II. A highway spill of a barrel of PYB makes just as much of a mess as RP HPS or Red Line.
Yup, as I noted, sometimes you have to check a few MSDS's to find a base oil listed, but it is usually there on at least one of them.
Some oil companies (not XOM) just list "proprietary" to avoid divulging anything about the formula.
Even then, OVERKILL, you must exhibit caution. They don't always list anything useful, even for oils where we are fairly certain of the formulation. I suspect what gets listed depends upon who is actually filling out the data sheet for any given product on any given day.
The enforcement people certainly don't give two hoots whether a finished oil is Group III or Group IV or I or II. A highway spill of a barrel of PYB makes just as much of a mess as RP HPS or Red Line.
Yup, as I noted, sometimes you have to check a few MSDS's to find a base oil listed, but it is usually there on at least one of them.
Some oil companies (not XOM) just list "proprietary" to avoid divulging anything about the formula.
And they seem to do different things by family of oils, in both safety and product sheets.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Garak
And they seem to do different things by family of oils, in both safety and product sheets.
Yup.
And they seem to do different things by family of oils, in both safety and product sheets.
Yup.
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