Over due for brake lines - all of them

[eljefino]

Originally Posted By: Trav


Install the new fittings (take the ones you removed and match them at AA, AZ, Napa) then do your flair. You can tell which type of flair you need from the line left in the old fitting. Do not forget to put the fitting on first!



Be careful with the 3/8 vs 10mm fittings! A 3/8 will thread into a 10mm hole but could later blow out.

A 3/8 open wrench will fit over a 3/8 but not a 10mm.

They generally use 10mm for ISO/Metric flares. These nuts are generally not threaded all the way to the flare. Conversely, 3/8" nuts are threaded all the way, and end in a double flare. You might find both, because GM is "that way".

Quote:


Some lines to the master cylinder have coils in them, you can duplicate this by carefully wrapping the line around a glass bottle.


IIRC my Century might have had that braided flex line between MC and frame rail. It's there to relieve metal fatigue and vibration as the firewall flexes slightly in relation to the frame. A couple coils does the same thing. I've seen some artful ones but a rookie will probably end up with ugly stuff.

 

[Trav]

I just did this freehand on some scrap using a old tabasco bottle in less than 30 seconds.
If i can can do it so quick someone taking their time can do a much nicer job.

 

[Lubener]

Do it yourself. Measure out what you need, buy premade lines,bend the lines and get a couple of unions to piece it together. Bleed the brakes and hopefully the bleeders come loose. The shop won't have any advantage when it comes to the bleeder screws when you use a line wrench. You do not need to mess with flare tools and you should be able to replace everything in an afternoon.. Then count your savings.

 

[Lubener]

Originally Posted By: bubbatime
Trade the car in. Thank me later.


A typical "Greenhorn" response. He would pay more in sales tax on another car than just repairing it. It's not a big deal.

 

[The_Eric]

Originally Posted By: Lubener
Originally Posted By: bubbatime
Trade the car in. Thank me later.


A typical "Greenhorn" response. He would pay more in sales tax on another car than just repairing it. It's not a big deal.


A voice of reason.

But... but... the car isn't worth that much.

I'd much rather repair a car that is otherwise driveable/serviceable rather than fork over 10K + for a new or newer car- even if it is "worth" more. The only caveat would be if I could get a newer and/or nicer vehicle for the cost of the proposed repair, or a bit more.

 

[MarkM66]

Practice your double flares before even starting such a job. That would be the most crucial part of the whole job. Bend a whole line, and screw up the flare, start over...

 

[zzyzzx]

Anyone replace their metal brake lines before they leak?

Just checking.

 

[901Memphis]

My Taurus never leaked a drop of fluid until the day the line blew out.

 

[SHOZ]

Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
My Taurus never leaked a drop of fluid until the day the line blew out.


My '97 did that. Leaving for a 100 mile trip and the first stop sign the pedal went to the floor.

FWIW the OEM lines ere relatively cheap and easy to get from Ford..

 

[zzyzzx]

Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
My Taurus never leaked a drop of fluid until the day the line blew out.


Originally Posted By: SHOZ
My '97 did that. Leaving for a 100 mile trip and the first stop sign the pedal went to the floor.


That's what I was expecting.

 

[Donald]

Pre-bent steel from the dealer and use FF or CarWell?

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: zzyzzx
Anyone replace their metal brake lines before they leak?

Just checking.


Definitely! I have always lived in a salt belt here and in Germany. Steel lines rot its a fact of life.
When i see them getting crispy i plan a little project ahead of time then do it at a relaxed pace not under the gun of having to get the car up and running again yesterday.

Two of my old cars are both from the south west with no rot but i did the brake and fuel lines in NiCopp with covered, braided SS hoses to the calipers just because.

Originally Posted By: Donald
Pre-bent steel from the dealer and use FF or CarWell?

Steel lines are a real compromise and cost cutter at the manufacturing level just like plain steel exhaust systems were.
The longer the warranties got they had to use a better quality material on the exhaust and coat the lines with something usually aluminizing or poly coatings.

Many got stainless exhaust which is the best and longest lasting.
The problem with pre-bent lines is depending on the vehicle it may or may not be realistic to use them.
Some body on frame vehicles require the body to be lifted. Others the fuel tank and suspension components need to be moved out of the way.

The problem with using an external coating on steel is your only protecting one side of the material. Depending on climate and humidity the lines can corrode albeit at a lower rate from inside.
Nickel copper has been around for many decades OE but because of its price was only used by premium makes. I used Cunifer for years, its high priced but well worth it.
Now AGS NiCopp has come along at a lower price and i cant tell the difference, its good solid stuff at a lower price, AGS is a larger manufacturer.

Cheaper no name stuff out of China has reportedly a much thinner wall.
You can bend these lines by hand, it very easy to do a nice lifelong lasting job that doesn't need any additional coatings or sprays.
Fitting never seize to the lines 10 years down the road. Personally i wouldn't use anything else especially in corrosion prone areas of the country.

http://store.fedhillusa.com/316475mmbrakeline-2.aspx

http://agscompany.com/product-category/brake-fuel-transmission-lines/nicopp/

 

[andyd]

In my later yrs, I do better work, but I'm very slow and not very agile. The Rat's brake system is about 90% new. I saved the rotors and drums and the master cylinder. The rest had rusted to dangerous. I broke the rear line and I couldn't get the front bleeders open. I quit before shearing them and bought remans from Auto Zone. I double flared new tubing. I had the Rat blocked up 2' in the air in a tent, replacing the clutch and a punky frame. The brakes had behaved flawlessly in the 6 months I limped it around on the last bit of clutch. It was due to the gentleness I had to use to get it to move that the brakes didn't fail when stood on.

 

[The_Eric]

Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: zzyzzx
Anyone replace their metal brake lines before they leak?

Just checking.


Definitely! I have always lived in a salt belt here and in Germany. Steel lines rot its a fact of life.
When i see them getting crispy i plan a little project ahead of time then do it at a relaxed pace not under the gun of having to get the car up and running again yesterday.

Two of my old cars are both from the south west with no rot but i did the brake and fuel lines in NiCopp with covered, braided SS hoses to the calipers just because.

Originally Posted By: Donald
Pre-bent steel from the dealer and use FF or CarWell?

Steel lines are a real compromise and cost cutter at the manufacturing level just like plain steel exhaust systems were.
The longer the warranties got they had to use a better quality material on the exhaust and coat the lines with something usually aluminizing or poly coatings.

Many got stainless exhaust which is the best and longest lasting.
The problem with pre-bent lines is depending on the vehicle it may or may not be realistic to use them.
Some body on frame vehicles require the body to be lifted. Others the fuel tank and suspension components need to be moved out of the way.

The problem with using an external coating on steel is your only protecting one side of the material. Depending on climate and humidity the lines can corrode albeit at a lower rate from inside.
Nickel copper has been around for many decades OE but because of its price was only used by premium makes. I used Cunifer for years, its high priced but well worth it.
Now AGS NiCopp has come along at a lower price and i cant tell the difference, its good solid stuff at a lower price, AGS is a larger manufacturer.

Cheaper no name stuff out of China has reportedly a much thinner wall.
You can bend these lines by hand, it very easy to do a nice lifelong lasting job that doesn't need any additional coatings or sprays.
Fitting never seize to the lines 10 years down the road. Personally i wouldn't use anything else especially in corrosion prone areas of the country.

http://store.fedhillusa.com/316475mmbrakeline-2.aspx

http://agscompany.com/product-category/brake-fuel-transmission-lines/nicopp/



We've buying NiCopp from S.U.R&R. Get it from our local NAPA. We also have the S.U.R&R flaring tool- it's a lever and turret style. It makes very nice, very repeatable flares in next to no time.

 

[supton]

When brake lines start leaking, how "fast" do they leak? As in, how bad is it?

Years ago I had a pad fall off my car, and it felt like I had zero brakes. Instantly. Ever since then I have been wholly against owning something where brake lines could go and lose brakes entirely.

Do most lines spring a leak and give indication; or is out of the blue and no brakes?

 

[SHOZ]

When they go they go. And the dual circuit master cylinders are of little help.

 

[901Memphis]

The Buick is at the shop, i dropped it off last night at the night drop and they called me this morning. The can do all the brake and fuel lines in Nicopp for $500, and they said the wheel cylinders will have to be replaced too about another $200. Not too bad i guess, i already have a fuel filter so that saved me their $30 quoted price for that part.

I am going to have them take care of the front wheel bearing while they have it, even though i could probably do that myself.

$700 for all brake/fuel lines/new wheel cylinders is better than i was expecting, so i hope they don't try to raise the price. This was just a quote over the phone.

 

[Traction]

This is why I would rather drive on ice, than salt. Slow/traction wins the race.

 

[Ducked]

Originally Posted By: Trav


Two of my old cars are both from the south west with no rot but i did the brake and fuel lines in NiCopp with covered, braided SS hoses to the calipers just because



just because......you were making a Youtube video?

Appreciate the niceness of NiCopp, but you can extend the life of (initially fairly un-corroded) [censored] OEM steel pipes hugely by an annual-ish rub down with sunflower oil and aluminium foil.

You'd have to do that an awful lot of times to add up to the trouble and expense of ....just because.

(You'd be flushing your brake fluid with NiCopp too, hopefully)

 

[Nick1994]

$200 for wheel cylinders? They're like $10 each and take 15 minutes to replace each. Tell them to leave them alone and do it yourself.