custom PCM tuning & timing advance

[04SE]

I am planning on getting an SCT tuner with a custom tune for my CVPI. My only real question is about timing and gasoline engines. Is it possible to overdue the timing and create adversely high cylinder temps/pressures or will detonation set in first?

The custom tune I am looking at only adds 10-15 peak HP but really brings up the midrange HP/TQ that I am looking for. I don't care about peak as I don't drive around at 5,600 RPMs. I drive around at 1,500-4,000 which is where the real HP/TQ is increasing from what I assume is additional timing and some injector PWM adjustment to adjust A/F.

If Ford only commanded 'X' amount of timing in the lower RPM ranges is adding timing to this range going beyond the 'safe' limits that Ford didn't exceed?

 

[Chris142]

Too much timing and power will go down. In the old days we shot for 34-36 degrees full advance. Any more and power fell off.

 

[sciphi]

Modern engines will pull timing at the slightest hint of predetonation. I wouldn't worry, especially with a tune from a reputable tuning company that's been field-tested on likely tens of thousands of Panthers by now.

Ford likely did what they did for durability and emissions reasons. They don't want the engine failing in warranty for the one schmuck who starts it and instantly floors it 5 miles to work and back in a -20*F Minnesota winter. It's programmed to survive that for the duration of warranty, so some power is left on the table in the name of durability.

Even with that SCT, unless it's a fully custom tune, there's likely a decent safety margin left.

 

[EvanD]

Unless you have a complete tuning package like hp tuners. I would get a mail order tune. 10hp is not even noticeable. I would go with a higher stall converter and a mail order tune if you wanna wake that car up. Then you have the bolt on stuff to add to that intake manifold long tube headers for a second stage of go fast.

 

[04SE]

Originally Posted By: EvanD
Unless you have a complete tuning package like hp tuners. I would get a mail order tune. 10hp is not even noticeable. I would go with a higher stall converter and a mail order tune if you wanna wake that car up. Then you have the bolt on stuff to add to that intake manifold long tube headers for a second stage of go fast.


The CVPI already has a higher stall than the regular Panthers. Long tubes are almost $900 and you are guaranteed to break exhaust studs upon removal. The intake set-up on the CVPI is basically the same as the Marauder and is already pretty much optimized & maxed out by Ford.

The canned SCT tunes for the Panthers are well documented as less than stellar. They have unusually high shift points and a few other things that nobody seems to like.

EDIT: I should add, the custom tune I am looking at is a mail order tune from a reputable Panther tuner. He is however only 4 hours away so some dyno time isn't out of the question.