I tried this a few years ago, doing the same 150 mile round trip for the test. 1999 Dodge Dakota, 5.2l engine. Only once I got slightly better mpg. The rest of the trips were the same 15 mpg I got w/o adding acetone. So I say don't bother. As far as rubber damage, I don't see how a couple of ounces diluted in 20 gallons of gas can do anything. Spilling it would be a different story.
Acetone
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Has there not been tests done on soaking in acetone these parts that may be affected?
Originally Posted By: John_Conrad
Has there not been tests done on soaking in acetone these parts that may be affected?
Straight acetone will definitely damage seals. Some suspect that any kind of damage due to diluted acetone will occur over a prolonged period of time. It frankly doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
Has there not been tests done on soaking in acetone these parts that may be affected?
Straight acetone will definitely damage seals. Some suspect that any kind of damage due to diluted acetone will occur over a prolonged period of time. It frankly doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
Have tried it off and on over the years, and seen no benefit, or damage, at the tiny doses that are supposed to get the mileage improvements (which I also didn't see).
Back in the day, when I had my triple carbed 6, I used my own brew of 20L 98RON leaded, 20L 97RON Unleaded (the lead characteristic is very non linear, so you get more RONS out of the brew than the sum), 5L of methylated spirits, and either acetone or MEK as a co-solvent, 250ml can.
Every now and then, a plastic fuel filter would soften and collapse (suction side of the mechanical pump), and I became very concerned about my plastic carb floats.
Back in the day, when I had my triple carbed 6, I used my own brew of 20L 98RON leaded, 20L 97RON Unleaded (the lead characteristic is very non linear, so you get more RONS out of the brew than the sum), 5L of methylated spirits, and either acetone or MEK as a co-solvent, 250ml can.
Every now and then, a plastic fuel filter would soften and collapse (suction side of the mechanical pump), and I became very concerned about my plastic carb floats.
Anyone running Acetone in a small 2 stroke engine? I'd like to experiment with my power Ice Auger, but would appreciate insight before starting.
Originally Posted By: mjk
Anyone running Acetone in a small 2 stroke engine? I'd like to experiment with my power Ice Auger, but would appreciate insight before starting.
Interesting, I haven't put it in my 25 year old StrikeMaster Laser Mag yet. All it gets is 91 Octane E0 + Amsoil Saber Professional.
That thing runs like a dream.
Anyone running Acetone in a small 2 stroke engine? I'd like to experiment with my power Ice Auger, but would appreciate insight before starting.
Interesting, I haven't put it in my 25 year old StrikeMaster Laser Mag yet. All it gets is 91 Octane E0 + Amsoil Saber Professional.
That thing runs like a dream.
i've tried it in several vehicles, mowers, a skid steer, and a generator, with no issues. 2-3 ounces per 10 gallon(.2-.3 oz per gallon)---- it's likely i will run it in my weed eater next spring and I don't expect any problems at all, just don't over dose and start low if you want and observe your engine while it runs.
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Originally Posted By: Shannow
Have tried it off and on over the years, and seen no benefit, or damage, at the tiny doses that are supposed to get the mileage improvements (which I also didn't see).
Back in the day, when I had my triple carbed 6, I used my own brew of 20L 98RON leaded, 20L 97RON Unleaded (the lead characteristic is very non linear, so you get more RONS out of the brew than the sum), 5L of methylated spirits, and either acetone or MEK as a co-solvent, 250ml can.
Every now and then, a plastic fuel filter would soften and collapse (suction side of the mechanical pump), and I became very concerned about my plastic carb floats.
shannow, thanks for your post, it jarred my memory on an experience i had when i first started trying the acetone, this was maybe 8 years or so ago.
i used fuel injector bottles made of thin plastic and placed behind the seat of my pick up truck and in the heat of the day, the bottles became soft. i had to be careful in getting the bottles out. now this was pure acetone in these thin plastic bottles and i have not used those type bottle any more.
hmmm, thats got me thinking as i am a hands on kind of person. i should have some used fuel injector seals some where in the garage, if I can find them i can try soaking them in 1. a fuel/acetone mixture and 2. in pure acetone---is anyone interested in seeing this?
Have tried it off and on over the years, and seen no benefit, or damage, at the tiny doses that are supposed to get the mileage improvements (which I also didn't see).
Back in the day, when I had my triple carbed 6, I used my own brew of 20L 98RON leaded, 20L 97RON Unleaded (the lead characteristic is very non linear, so you get more RONS out of the brew than the sum), 5L of methylated spirits, and either acetone or MEK as a co-solvent, 250ml can.
Every now and then, a plastic fuel filter would soften and collapse (suction side of the mechanical pump), and I became very concerned about my plastic carb floats.
shannow, thanks for your post, it jarred my memory on an experience i had when i first started trying the acetone, this was maybe 8 years or so ago.
i used fuel injector bottles made of thin plastic and placed behind the seat of my pick up truck and in the heat of the day, the bottles became soft. i had to be careful in getting the bottles out. now this was pure acetone in these thin plastic bottles and i have not used those type bottle any more.
hmmm, thats got me thinking as i am a hands on kind of person. i should have some used fuel injector seals some where in the garage, if I can find them i can try soaking them in 1. a fuel/acetone mixture and 2. in pure acetone---is anyone interested in seeing this?
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Originally Posted By: John_Conrad
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Have tried it off and on over the years, and seen no benefit, or damage, at the tiny doses that are supposed to get the mileage improvements (which I also didn't see).
Back in the day, when I had my triple carbed 6, I used my own brew of 20L 98RON leaded, 20L 97RON Unleaded (the lead characteristic is very non linear, so you get more RONS out of the brew than the sum), 5L of methylated spirits, and either acetone or MEK as a co-solvent, 250ml can.
Every now and then, a plastic fuel filter would soften and collapse (suction side of the mechanical pump), and I became very concerned about my plastic carb floats.
shannow, thanks for your post, it jarred my memory on an experience i had when i first started trying the acetone, this was maybe 8 years or so ago.
i used fuel injector bottles made of thin plastic and placed behind the seat of my pick up truck and in the heat of the day, the bottles became soft. i had to be careful in getting the bottles out. now this was pure acetone in these thin plastic bottles and i have not used those type bottle any more.
hmmm, thats got me thinking as i am a hands on kind of person. i should have some used fuel injector seals some where in the garage, if I can find them i can try soaking them in 1. a fuel/acetone mixture and 2. in pure acetone---is anyone interested in seeing this?
Pure acetone is typically sold in metal tins, not in plastic containers of any form. Just because acetone is listed in a fuel injector cleaner mix in plastic container doesn't necessary means (a) it will not soften/melt the kind of plastic container it is in over time; and (b) given sufficient acetone quantities, it will dissolve the plastic container sooner rather than later.
Q.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Have tried it off and on over the years, and seen no benefit, or damage, at the tiny doses that are supposed to get the mileage improvements (which I also didn't see).
Back in the day, when I had my triple carbed 6, I used my own brew of 20L 98RON leaded, 20L 97RON Unleaded (the lead characteristic is very non linear, so you get more RONS out of the brew than the sum), 5L of methylated spirits, and either acetone or MEK as a co-solvent, 250ml can.
Every now and then, a plastic fuel filter would soften and collapse (suction side of the mechanical pump), and I became very concerned about my plastic carb floats.
shannow, thanks for your post, it jarred my memory on an experience i had when i first started trying the acetone, this was maybe 8 years or so ago.
i used fuel injector bottles made of thin plastic and placed behind the seat of my pick up truck and in the heat of the day, the bottles became soft. i had to be careful in getting the bottles out. now this was pure acetone in these thin plastic bottles and i have not used those type bottle any more.
hmmm, thats got me thinking as i am a hands on kind of person. i should have some used fuel injector seals some where in the garage, if I can find them i can try soaking them in 1. a fuel/acetone mixture and 2. in pure acetone---is anyone interested in seeing this?
Pure acetone is typically sold in metal tins, not in plastic containers of any form. Just because acetone is listed in a fuel injector cleaner mix in plastic container doesn't necessary means (a) it will not soften/melt the kind of plastic container it is in over time; and (b) given sufficient acetone quantities, it will dissolve the plastic container sooner rather than later.
Q.
Here's a chart RE: plastics resisting Acetone:
http://www.plasticsintl.com/plastics_chemical_resistence_chart.html
http://www.plasticsintl.com/plastics_chemical_resistence_chart.html
Originally Posted By: Quest
Here's a chart RE: plastics resisting Acetone:
http://www.plasticsintl.com/plastics_chemical_resistence_chart.html
Neat!
Here's a chart RE: plastics resisting Acetone:
http://www.plasticsintl.com/plastics_chemical_resistence_chart.html
Neat!
Ok, to help entertain you folks futher:
This is the chart I used (still use it today RE: dealing with Coleman (naphtha) gas compatibility elastomer seals and gasoline-related seals:
http://mykin.com/rubber-chemical-resistance-chart
With rating (1) being best, (4) being worst, here's a quick summary:
Acetone:
(1) EPDM,
(1) Butyl
(1) Kalrez
Gasoline:
(1) Nitrile
(1) Viton
(1) Kalrez
Most other elastomeric materials listed for Gasoline and/or Acetone are rated at either (3) or (4), meaning that they are not suitable for use in those chemical environments.
Knowing full well that most gasoline-related sealing elastomers are nowadays either poly-based or viton (nitrile being the oldest man-made material that is fuel-resistant, used many, many decades ago), Acetone will melt Nitrile or Viton.
Good luck playing with Acetone doping in gasoline automobiles.
Q.
This is the chart I used (still use it today RE: dealing with Coleman (naphtha) gas compatibility elastomer seals and gasoline-related seals:
http://mykin.com/rubber-chemical-resistance-chart
With rating (1) being best, (4) being worst, here's a quick summary:
Acetone:
(1) EPDM,
(1) Butyl
(1) Kalrez
Gasoline:
(1) Nitrile
(1) Viton
(1) Kalrez
Most other elastomeric materials listed for Gasoline and/or Acetone are rated at either (3) or (4), meaning that they are not suitable for use in those chemical environments.
Knowing full well that most gasoline-related sealing elastomers are nowadays either poly-based or viton (nitrile being the oldest man-made material that is fuel-resistant, used many, many decades ago), Acetone will melt Nitrile or Viton.
Good luck playing with Acetone doping in gasoline automobiles.
Q.
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
Nail polish remover that claims to be 100% acetone is sold in plastic bottles. It just has to be a type of plastic that isn't soluble in acetone.
Yep, we use it in our biz and get it at Wal Mart. Sold in cheap little plastic bottles.
FWIW when my Chrysler was new we ran gallons of fuel additive in it in which the primary ingredient was acetone. never harmed a thing and reduced the KR values very significantly. Just too expensive in the long term IMO...
Nail polish remover that claims to be 100% acetone is sold in plastic bottles. It just has to be a type of plastic that isn't soluble in acetone.
Yep, we use it in our biz and get it at Wal Mart. Sold in cheap little plastic bottles.
FWIW when my Chrysler was new we ran gallons of fuel additive in it in which the primary ingredient was acetone. never harmed a thing and reduced the KR values very significantly. Just too expensive in the long term IMO...
Originally Posted By: Turk
Ok. So how have people been dosing it for so long with no problems??
i'm am not the most experienced to answer this, others will respond. They may or may not as this subject has been discussed at length for many years, however i appreciate this particular one as it is very educational.
my answer to your question is that likely the dosing has been kept low enough and that the fuel is burned through quickly enough so that the damage may not occur under those conditions. Conversely one could propose that if dosed heavily and left long enough the possibility for damage is there. I run through a tank of fuel a week like most commuters here, so I have not seen any damage, but i have not looked at those parts that may be affected.
It has also been mentioned in a previous post that damage can occur slowly, so take that into consideration.
Even though i did not start this thread, i want to thank Quest for his posting above with the linky to the table. this is the kind of participation that really helps me learn. I have done many searches and have not found specifics of testing related to materials. So i appreciate someone with the experience sharing. If we all act like adults, folks will help.
Ok. So how have people been dosing it for so long with no problems??
i'm am not the most experienced to answer this, others will respond. They may or may not as this subject has been discussed at length for many years, however i appreciate this particular one as it is very educational.
my answer to your question is that likely the dosing has been kept low enough and that the fuel is burned through quickly enough so that the damage may not occur under those conditions. Conversely one could propose that if dosed heavily and left long enough the possibility for damage is there. I run through a tank of fuel a week like most commuters here, so I have not seen any damage, but i have not looked at those parts that may be affected.
It has also been mentioned in a previous post that damage can occur slowly, so take that into consideration.
Even though i did not start this thread, i want to thank Quest for his posting above with the linky to the table. this is the kind of participation that really helps me learn. I have done many searches and have not found specifics of testing related to materials. So i appreciate someone with the experience sharing. If we all act like adults, folks will help.
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^It's simply a risk, as you point out likely avoided by going through the tank with increase acetone concentration more quickly.
IMO it's very similar to the risk of using solvent-type cleaners in engine oil and driving with them vs. idling and then draining as a quick engine flush. There is a risky in both examples with varied degrees of likelihood of trouble. No one on here can guarantee one or the other as being 'safe', but shock treatment may reveal a problem that would've perhaps shown up later; e.g. a clogged fuel filter in a neglected app after a heavy dosing of solvent in fuel system. Worse perhaps you push that weak rubber or plastic component in your 20 year old fuel system over the edge?
Why else are these PEA cleaners so popular? Less risks, more overall benefits arguably; despite the price point up front you may avoid that potential downfall by taking the cheap route of a quick clean. In a system that doesn't have much to be cleaned why run more solvent anyway I ask you!? lol.
For example, if a car not labeled as flex fuel were to run some E-85 by means of topping off a remaining 2 gallons to say a 10 gallon tank with E-85 would the fuel system fail and catastrophe ensue? No. Could the engine have trouble adjusting the mixture and timing/performance be effected by dosing with E-85? Perhaps.
How about with regards to actual cleansing? Maybe the detergent method is the way to go instead of these more aggressive solvent routes? However, folks that have flex-fuel system and use E-85 probably have fairly clean fuel system. However, that's just the gist and I'm welcome to those with more insight sharing their thoughts. Do E-85/flex-fuel vehicles still need more solvent or a PEA cleanser???
IMO it's very similar to the risk of using solvent-type cleaners in engine oil and driving with them vs. idling and then draining as a quick engine flush. There is a risky in both examples with varied degrees of likelihood of trouble. No one on here can guarantee one or the other as being 'safe', but shock treatment may reveal a problem that would've perhaps shown up later; e.g. a clogged fuel filter in a neglected app after a heavy dosing of solvent in fuel system. Worse perhaps you push that weak rubber or plastic component in your 20 year old fuel system over the edge?
Why else are these PEA cleaners so popular? Less risks, more overall benefits arguably; despite the price point up front you may avoid that potential downfall by taking the cheap route of a quick clean. In a system that doesn't have much to be cleaned why run more solvent anyway I ask you!? lol.
For example, if a car not labeled as flex fuel were to run some E-85 by means of topping off a remaining 2 gallons to say a 10 gallon tank with E-85 would the fuel system fail and catastrophe ensue? No. Could the engine have trouble adjusting the mixture and timing/performance be effected by dosing with E-85? Perhaps.
How about with regards to actual cleansing? Maybe the detergent method is the way to go instead of these more aggressive solvent routes? However, folks that have flex-fuel system and use E-85 probably have fairly clean fuel system. However, that's just the gist and I'm welcome to those with more insight sharing their thoughts. Do E-85/flex-fuel vehicles still need more solvent or a PEA cleanser???
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