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#3399568 - 06/17/14 07:47 AM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: zzyzzx]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 30503
Loc: Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: zzyzzx
I am adding this picture to my long list of reasons to avoid low profile tires:

Your photo is a great reason to avoid the tire shop that did this, but that's about it.
_________________________
'02 530i (PPE 5W-40)
'15 Q5 3.0T (Edge 5W-40)

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#3399979 - 06/17/14 05:28 PM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: Quattro Pete]
MCompact Offline


Registered: 07/21/02
Posts: 2607
Loc: KY
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete

Your photo is a great reason to avoid the tire shop that did this, but that's about it.


Exactly. Morons at work...
_________________________
Mine:
2014 M235i
1999 Wrangler Sahara
1995 318ti Club Sport
1996 Speed Triple

Wife's:
2004 X3 2.5i

Son's
2009 328i


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#3399985 - 06/17/14 05:32 PM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: JHZR2]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 9798
Loc: NE,Ohio
_________________________
2015 Forester I-Premium 6MT

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#3400422 - 06/18/14 09:08 AM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: JHZR2]
AboutTires Offline


Registered: 05/26/13
Posts: 79
Loc: Mass, USA
Once again you folks have given me a great idea for an article. My Tire Review column is aimed at tire techs, and I have in mind an article on what to do when the balancer starts "chasing weights" like that.

Zzyzzx: Can I use your picture for the article? It's a perfect illustration of what not to do.

CapriRacer: I would say that there are four possible causes for this.

1. A serious imbalance, maybe fixable by match mounting with a road force balancer.

2. Tire and/or wheel out of round, sometimes also fixable by match mounting.

3. Bad centering, either because the cone is in wrong or the hub center is damaged. Maybe needs lug centering.

4. Bad balancer calibration.

Any other causes/remedies you can think of?

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#3400517 - 06/18/14 11:36 AM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: AboutTires]
Traction Offline


Registered: 06/04/13
Posts: 575
Loc: iowa
Originally Posted By: AboutTires
Once again you folks have given me a great idea for an article. My Tire Review column is aimed at tire techs, and I have in mind an article on what to do when the balancer starts "chasing weights" like that.

Zzyzzx: Can I use your picture for the article? It's a perfect illustration of what not to do.

CapriRacer: I would say that there are four possible causes for this.

1. A serious imbalance, maybe fixable by match mounting with a road force balancer.

2. Tire and/or wheel out of round, sometimes also fixable by match mounting.

3. Bad centering, either because the cone is in wrong or the hub center is damaged. Maybe needs lug centering.

4. Bad balancer calibration.

Any other causes/remedies you can think of?


Water or something in the tire. I hate to admit it, but a couple of years ago I had 1 tire out of 4 that I kept chasing weights around. Drove me crazy. Finally pulled the tire back off, and there was the packing slip that I'd forgot I stuck inside of the tire. Couldn't believe how much just a piece of paper screwed up the balancing.

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#3401250 - 06/19/14 07:40 AM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: Traction]
CapriRacer Offline


Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 2884
Loc: Somewhere in the US
Originally Posted By: Traction
Originally Posted By: AboutTires
Once again you folks have given me a great idea for an article. My Tire Review column is aimed at tire techs, and I have in mind an article on what to do when the balancer starts "chasing weights" like that.

Zzyzzx: Can I use your picture for the article? It's a perfect illustration of what not to do.

CapriRacer: I would say that there are four possible causes for this.

1. A serious imbalance, maybe fixable by match mounting with a road force balancer.

2. Tire and/or wheel out of round, sometimes also fixable by match mounting.

3. Bad centering, either because the cone is in wrong or the hub center is damaged. Maybe needs lug centering.

4. Bad balancer calibration.

Any other causes/remedies you can think of?


Water or something in the tire. I hate to admit it, but a couple of years ago I had 1 tire out of 4 that I kept chasing weights around. Drove me crazy. Finally pulled the tire back off, and there was the packing slip that I'd forgot I stuck inside of the tire. Couldn't believe how much just a piece of paper screwed up the balancing.


First, I think that if a balancer is functioning correctly, the original call for weights would be pretty close - that the check spin should only result in the smallest increment - 5 grams or 1/4 oz. That's round off error.

If the 2nd check spin doesn't zero out, then it's time to check things.

If the 1st check spin calls for more than 5 grams (1/4 oz), look for something loose or perhaps something inside the tire. The 1st check spin not only should be close, but the call for weights ought to be either AT the previous weight location or 180 opposite. In other words, it's round off error.

If 1st check spin calls for weights somewhere other at or 180, then check the set up. (OK, be careful not to over think this. 150 is close enough to 180 for it not to be a difference.)

I suspect that photo is just somebody being cute.

And lastly, I think it is important that the difference between RoadForce Balancing and regular balancing be explained. It's bad enough that the average guy doesn't know the difference, but tire techs ought to learn and not confuse the 2.
_________________________
CapriRacer

Visit my web site: www.BarrysTireTech.com

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#3401573 - 06/19/14 02:45 PM Re: How can changing tires be so difficult?!? [Re: jeepman3071]
ARB1977 Offline


Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 4715
Loc: North Texas
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
You are right demanding a new wheel. The problem is nobody has pride in their work anymore.

We went through the same thing with my mom's 2011 Fit. The car had under 10,000 miles at the time, and had a dash rattle. My mom brought it to the dealer to have them diagnose the noise. The next day the car was "ready". They never found the rattle, and she had one different looking tire and a gouged aluminum rim. The dealer first tried to blame it on us, but the truth later came out that they "drove where they maybe shouldn't have" meaning the car went off the road and they had a blow out. Needless to say many phone calls were made to managers and supervisors. The dealership first claimed they could "buff out" the gouge in the wheel. I told them I'd like to watch since I've never seen anyone buff out a scratch that deep. They later replaced the wheel and both front tires so they would wear evenly. We later had a friend's shop check the front end and underside for any damage due to the car being off road.

All of this could have been avoided if the techs were careful and took pride in their work.

Did you ever figure out that dash rattle...going off topic a little? On my Tacoma there's a TSB on the dash rattle although I never took it in, all I did was wedge black rubber hose between the dash and windshield. Pretty much solved my dash rattle.
_________________________
2002 Tacoma 3.4L 175K (as of 09-24-15)
M1 HM 5W30 / Toyota filter

2008 CRV 2.4L 138K (as of 12-06-15)
PP 0W20 / Fram Ultra filter

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