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#3239832 - 01/06/14 07:00 PM only uses oil in town
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 12630
Loc: apple valley, ca
My f250 uses a noticeable amount of oil in town driving. It uses about a qt of 15w40 in 700 miles. But i can drive 700 miles on the hwy @ 3000 rpm and the oil level dont change.

Odd to me.
_________________________
02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 Diesel Mystic 15w50
04 Tahoe super-s 5w30
Z400 Lucas 10w30
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer delo 5w40

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#3239839 - 01/06/14 07:03 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Ramblejam Offline


Registered: 11/05/13
Posts: 1206
Loc: Kentucky
Vacuum & valve seals.

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#3239846 - 01/06/14 07:09 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Ramblejam]
tinmanSC Offline


Registered: 09/07/10
Posts: 2091
Loc: Oswego, IL
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Vacuum & valve seals.

+1
Had this same issue with a first gen DSM once.
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Cost of Hobby=2L
(Where L=Cost of Lubricant)
95 Lexus SC300 5-spd@200K, 2000 GS300@125K both VML Full Syn+Purolator PSL20195(soon to be Wix)

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#3239858 - 01/06/14 07:16 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
artificialist Offline


Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 7506
Loc: Florida
How can a diesel engine draw vacuum? There has to be another reason.
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2010 Lancer Ralliart Sportback

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#3239898 - 01/06/14 07:44 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 12630
Loc: apple valley, ca
Ida guessed the thick oil in town would burn less than hot thin oil and 3000 rpm.
_________________________
02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 Diesel Mystic 15w50
04 Tahoe super-s 5w30
Z400 Lucas 10w30
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer delo 5w40

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#3239912 - 01/06/14 07:55 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: artificialist]
Ramblejam Offline


Registered: 11/05/13
Posts: 1206
Loc: Kentucky
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How can a diesel engine draw vacuum? There has to be another reason.


Thanks for the response -- for some reason, I thought Chris had a 460 Ford. That's what I get for not reading thoroughly. My apologies.

Originally Posted By: Chris142
Ida guessed the thick oil in town would burn less than hot thin oil and 3000 rpm.


Have you checked the CDR valve?

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#3239941 - 01/06/14 08:11 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 12630
Loc: apple valley, ca
Cdr valve was the first thing i changed.
_________________________
02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 Diesel Mystic 15w50
04 Tahoe super-s 5w30
Z400 Lucas 10w30
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer delo 5w40

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#3240064 - 01/06/14 09:30 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
roadrunner1 Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 895
Loc: oh
Try switching to 10w-30, my guess is you have a faulty thermostat and in town you are not getting up to operating temp, thus the oil consumption.
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'15 F350 6.7

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#3240081 - 01/06/14 09:46 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 12630
Loc: apple valley, ca
Thermostat is a new one from ihc and it runs 195ish which is the stats opening temp
_________________________
02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 Diesel Mystic 15w50
04 Tahoe super-s 5w30
Z400 Lucas 10w30
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer delo 5w40

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#3240189 - 01/07/14 12:50 AM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Gokhan Offline


Registered: 12/29/10
Posts: 1752
Loc: Los Angeles, California
Rings/cylinders are hydrodynamically lubricated, which means they wobble during their cycle. Wobbling increases with decreasing RPM and/or increasing engine load. When wobbling increases, it will decrease the minimum oil-film thickness, which will increase the pressure rise within the oil film. This higher pressure rise will result in increased oil consumption, as the wobbling motion will pump more oil by the rings.

You're keeping your engine at a high RPM in highway driving and I am guessing you're not driving too fast. So, the load on the engine is not high and the RPM is high and the wobbling is minimal. If you decreased the RPM (lugged the engine), wobbling and oil consumption would increase.

In city driving, RPMs are usually lower and the load on the engine could be higher as you accelerate, which could result in increase wobbling and oil consumption.

Switching to a thicker oil increases the minimum oil-film thickness and decreases the wobbling but since 15W-40 is already practically as thick as it gets, there is no further remedy.

(Note: I don't expect the oil consumption by the valve stems to depend on RPM or engine load much, as it's mostly determined by the valve-stem-oil-seal oil metering and/or valve-guide clearance.)
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1985 Toyota Corolla LE, 4A-LC engine, ~ 259,000 M
Toyota (by ExxonMobil) SN/GF-5 0W-20 Synthetic
Toyota 90915-YZZF2 filter, 90430-12031 drain gasket

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#3240235 - 01/07/14 05:33 AM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
roadrunner1 Offline


Registered: 04/08/09
Posts: 895
Loc: oh
Try some 10w-30, since you've replaced the thermostat and eliminated cold engine temps your oil may no be reaching optimal temps during stop and go driving, thus the consumption.
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'15 F350 6.7

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#3240674 - 01/07/14 01:26 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: artificialist]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 6093
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Originally Posted By: artificialist
How can a diesel engine draw vacuum? There has to be another reason.


I presume it's the '87 he's talking about. IDI n/a will have vacuum because it's non-turbo.

Those were spec'd for 10w-30 IIRC. Check with Jim Allen; he run's an '86 he rebuilt and has good knowledge of the early IH engines.
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Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

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#3240690 - 01/07/14 01:45 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
bullwinkle Offline


Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 4721
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
IDI non-turbo diesels don't have throttle plates, therefore no vacuum. There are pulses from the intake valves opening which is how the CDR valve works. If you have a manual transmission on your old 7.3, and engine brake (as I do) down hills, etc. you could pull oil in past your oil control rings and burn it. Or you could be leaking it somewhere (like my rear main seal or oil cooler o-rings), that's why I always buy HDEO on sale!
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06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4 48RE SRW, 93 GMC C3500 6.2 diesel, 89 F-450 7.3 IDI, 98 Cherokee 4.0, 05 Scion xB, 12 Ford E-250 4.6

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#3240717 - 01/07/14 02:14 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 12630
Loc: apple valley, ca
No leaks. Its actully clean underneeth
_________________________
02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 Diesel Mystic 15w50
04 Tahoe super-s 5w30
Z400 Lucas 10w30
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer delo 5w40

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#3241026 - 01/07/14 07:08 PM Re: only uses oil in town [Re: Chris142]
Jim Allen Offline


Registered: 08/12/05
Posts: 4477
Loc: NW Ohio
Chris and I have talked about this at length. He's tried 10W30 IIRC. In my truck, I've never noticed much of a difference in consumption between 10W30 and 15W40 and I've run both in 27 years of owning the same truck. More 10W30 than 15W40.

I said this before but my money is on the valve stem seals. I saw a noticeable decrease in oil consumption in mixed driving when I changed mine years ago. I had to change the head gaskets in the '90s (the notorious external leak) so while it was apart, I replaced the VS seals. Notable decrease in consumption, though it wasn't excessive to start.

City vs highway? Usually, they use more oil on the highway at high rpms (mine always has) but it could go back the VS seals. In town, oil temps aren't as high so oil drainback from the rocker area is slowed and there is more oil there to drain down the stems. In theory, a 10W30 might have helped with this as well but it didn't seem to when you used it before IIRC.

Or am I misremembering? You were having trouble finding 10W30 in Apple Valley, so did you actually try it?

I'll also remind you again about the tricky aspect of the Ford IDI dipstick. You likely have that down pat by now, though.
_________________________
Jim Allen
Keepin' the Good Old Days of Four Wheeling Alive

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