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#3159039 - 10/17/13 04:25 PM BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry?
zeuloa Offline


Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 99
Loc: Nicaragua
While looking receipts over I realized that dealer has used BG MOA at every oil change including at 1,000 km, which I don't even think Toyota calls for an oil change.

Most oil changes were done every 5,000 km until I bought the car (25,000 km) and then from 30k it's been every 10k (46k now).

I personally don't like additives and don't consider them necessary, but my opinion aside should I worry about this?

Thanks!


As a side note - get this: The dealer charges for the BG MOA according to the size of the scheduled service. eg. at the 5k service MOA is $10, at the 40k which is a major service you pay $30 for the MOA. It's included in the scheduled service package but not listed anywhere until you get the receipt and it's listed under materials. Talk bout taking advantage!
_________________________
2010 Toyota Corolla w/ 3ZZ-FE and M/T, TGMO 10w30 w/ TOYOTA Filter

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#3159083 - 10/17/13 04:57 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
I wouldn't worry about it, as BG MOA is one of the better snake oils around here. I don't think it would have done any harm to your engine.

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#3159114 - 10/17/13 05:41 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
lubedude13 Offline


Registered: 07/14/13
Posts: 377
Loc: North Carolina
BG moa is great stuff. It's loaded with calcium, phosphorus, etc. keeps engine clean and keeps the oil from breaking down
_________________________
2010 Toyota Camry:
Amsoil Signature Series 0W20
Amsoil Signature Series Trans Fluid
Amsoil ATF Power Steering Fluid

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#3159122 - 10/17/13 05:52 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: lubedude13]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
BG moa is great stuff. It's loaded with calcium, phosphorus, etc. keeps engine clean and keeps the oil from breaking down


At least BG would want you to believe this.

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#3159125 - 10/17/13 05:56 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Lapithes]
volk06 Offline


Registered: 10/04/10
Posts: 4269
Loc: .
Originally Posted By: Lapithes
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
BG moa is great stuff. It's loaded with calcium, phosphorus, etc. keeps engine clean and keeps the oil from breaking down


At least BG would want you to believe this.


There was actually a VOA on the BG MOA, it actually does have high levels of additives.
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#3159128 - 10/17/13 06:03 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: volk06]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
Originally Posted By: volk06
There was actually a VOA on the BG MOA, it actually does have high levels of additives.


That's true, but I was touching on the subject of making your oil not break down, and all the wondrous benefits touted by the company. I don't see why you would need to use this with a good brand name motor oil.

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#3159129 - 10/17/13 06:05 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
dparm Offline


Registered: 04/19/10
Posts: 12503
Loc: Chicago, IL
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#3159157 - 10/17/13 06:33 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 21079
Loc: NY
Wow a dealer using additives, and at every service no less. popcorn2
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#3159166 - 10/17/13 06:38 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
BG markets their products through dealers and mechanics, but you can also find it on eBay. I haven't seen any evidence that an engine with MOA lasts longer than one without, but if that evidence exists, I would like to take a look at it.

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#3159174 - 10/17/13 06:43 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
lubedude13 Offline


Registered: 07/14/13
Posts: 377
Loc: North Carolina
There's a lot of dealers using it. Volkswagen, gM, toyota, Honda I know do.
_________________________
2010 Toyota Camry:
Amsoil Signature Series 0W20
Amsoil Signature Series Trans Fluid
Amsoil ATF Power Steering Fluid

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#3159193 - 10/17/13 07:00 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: volk06]
Donald Offline


Registered: 03/21/04
Posts: 13433
Loc: Upstate NY
Originally Posted By: volk06
Originally Posted By: Lapithes
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
BG moa is great stuff. It's loaded with calcium, phosphorus, etc. keeps engine clean and keeps the oil from breaking down


At least BG would want you to believe this.


There was actually a VOA on the BG MOA, it actually does have high levels of additives.


But they may not even be good if you are using quality oil.
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#3159242 - 10/17/13 07:30 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Donald]
Donald Offline


Registered: 03/21/04
Posts: 13433
Loc: Upstate NY
Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: volk06
Originally Posted By: Lapithes
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
BG moa is great stuff. It's loaded with calcium, phosphorus, etc. keeps engine clean and keeps the oil from breaking down


At least BG would want you to believe this.


There was actually a VOA on the BG MOA, it actually does have high levels of additives.


But they may not even be good if you are using quality oil.


Too much of a good thing.
_________________________
2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 4.0 - PP & M1
1999 Dodge Ram 2500 w/Cummins - Rotella T6 & M1
Amsoil ATF in both vehicles & Magnefine filter.

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#3159312 - 10/17/13 08:19 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 14485
Loc: Midwest
Quote:
As a side note - get this: The dealer charges for the BG MOA according to the size of the scheduled service. eg. at the 5k service MOA is $10, at the 40k which is a major service you pay $30 for the MOA. It's included in the scheduled service package but not listed anywhere until you get the receipt and it's listed under materials. Talk bout taking advantage!


The dealer is simply increasing his profit margin. Personally, I would refuse and state it in writing.

Have the dealer show you where the OEM requires the MOA or any additive for that matter.
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#3159387 - 10/17/13 09:21 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: MolaKule]
lubedude13 Offline


Registered: 07/14/13
Posts: 377
Loc: North Carolina
From a dealers standpoint when it's sold for $9.99 the profit is only a little over $3. BG stands behind their products if used every 7500 miles or less with a $4000 engine protection warranty for the lifetime of the engine. It is a benefit to the customer even if it don't show an immediate benefit to the oil


Edited by lubedude13 (10/17/13 09:22 PM)
_________________________
2010 Toyota Camry:
Amsoil Signature Series 0W20
Amsoil Signature Series Trans Fluid
Amsoil ATF Power Steering Fluid

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#3159441 - 10/17/13 10:28 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: MolaKule]
zeuloa Offline


Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 99
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Quote:
As a side note - get this: The dealer charges for the BG MOA according to the size of the scheduled service. eg. at the 5k service MOA is $10, at the 40k which is a major service you pay $30 for the MOA. It's included in the scheduled service package but not listed anywhere until you get the receipt and it's listed under materials. Talk bout taking advantage!


The dealer is simply increasing his profit margin. Personally, I would refuse and state it in writing.

Have the dealer show you where the OEM requires the MOA or any additive for that matter.



I understand, and that's ok as long as they are straightforward about it. First time I serviced the car there (@ 40k. The 30k was done elsewhere) I asked for a list of everything that was done, they gave me a printout and there was no mention of MOA. Once I received the receipt I saw it and asked. They told me it's a material, like grease or brake cleaner, etc. To me this is dishonest, as well as changing the price of MOA according to the price of service.

Regarding BG's warranty, I'm in Nicaragua, I doubt they would honor here.

I used to work for a car manufacturer and dealt with dealers and know their tricks. At the end of the day it was the honest ones that had the most customers, made the most money and kept their doors open the longest.


Edited by zeuloa (10/17/13 10:35 PM)
_________________________
2010 Toyota Corolla w/ 3ZZ-FE and M/T, TGMO 10w30 w/ TOYOTA Filter

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#3159456 - 10/17/13 10:42 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
Most likely BG hires a third party agency to handle their "Lifetime BG Protection Plan" claims, which specializes in finding any way possible to deny a claim.


Edited by Lapithes (10/17/13 10:47 PM)

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#3159591 - 10/18/13 05:46 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Lapithes]
lubedude13 Offline


Registered: 07/14/13
Posts: 377
Loc: North Carolina
Don't downgrade BG unless you've dealt with their warranty. We have and they do honor it
_________________________
2010 Toyota Camry:
Amsoil Signature Series 0W20
Amsoil Signature Series Trans Fluid
Amsoil ATF Power Steering Fluid

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#3159601 - 10/18/13 06:38 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: lubedude13]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
Don't downgrade BG unless you've dealt with their warranty. We have and they do honor it


I never downgraded BG. I just stated something which is most likely true. If it bothers you, don't read my posts. All you have to do is click on my profile name, and you'll see the ignore option.


Edited by Lapithes (10/18/13 06:46 AM)

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#3159629 - 10/18/13 07:33 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: MolaKule]
Garak Online   content


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 11327
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Have the dealer show you where the OEM requires the MOA or any additive for that matter.

Ford and Nissan/Infiniti in this city push the stuff, too. Of course, the manual prohibits additives, Infiniti Canada uses Mobil products as service fill (and XOM doesn't want additives either), yet they do it.
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Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 coupe - Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40, Hastings LF113
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#3159636 - 10/18/13 07:37 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Garak]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
Originally Posted By: Garak
Ford and Nissan/Infiniti in this city push the stuff, too. Of course, the manual prohibits additives, Infiniti Canada uses Mobil products as service fill (and XOM doesn't want additives either), yet they do it.


Kind of reminds me of how Jiffy Lube tries to upsell washer fluid.


Edited by Lapithes (10/18/13 07:38 AM)

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#3159673 - 10/18/13 08:13 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
BG MOA may compliment an oil that has a lousy/weak additive package, but I just don't see the point in using it with an oil that already has an excellent and advanced add pack. Why salt your eggs twice (yes, I know that some of us really like our sodium)? Now, if your engine has sludge or varnish buildup, maybe BG MOA would help clean some of it out, but it's not marketed as a cleaner. It's marketed as a wondrous marvel that lets your engine run without oil, and protects your bearings by means of a trade secret that the oil companies can't seem to reverse engineer. Imagine a mid-sized company which sold a technology to turn a regular tire into a run-flat tire, but Goodyear couldn't figure the technology out. If BG or any other additive manufacturer wants to convince me that there is actual third-party data/proof behind their product, I will get busy reading.


Edited by Lapithes (10/18/13 08:26 AM)

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#3160189 - 10/18/13 06:31 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
steve20 Offline


Registered: 06/19/07
Posts: 3065
Loc: NJ
thanks for the reference to VOA--if you cleaned up the impurities and took the moly out of BG MOA, it would be very similar to the stuff in the pink bottle
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#3160197 - 10/18/13 06:47 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Lapithes]
lubedude13 Offline


Registered: 07/14/13
Posts: 377
Loc: North Carolina
Private message me and I can send you email links of bg studies
_________________________
2010 Toyota Camry:
Amsoil Signature Series 0W20
Amsoil Signature Series Trans Fluid
Amsoil ATF Power Steering Fluid

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#3164975 - 10/23/13 01:28 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: lubedude13]
zeuloa Offline


Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 99
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
Private message me and I can send you email links of bg studies


Thanks for the studies. They seem a bit vague, and they don't really tip the scale for me. I still don't think MOA can do anything that a good oil with API SN won't do.
_________________________
2010 Toyota Corolla w/ 3ZZ-FE and M/T, TGMO 10w30 w/ TOYOTA Filter

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#3164976 - 10/23/13 01:28 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: steve20]
zeuloa Offline


Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 99
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: steve20
thanks for the reference to VOA--if you cleaned up the impurities and took the moly out of BG MOA, it would be very similar to the stuff in the pink bottle


What is the pink bottle?
_________________________
2010 Toyota Corolla w/ 3ZZ-FE and M/T, TGMO 10w30 w/ TOYOTA Filter

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#3165002 - 10/23/13 01:41 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
Boss302fan Offline


Registered: 11/07/09
Posts: 1915
Loc: Oconomowoc Wi
I would use it for a one time OCI with PYB to help as a cleaner... BG products are very good and this looks like it would help clean up an engine.

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#3165388 - 10/23/13 06:44 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Boss302fan]
zeuloa Offline


Registered: 09/29/13
Posts: 99
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: Boss302fan
I would use it for a one time OCI with PYB to help as a cleaner... BG products are very good and this looks like it would help clean up an engine.


If that's the case than my engine must be squeaky clean as it's been used by dealer at all but 1 oil change. However, I dont plan to use it any longer.
_________________________
2010 Toyota Corolla w/ 3ZZ-FE and M/T, TGMO 10w30 w/ TOYOTA Filter

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#3167811 - 10/25/13 08:06 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
vssjim Offline


Registered: 10/05/11
Posts: 350
Loc: McLean, Va.
To be 100 % on the up and up about MOA every car I have worked on it that used it looked dirty inside, we don't sell BG at work but have some people that bring it with them. BG 44K doesn't show me much either we use Techron because it works better in our inspections with cars that have used both and Techron is a better value cost wise. I always worry about companies that bribe users or salesmen.

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#3167937 - 10/25/13 11:14 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: vssjim]
Lapithes Offline


Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 59
Loc: United States
Originally Posted By: vssjim
To be 100 % on the up and up about MOA every car I have worked on it that used it looked dirty inside


Wow...that is interesting. I wonder if that's just a coincidence, because if it isn't, it totally goes against what BG MOA is supposed to do.


Edited by Lapithes (10/25/13 11:21 PM)

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#3172271 - 10/30/13 06:57 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: lubedude13]
itguy08 Offline


Registered: 09/15/11
Posts: 1540
Loc: Central PA
Originally Posted By: lubedude13
Private message me and I can send you email links of bg studies


If it's anything like their [censored] "bgfueltest.com" website/car experiment you could drive a tractor trailer through the holes in their "studies".

There are lots wrong with their "study" but the huge one is when they do the dyno runs (you can see on Youtube) they dyno an AWD car on a 2WD dyno with the driveshaft disconnected and the AWD MIL light on! And then never post the dyno runs.
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#3174671 - 11/01/13 05:36 AM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: vssjim]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 21079
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: vssjim
I always worry about companies that bribe users or salesmen.


Me too, be it free product in exchange for positive testimony, or a cash kick back. Good products usually have no problems getting repeat customers or referrals based on their merits. I really can't speak one way or another for BG products though. They were sold at a few dealerships I worked for in the service department.
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#3192982 - 11/20/13 02:46 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
coachditka Offline


Registered: 07/15/09
Posts: 180
Loc: Texas
I have used BG transmission service (with my Amsoil fluid) and coolant service with great success.



A couple of weeks ago, I had to replace the oil pressure sending unit on my Titan. Much to my chagrin, I did not realize that so much oil would come out when I removed the sensor.

Long story short, I wound up having to do a complete oil change that I was not prepared for. I had my filter, but was not stocked on PU. Didn't feel like going to Walmart so I went to Oreilly and got 7qts of M1 5w30 cause it was on sale.

Had a valve tick with the M1 that I don't get with the PU. Got myself a can of the BG MOA and I swear the tick stopped immediately. Much quieter engine with the MOA and M1.

I'll send a UOA when I change this time to see if there is anything special.

I will say that I like the BG products much more than I like the shops pushing a warranty. I buy products based on performance, not warranty.
_________________________
2005 Nissan Titan
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#3220702 - 12/18/13 01:29 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: Lapithes]
postjeeprcr Offline


Registered: 01/05/09
Posts: 1779
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Lapithes
BG markets their products through dealers and mechanics, but you can also find it on eBay. I haven't seen any evidence that an engine with MOA lasts longer than one without, but if that evidence exists, I would like to take a look at it.


That would be impossible to prove with any additive, too many variables.
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#3223006 - 12/20/13 06:34 PM Re: BG MOA at every oil change - should I worry? [Re: zeuloa]
mclasser Offline


Registered: 04/13/13
Posts: 378
Loc: DC
Using any additive excessively is never a good idea.
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