Ive been reading that this overseas made German Castrol has a molecular structure then normal stateside Syntec? With a Better additive package? But yet differ from Mobil One's polyolefin base stock and additive package. Is it that big of a difference running GC when it comes to performance?
German Castrol VS. Mobil 1 Molecule Arrangement
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Originally Posted By: Grambo
Ive been reading that this overseas made German Castrol has a molecular structure then normal stateside Syntec? With a Better additive package? But yet differ from Mobil One's polyolefin base stock and additive package.
I understand that Mobil 1 uses primarily group III base stocks, not group IV PAO. What specific grade is in question here? 0W-30? If so, is Mobil 1 0W-30 a group IV PAO?
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Can someone shed more light on this? Sorry to derail the thread, but your question prompted more questions.
Ive been reading that this overseas made German Castrol has a molecular structure then normal stateside Syntec? With a Better additive package? But yet differ from Mobil One's polyolefin base stock and additive package.
I understand that Mobil 1 uses primarily group III base stocks, not group IV PAO. What specific grade is in question here? 0W-30? If so, is Mobil 1 0W-30 a group IV PAO?
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Can someone shed more light on this? Sorry to derail the thread, but your question prompted more questions.
GC was a unique blend of PAO and Esters in a unique formula and it was GREEN. Other than now it is not green I expect the blend has not changed from its basestocks.
Originally Posted By: Unleashedbeast
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Where did you hear this? I don't think the formula was changed when the green dye was removed, and I believe it's still a group IV/V mix.
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Where did you hear this? I don't think the formula was changed when the green dye was removed, and I believe it's still a group IV/V mix.
Originally Posted By: Unleashedbeast
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Can you provide us with a link to the source of this info?
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Can you provide us with a link to the source of this info?
Originally Posted By: Grambo
Ive been reading that this overseas made German Castrol has a molecular structure then normal stateside Syntec?
Probably. But then, it also has a different viscosity grade, and it's made to meet different (and a lot more) OEM specs.
Originally Posted By: Grambo
With a Better additive package?
Not better. Different.
Better for some cars (mostly high performance German cars); not for others (e.g. more common domestic and Japanese cars).
Originally Posted By: Grambo
But yet differ from Mobil One's polyolefin base stock and additive package.
No one really knows what any of Mobil's formulations are, except Mobil and a few folks who are not likely to post here. Same goes for Castrol. And just about every other manufacturer, with a few exceptions.
Much less could anyone compare and contrast among similar formulations and know what they're talking about.
Originally Posted By: Grambo
Is it that big of a difference running GC when it comes to performance?
Maybe, maybe not. Could be better, could be the same, could be worse. Again, depends on the application.
Ive been reading that this overseas made German Castrol has a molecular structure then normal stateside Syntec?
Probably. But then, it also has a different viscosity grade, and it's made to meet different (and a lot more) OEM specs.
Originally Posted By: Grambo
With a Better additive package?
Not better. Different.
Better for some cars (mostly high performance German cars); not for others (e.g. more common domestic and Japanese cars).
Originally Posted By: Grambo
But yet differ from Mobil One's polyolefin base stock and additive package.
No one really knows what any of Mobil's formulations are, except Mobil and a few folks who are not likely to post here. Same goes for Castrol. And just about every other manufacturer, with a few exceptions.
Much less could anyone compare and contrast among similar formulations and know what they're talking about.
Originally Posted By: Grambo
Is it that big of a difference running GC when it comes to performance?
Maybe, maybe not. Could be better, could be the same, could be worse. Again, depends on the application.
It's believed by most GC is still primarily Group IV based.
Mobil 1 is harder to pin down. It's believed all versions used to be primarily Group IV based. Then a year or so ago a lot of the formula's changed to be primarily Group III+ (so called VISOM technology by M1) but a lot of versions remained Group IV, ie: the 0w's like AFE and Euro, High Mileage and the Extended Performance versions. All of this was just best guesses by those looking at Data Sheets, etc.
Then some of the High Mileage Data Sheets just recently changed again. Noting 10w30 HM in particular, where some of the specs like Pour Point became less impressive, so it is wondered if this has also switched over to VISOM. Though nobody knows for sure. This recent change in particular.
The fact is, M1 formula's are proprietary and they keep their secrets as such. People have asked this question point blank but they are not going to be answered. The thing is, we don't know. But we do know that M1's forumula's, as all maker's, change over time... almost universally for the better. M1 has a great track record and looking over most new UOA's show this to be the case.
Any and all good motor oil's use a blend of Group's now as certain ones do things better than other one's so a blend is definitely the way to go. As far as determining the majority of the basestock, it's always going to be unclear unless they release that info (aka Red Line which advertises a majority of Group V, Motul 300v, Royal Purple XPR and likely AMSOIL Dominator).
I think GC is one of the few oil's that BitoG users have paid for themselves for all kinds of testing to determine these things (?). Not sure. But most here seem to say it's still a majority PAO so if that's what you're looking for, this may be your best bet, especially since it is on sales a lot (Pep Boys has it right now with a K&N filter for like $28 I think). Royal Purple's regular line is suspected to be mostly PAO too, with some POE (Synerlec) and I think Group II for solvency. This is all likely, but I'm not sure if it's a known certainty.
Mobil 1 is harder to pin down. It's believed all versions used to be primarily Group IV based. Then a year or so ago a lot of the formula's changed to be primarily Group III+ (so called VISOM technology by M1) but a lot of versions remained Group IV, ie: the 0w's like AFE and Euro, High Mileage and the Extended Performance versions. All of this was just best guesses by those looking at Data Sheets, etc.
Then some of the High Mileage Data Sheets just recently changed again. Noting 10w30 HM in particular, where some of the specs like Pour Point became less impressive, so it is wondered if this has also switched over to VISOM. Though nobody knows for sure. This recent change in particular.
The fact is, M1 formula's are proprietary and they keep their secrets as such. People have asked this question point blank but they are not going to be answered. The thing is, we don't know. But we do know that M1's forumula's, as all maker's, change over time... almost universally for the better. M1 has a great track record and looking over most new UOA's show this to be the case.
Any and all good motor oil's use a blend of Group's now as certain ones do things better than other one's so a blend is definitely the way to go. As far as determining the majority of the basestock, it's always going to be unclear unless they release that info (aka Red Line which advertises a majority of Group V, Motul 300v, Royal Purple XPR and likely AMSOIL Dominator).
I think GC is one of the few oil's that BitoG users have paid for themselves for all kinds of testing to determine these things (?). Not sure. But most here seem to say it's still a majority PAO so if that's what you're looking for, this may be your best bet, especially since it is on sales a lot (Pep Boys has it right now with a K&N filter for like $28 I think). Royal Purple's regular line is suspected to be mostly PAO too, with some POE (Synerlec) and I think Group II for solvency. This is all likely, but I'm not sure if it's a known certainty.
Originally Posted By: Grambo
Im just curious, not trying to start a battle i was just looking around and found everyone talking about this German Castrol,
Everything there is to know about GC is covered in this FAQ thread:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=718643#Post718643
If something was not addressed, then it's most likely that we just don't have an answer.
Im just curious, not trying to start a battle i was just looking around and found everyone talking about this German Castrol,
Everything there is to know about GC is covered in this FAQ thread:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=718643#Post718643
If something was not addressed, then it's most likely that we just don't have an answer.
look what i found! http://www.pepboys.com/sale_specials/coupons/3295_mobil1_oil_change_cp/
Tons of oils have harmless dyes added. My Motul 300V was fluorescent green. Torco has purple oils IIRC.
GC is heavy on PAO and has some group 5 content, from what we've gathered. It may use some group III basestocks but it is definitely not a "primarily group III".
GC is heavy on PAO and has some group 5 content, from what we've gathered. It may use some group III basestocks but it is definitely not a "primarily group III".
^ this
Quote:
I understand that Mobil 1 uses primarily group III base stocks, not group IV PAO.
I doubt this can be stated so cut-and-dryly. I think M1 is probably more likely a blend of GIII+ and PAO with the percentage of each of each varying from each type and grade.
Quote:
What specific grade is in question here? 0W-30? If so, is Mobil 1 0W-30 a group IV PAO?
With a pour point of almost -60F, I'd wager it's mostly PAO.
Quote:
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Doubt they'd still bother to make it in Germany if that were the case. According to a Castrol PDS recently posted here, it's still around -65F for the pour point.
That being said, I realize pour point isn't everything, but I do think it's generally telling...
I understand that Mobil 1 uses primarily group III base stocks, not group IV PAO.
I doubt this can be stated so cut-and-dryly. I think M1 is probably more likely a blend of GIII+ and PAO with the percentage of each of each varying from each type and grade.
Quote:
What specific grade is in question here? 0W-30? If so, is Mobil 1 0W-30 a group IV PAO?
With a pour point of almost -60F, I'd wager it's mostly PAO.
Quote:
New German Castrol is also group III hydrocracked petroleum, not group IV PAO.
Doubt they'd still bother to make it in Germany if that were the case. According to a Castrol PDS recently posted here, it's still around -65F for the pour point.
That being said, I realize pour point isn't everything, but I do think it's generally telling...
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