UAE planning second nuclear plant

[OVERKILL]

After the success of the Barakah plant, which houses 4x Korean APR-1400 reactors and now supplies 25% of the UAE's electricity, the UAE has announced that it is planning on building another plant and starting to do so immediately:
Exclusive: UAE planning second nuclear power plant, sources say | Reuters

One would naturally assume that the Koreans would get preferred status, but apparently not:

The sources said the UAE aims to award the tender and start construction as soon as this year so that the new plant would be operational by 2032 in order to meet projected energy needs.The tender would be open to any potential bidders, including U.S., Chinese and Russian firms, the sources said, adding that South Korea would not be treated as a preferred bidder.

Front runners I would assume would be the Westinghouse AP1000, the Russian VVER-1200, the KEPCO APR-1400, the EDF EPR, the Hualong One and the CAP1000/CAP1400 from China. Without the design yet formalized, I assume AtkinsRéalis won't be bidding the CANDU Monark, though I could be wrong.


Barakah:

 

[GMBoy]

We are going to need a lot more power in just the next 10 years that we cannot support currently in the U.S. Our current administration has purposely made it so that we can't have any new coal or natural gas power plans so Nuclear is our best option given we can't produce enough reliable energy from wind and solar.

 

[ripcord]

We are going to need a lot more power in just the next 10 years that we cannot support currently in the U.S. Our current administration has purposely made it so that we can't have any new coal or natural gas power plans so Nuclear is our best option given we can't produce enough reliable energy from wind and solar.

Our new AI overlords will demand it... But not in my backyard.

 

[GMBoy]

Our new AI overlords will demand it... But not in my backyard.

That is the truth 100%

 

[Skippy722]

Our new AI overlords will demand it... But not in my backyard.

I’m still trying to convince the NRC to put a SMR in my backyard… they won’t return my calls

 

[ripcord]

I’m still trying to convince the NRC to put a SMR in my backyard… they won’t return my calls

I think your HOA told them no.

 

[Skippy722]

I think your HOA told them no.

What’s an HOA?

 

[bbhero]

After the success of the Barakah plant, which houses 4x Korean APR-1400 reactors and now supplies 25% of the UAE's electricity, the UAE has announced that it is planning on building another plant and starting to do so immediately:
Exclusive: UAE planning second nuclear power plant, sources say | Reuters

One would naturally assume that the Koreans would get preferred status, but apparently not:


Front runners I would assume would be the Westinghouse AP1000, the Russian VVER-1200, the KEPCO APR-1400, the EDF EPR, the Hualong One and the CAP1000/CAP1400 from China. Without the design yet formalized, I assume AtkinsRéalis won't be bidding the CANDU Monark, though I could be wrong.


Barakah:
View attachment 216281

Could…. These reactors be possibly… Used for “ other purposes “ ?

 

[OVERKILL]

Could…. These reactors be possibly… Used for “ other purposes “ ?

They are standard PWR's, so no, they aren't suitable for making weapons material. The concern would be if they were enriching their own uranium, as a cascade of gas centrifuges can be used to enrich beyond the 5% limit, but I don't believe that's the case, they are buying fuel from somewhere else, probably France.

It's research reactors that are the concern, as they are designed to produce various isotopes and easily have things inserted and removed from the core. The research reactor at Chalk River here in Ontario produced weapons material for the US during the 2nd world war, despite Canada never having a nuclear weapons program. They of course have also been used to produce various medical isotopes, which is one of their primary uses.

Of course you don't need reactors at all to make weapons materials, the easiest is through highly enriched uranium, which involves a gas centrifuge cascade.

It was the CIRUS research reactor, developed by AECL (based on NRX), that led to India having atomic weapons. We had partnered with them to allow them to use the CANDU design for power generation, and also a derivative of NRX (CIRUS) for research purposes. Well, they used CIRUS to produce bomb material, which resulted in the immediate termination of that relationship and it meant that they were only ever able to build one CANDU with AECL, based on the 220MWe Douglas Point design. That was enough for them to reverse-engineer that design however and they developed their own small fleet of these ~200MWe units and then later, completely independent from Canada, developed their own ~700MWe nominal version, which is very similar to the CANDU 6.

 

[PandaBear]

They are standard PWR's, so no, they aren't suitable for making weapons material. The concern would be if they were enriching their own uranium, as a cascade of gas centrifuges can be used to enrich beyond the 5% limit, but I don't believe that's the case, they are buying fuel from somewhere else, probably France.

It's research reactors that are the concern, as they are designed to produce various isotopes and easily have things inserted and removed from the core. The research reactor at Chalk River here in Ontario produced weapons material for the US during the 2nd world war, despite Canada never having a nuclear weapons program. They of course have also been used to produce various medical isotopes, which is one of their primary uses.

Of course you don't need reactors at all to make weapons materials, the easiest is through highly enriched uranium, which involves a gas centrifuge cascade.

It was the CIRUS research reactor, developed by AECL (based on NRX), that led to India having atomic weapons. We had partnered with them to allow them to use the CANDU design for power generation, and also a derivative of NRX (CIRUS) for research purposes. Well, they used CIRUS to produce bomb material, which resulted in the immediate termination of that relationship and it meant that they were only ever able to build one CANDU with AECL, based on the 220MWe Douglas Point design. That was enough for them to reverse-engineer that design however and they developed their own small fleet of these ~200MWe units and then later, completely independent from Canada, developed their own ~700MWe nominal version, which is very similar to the CANDU 6.

Is CANDU style design being technologically limited by the amount of heavy water they need? or other material / control know how?

 

[OVERKILL]

Is CANDU style design being technologically limited by the amount of heavy water they need? or other material / control know how?

We only ever mass produced 2 cores:
- 380 fuel channel (Pickering B and the CAND 6)
- 480 fuel channel (Bruce and Darlington)

In theory, you could add more pressure tubes and make the core even larger, which was the plan, but then of course the 90's happened and things sort of went to hell in the market and eventually CANDU Energy was sold to SNC Lavalin so AECL didn't put any further effort into refining the design and SNC (now AtkinsRealis) was more interested in after sales support, though they are now involved in the completion of several partially built units in Romania and developing the new Monark design in hopes to win the Bruce C site contract, but that's a 480 fuel channel design, just improved.

Heavy water is expensive, but you do only buy it once, it's a sunk cost, part of CAPEX not OPEX, but that does impact unit price.

 

[Bill Judson]

UAE planning second nuclear plant

At least it looks like UAE provides covered parking for their employees.... that's a nice perk

But not in my backyard.

Exactly man, who wants to live by a nuke plant anyway?

 

[Skippy722]

Exactly man, who wants to live by a nuke plant anyway?

I’ll take a nuke over a coal plant any day.

 

[Bill Judson]

I’ll take a nuke over a coal plant any day.

Yep, it's all good till someone isn't paying attention and the place turns in to Chernobyl

This is a very real possibility and it's why so many resist nuclear power plants.

 

[Skippy722]

Yep, it's all good till someone isn't paying attention and the place turns in to Chernobyl

This is a very real possibility and it's why so many resist nuclear power plants.

RBMK reactors had no containment building and a massive core with a positive void coefficient, reactors in the US and Canada are built far far more robustly and with negative void coefficients.

 

[bbhero]

Yep, it's all good till someone isn't paying attention and the place turns in to Chernobyl

This is a very real possibility and it's why so many resist nuclear power plants.

Funny… The person running that test at Chernobyl and others were all paying attention. Pulling way, way too many control rods out of that reactor.

It was that leaders decisions that led to that disaster taking place..: And the RMBK design was inherently unstable and dangerous to begin with.

And the stunning lack of reactor containment was legendarily STUPID and lacking any real protection.

 

[Pew]

Yep, it's all good till someone isn't paying attention and the place turns in to Chernobyl

This is a very real possibility and it's why so many resist nuclear power plants.

I live by 5 of them. Not glowing green yet.

 

[OVERKILL]

Yep, it's all good till someone isn't paying attention and the place turns in to Chernobyl

This is a very real possibility and it's why so many resist nuclear power plants.

It's not a real possibility, Chornobyl had no containment and nobody is building RBMK's.

 

[OVERKILL]

Exactly man, who wants to live by a nuke plant anyway?

Lots of people.

 

[wavinwayne]

Exactly man, who wants to live by a nuke plant anyway?

The fastest growing county in my home state is home to one.