i wasn't sure to post this here or the racing forum, i went for this since my car is not a race car, just something i take to HPDEs. 2013 subaru brz. manual states 0w20 and recommends 5w30 for hard driving.
ok fellas i have a bunch of data and pics.
first up is autobahn full in august. i don't recall outdoor temps and am too lazy to look up. iirc i don't think the airaid was even in at this point. actually now i'm thinking it was. in any case, here is my data from several sessions from the day. i have oil temp (blue), coolant temp (red), and intake temp (green) all on the left axis in F - on the second axis for [censored] although not that interesting is first cat temp (thin purple). i'm using amsoil 0w20 signature series in these first two charts.
so pretty hotsy motsy and where i rendered this data on one of my videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CL5OeHDvIHc
i did a day at gingerman a bit later. also hot stuff.
i sent in the oil for analysis to blackstone. it was freshly put in oil, after the autobahn full track day (single day) iirc. they responded with this:
obd2 does not provide oil pressure. i was a bit worried. per Dezoris' thread/vid
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76760
Quote:
STREET TEMPS
0W20 Redline
0w20 Redline 185F @ 800RPM 10PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 185F @ 2000RPM 35PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 185F @ 4000RPM 54PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 185F @ 7000RPM 65PSI Oil Pressure
10W30 Redline
10w30 Redline 185F @ 800RPM 19PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 185F @ 2000RPM 51PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 185F @ 4000RPM 65PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 185F @ 7000RPM 83PSI Oil Pressure
10W40 Redline
10w40 Redline 185F @ 800RPM 25PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 185F @ 2000RPM 64PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 185F @ 4000RPM 78PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 185F @ 7000RPM 91PSI Oil Pressure
TRACK TEMPS AFTER 9 LAPS @ 1 Minute 15 Seconds Per Lap
0W20 Redline
0w20 Redline 225F @ 800RPM 7PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 225F @ 2000RPM 30PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 225F @ 4000RPM 48PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 225F @ 7000RPM 43PSI Oil Pressure
10W30 Redline
10w30 Redline 245F @ 800RPM 7PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 245F @ 2000RPM 35PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 245F @ 4000RPM 52PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 245F @ 7000RPM 46PSI Oil Pressure
10W40 Redline (12 Laps)
10w40 Redline 265F @ 800RPM 8PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 265F @ 2000RPM 31PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 265F @ 4000RPM 55PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 265F @ 7000RPM 45PSI Oil Pressure
i am unclear exactly what is "bad" and it seems to be the desires pressure is r's x 10 + 10 so 3000 rpm = 40 desires, 6000 rpm = 70 desired.
based on the above, i decided to try a heavier oil. although the manual also says 5w30, i went for 10w30. no FI and i figured 30 seemed heavier enough to provide benefits. my (internet myth?) understanding is the narrower range means it can withstand more "abuse" - based on essentially nothing. some of the stats between 5w30 amsoil signature and 10w30 look close enough that i'm wondering if i bought the wrong oil, and that 5w30 would take the same heat but be better for cold starts.
installed a bunch of [censored] since these track days -
flex fuel kit, delicious stage 2 tune
ceramic coated jdl el catted header - amazingly you can touch it after a session
gold wrapped my intake
zeek air scoop snorkel
forester oil cooler
koyo radiator
so not apples/apples with only one element changed here. also installed sandwich plate with oil pressure and temp guages. i set the "oh noes" mark for oil at 260 and pressure at 40.
now that i have all this infos, it was interesting to me to see how long it actually takes to warm up the oil. although it is now quicker to warm it up than without this kit, it still takes a few minutes - i never realized that. my putzing around town seems to sit around 180-190 degrees. being more of a bone 200-210. cruising down the highway sitting at 80-85 i hit 220, 60 psi and at 3.5k rpm.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKKKnGRVXB8
no data or video for pressure on track but i appear to have more favorable results than dezoris. i will mount a camera to the left of my helmet this saturday at gingerman to get a view of them. i was concentrating more on driving and had an instructor as well, so didn't want to appear (and be) distracted looking at these things, but what i did notice - oil would get up to 240-260 but around 6000 rpm, iirc, my pressure was still looking pretty good - 60+. this seems much better than the results above.
i also noticed during cool down the temps rapidly came down. certainly working great there. the first day was my first track day for the year, and the first 2 sessions were quite wet. i got braver on the next 2 as it dried out and i was becoming more familiar with the car and track and driving at my own pace again, which i consider an intermediate+ driver.
the second day was cooler out but stayed dry. it might have been around the same temp in the afternoon (70s/low 80s?). these were 25 minute sessions.
the data is as follows:
i parked next to my buddy jeff with an e36 m3 that seems to be reliable as [censored], and he appears to cruise all day long with no problems at 200. a few cars down was a guy with a gutted e46 m3 and a bigger aftermarket oil cooler who gunned for 240-260. so that being not ideal, but kind of acceptable, at least made me feel a bit better about my temps.
adding some more to my post 474 - http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2253620&postcount=474
i went to gingerman today, it got up to around 80 or so outside.
it's amusing that you can tell by oil temps that my last 2 sessions were nice and my others were full of trains and messes. who did not stick it out through the last 2 sessions of the day, thankfully.
my oil temp (sandwich) and data temp (obd2, wherever that sensor is) are off from eachother, i think putzing around the gauge was higher? it certainly seems to be the case here. max oil 251. but if you look at my gauges (pressure then oil, left to right)
the oil seems higher than my max of 251 in the data. i thought i saw it getting near 255 maybe + but def not 260 or over. in any case here's a snapshot from the helmet cam vid:
this is from the long straight at gingerman, so top out 3rd then here i'm topping out 4th. i look to be about 7000+ rpms. my understanding is the desired pressure would be 80 psi, but i don't seem to be in too bad of shape at what appears to be around 60 psi.
i flirt with the idea of a twin screw sc kit some time next year, although probably better for me to get more seat time than more power (but hard to resist!)
in any case i am looking for opinions on the current situation. if heat is the enemy it would seem arguable that i should simply get a regular air oil cooler. note i am in chicagoland but do not drive this in the winter (although would when it is cooler out but not snow season.) or if this is an acceptable range and my oil pressure is acceptable, perhaps i should simply happily cruise along with the state as-is until i do do something more drastic like add FI?
posted this on ft86 club but reposting over here to get some expert opinions from the oil guys.
1. what/why should i choose among 0w30, 5w30, 10w30 ?
2. my amsoil seems to have much more favorable results than the redline quoted above by another member - why is that?
3. am i in a "don't worry about it you are good range" or a "you should really consider an air oil cooler" range?
4. would a pan with more oil capacity do anything other than simply delay reaching these same temps 30 seconds later?
5. would going forced induction, say a supercharger adding 80 more whp, cause the oil to run much hotter? or who knows until we do it?
6. given i am running all e85 now on my flex fuel tune, should i be changing my oil more frequently?
ok fellas i have a bunch of data and pics.
first up is autobahn full in august. i don't recall outdoor temps and am too lazy to look up. iirc i don't think the airaid was even in at this point. actually now i'm thinking it was. in any case, here is my data from several sessions from the day. i have oil temp (blue), coolant temp (red), and intake temp (green) all on the left axis in F - on the second axis for [censored] although not that interesting is first cat temp (thin purple). i'm using amsoil 0w20 signature series in these first two charts.
so pretty hotsy motsy and where i rendered this data on one of my videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CL5OeHDvIHc
i did a day at gingerman a bit later. also hot stuff.
i sent in the oil for analysis to blackstone. it was freshly put in oil, after the autobahn full track day (single day) iirc. they responded with this:
obd2 does not provide oil pressure. i was a bit worried. per Dezoris' thread/vid
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76760
Quote:
STREET TEMPS
0W20 Redline
0w20 Redline 185F @ 800RPM 10PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 185F @ 2000RPM 35PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 185F @ 4000RPM 54PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 185F @ 7000RPM 65PSI Oil Pressure
10W30 Redline
10w30 Redline 185F @ 800RPM 19PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 185F @ 2000RPM 51PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 185F @ 4000RPM 65PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 185F @ 7000RPM 83PSI Oil Pressure
10W40 Redline
10w40 Redline 185F @ 800RPM 25PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 185F @ 2000RPM 64PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 185F @ 4000RPM 78PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 185F @ 7000RPM 91PSI Oil Pressure
TRACK TEMPS AFTER 9 LAPS @ 1 Minute 15 Seconds Per Lap
0W20 Redline
0w20 Redline 225F @ 800RPM 7PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 225F @ 2000RPM 30PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 225F @ 4000RPM 48PSI Oil Pressure
0w20 Redline 225F @ 7000RPM 43PSI Oil Pressure
10W30 Redline
10w30 Redline 245F @ 800RPM 7PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 245F @ 2000RPM 35PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 245F @ 4000RPM 52PSI Oil Pressure
10w30 Redline 245F @ 7000RPM 46PSI Oil Pressure
10W40 Redline (12 Laps)
10w40 Redline 265F @ 800RPM 8PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 265F @ 2000RPM 31PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 265F @ 4000RPM 55PSI Oil Pressure
10w40 Redline 265F @ 7000RPM 45PSI Oil Pressure
i am unclear exactly what is "bad" and it seems to be the desires pressure is r's x 10 + 10 so 3000 rpm = 40 desires, 6000 rpm = 70 desired.
based on the above, i decided to try a heavier oil. although the manual also says 5w30, i went for 10w30. no FI and i figured 30 seemed heavier enough to provide benefits. my (internet myth?) understanding is the narrower range means it can withstand more "abuse" - based on essentially nothing. some of the stats between 5w30 amsoil signature and 10w30 look close enough that i'm wondering if i bought the wrong oil, and that 5w30 would take the same heat but be better for cold starts.
installed a bunch of [censored] since these track days -
flex fuel kit, delicious stage 2 tune
ceramic coated jdl el catted header - amazingly you can touch it after a session
gold wrapped my intake
zeek air scoop snorkel
forester oil cooler
koyo radiator
so not apples/apples with only one element changed here. also installed sandwich plate with oil pressure and temp guages. i set the "oh noes" mark for oil at 260 and pressure at 40.
now that i have all this infos, it was interesting to me to see how long it actually takes to warm up the oil. although it is now quicker to warm it up than without this kit, it still takes a few minutes - i never realized that. my putzing around town seems to sit around 180-190 degrees. being more of a bone 200-210. cruising down the highway sitting at 80-85 i hit 220, 60 psi and at 3.5k rpm.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKKKnGRVXB8
no data or video for pressure on track but i appear to have more favorable results than dezoris. i will mount a camera to the left of my helmet this saturday at gingerman to get a view of them. i was concentrating more on driving and had an instructor as well, so didn't want to appear (and be) distracted looking at these things, but what i did notice - oil would get up to 240-260 but around 6000 rpm, iirc, my pressure was still looking pretty good - 60+. this seems much better than the results above.
i also noticed during cool down the temps rapidly came down. certainly working great there. the first day was my first track day for the year, and the first 2 sessions were quite wet. i got braver on the next 2 as it dried out and i was becoming more familiar with the car and track and driving at my own pace again, which i consider an intermediate+ driver.
the second day was cooler out but stayed dry. it might have been around the same temp in the afternoon (70s/low 80s?). these were 25 minute sessions.
the data is as follows:
i parked next to my buddy jeff with an e36 m3 that seems to be reliable as [censored], and he appears to cruise all day long with no problems at 200. a few cars down was a guy with a gutted e46 m3 and a bigger aftermarket oil cooler who gunned for 240-260. so that being not ideal, but kind of acceptable, at least made me feel a bit better about my temps.
adding some more to my post 474 - http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2253620&postcount=474
i went to gingerman today, it got up to around 80 or so outside.
it's amusing that you can tell by oil temps that my last 2 sessions were nice and my others were full of trains and messes. who did not stick it out through the last 2 sessions of the day, thankfully.
my oil temp (sandwich) and data temp (obd2, wherever that sensor is) are off from eachother, i think putzing around the gauge was higher? it certainly seems to be the case here. max oil 251. but if you look at my gauges (pressure then oil, left to right)
the oil seems higher than my max of 251 in the data. i thought i saw it getting near 255 maybe + but def not 260 or over. in any case here's a snapshot from the helmet cam vid:
this is from the long straight at gingerman, so top out 3rd then here i'm topping out 4th. i look to be about 7000+ rpms. my understanding is the desired pressure would be 80 psi, but i don't seem to be in too bad of shape at what appears to be around 60 psi.
i flirt with the idea of a twin screw sc kit some time next year, although probably better for me to get more seat time than more power (but hard to resist!)
in any case i am looking for opinions on the current situation. if heat is the enemy it would seem arguable that i should simply get a regular air oil cooler. note i am in chicagoland but do not drive this in the winter (although would when it is cooler out but not snow season.) or if this is an acceptable range and my oil pressure is acceptable, perhaps i should simply happily cruise along with the state as-is until i do do something more drastic like add FI?
posted this on ft86 club but reposting over here to get some expert opinions from the oil guys.
1. what/why should i choose among 0w30, 5w30, 10w30 ?
2. my amsoil seems to have much more favorable results than the redline quoted above by another member - why is that?
3. am i in a "don't worry about it you are good range" or a "you should really consider an air oil cooler" range?
4. would a pan with more oil capacity do anything other than simply delay reaching these same temps 30 seconds later?
5. would going forced induction, say a supercharger adding 80 more whp, cause the oil to run much hotter? or who knows until we do it?
6. given i am running all e85 now on my flex fuel tune, should i be changing my oil more frequently?