small traffic circle driving rules: right of way

[andrewg]

Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: andrewg
That photo is the southeast? Looks like very close to where I live.

In a traffic circle or "round-a-bout", the traffic IN the circle has the right of way.

So as you approach, you need to only look to your LEFT to see if any vehicles are in the circle....if so....you MUST yield to them.

In your situation I would suppose you need to get to the circle before the other person does if you want the right-of-way.


no, the picture is from your area indeed. how did you guess?

the more I think about it, the more you are right. the only problem is, there is hardly a circle, if were to get on the "circle", I would have collided. I guess if in doubt, yield to the person on the right should be safe.


I guessed it was because of the wet road...trees...and basic undergrowth. It looks very similar to the small traffic circles I've seen near a city called Federal Way....but these minor ones all look very similar.

In your situation...you've got an idiot driver that is just being rude by wanting to simply blast through the circle in total disregard for anybody else. That is my rub with these circles. It's odd that when these city/traffic planners come up with these bright ideas to speed up traffic flow....they don't take into account those that abuse the rules and just want to take advantage of the situation. Idiots are everywhere in this area....and for me, traffic circles are a BIG cautionary driving situation. Fools and morons CONSTANTLY just drive right in front of you on these circles...rarely yield.

If you don't want an accident (regardless who has the right of way), just assume the jerks will drive right into the circle no matter where you are in relation to them.

Remember....the general populace is too stupid AND too self-absorbed to follow rules that are not enforced.

 

[totegoat]

It amazes me the number of drivers that don't even look to see if someone else is in the circle. I ride my bike through one often. Gotta look and listen.

 

[AdmdeVilleneuve]

I hate the multi-lane roundabouts with a passion. They work fine, if there is light traffic. Avoid them during rush hour.

Notice in the WSDOT example a left turning vehicle enters a two lane wide roundabout's inside lane, proceeds to drive around the interior, and completes the intended left turn by cutting across the outside lane, which is then on the driver's right side. So, if simple 90 degree right turning traffic has just entered the empty outside lane of the roundabout, the left turning vehicle in the inside land can no longer easily exit the roundabout.

 

[geeman789]

We have a couple of "true..." multi-lane traffic circles... number 1 or 2 intersection for most accidents ... every year. People just don't know how to drive thru one, which really isn't a surprise. I had never even seen one until I changed cities... same province...!

For those who figure them out, they do work very well in light to medium traffic... rush hour, not so good.

Unfortunately, when someone who has never seen one before, and doesn't remember that ONE paragraph description from drivers ed many years back... comes across one, sometimes bad things happen. The city here is considering removing the existing circles, because years of accident data prove one thing...

Many drivers don't know how to think...they NEED a red light stop, green light go, or they can't function. Scary.

 

[Whitewolf]

Roundabouts have been functioning in the UK for years and, although they obviously flow in the opposite direction to those in the USA, the rule is clear, give way to traffic that is already in the roundabout. Whether they are 'normal' or 'mini' roundabouts is irrelevant. What I see now that they have been introduced around here is that they are dangerous simply because of lack of driver education/knowledge. Several of my colleagues, knowing that I am from the UK, have asked me what are the rules over there because they are confused about who has priority.

 

[HerrStig]

"All hope abandon". The rule in Massachusetts is the bigger the "firster".

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: Whitewolf
Whether they are 'normal' or 'mini' roundabouts is irrelevant.


In theory, I agree. But in practice there really is a HUGE difference.

REAL roundabouts are large enough so that there are 2-3 car-lengths between any pair of entry/exit roads to the roundabout. If two cars arrive simultaneously, all either one has to do is yield to any traffic already in the roundabout. If there's no traffic in the roundabout, they don't have to look at each OTHER at all, they just both enter and they'll wind up nose-to-tail. Also the entry and exits are smooth, flowing curves so that you can move through the roundabout smoothly.

"Mini" roundabouts are converted from 4-way stops. There's not even room "in" a roundabout for more than two cars (on opposite sides) at the same time. When two cars arrive simultaneously, they have to check not only for traffic in the roundabout, but also for each other. When there's stacked up traffic on two or more entries to the roundabout, it really does just revert to a 4-way stop for all intents and purposes, but there's no signage or training or anything that really makes that apparent. The entry and exits are right-angle turns, so there's no smoothness to be expected. You never know at which exit the guy in front of you is going to brake to turn out.

 

[hotwheels]

I wish we had roundabouts here instead of 4-way stops at every intersection for a mile. People who can't count to four and who need psychic powers to figure out the proper order in which to proceed at 4-way stops may do better with roundabouts.

hotwheels

 

[javacontour]

No, they go anti-clockwise if I recall my British English correctly.

Originally Posted By: Donald
In UK they go clockwise vs counter clockwise.

 

[javacontour]

Years ago in Boston when returning to the airport in my rental via the Callahan Tunnel, I would scare the cabbies who thought they could bully their way at that convoluted intersection. Little did they expect that rental cars really have the right of way in most situations.

Originally Posted By: HerrStig
"All hope abandon". The rule in Massachusetts is the bigger the "firster".

 

[Whitewolf]

Originally Posted By: AdmdeVilleneuve
I hate the multi-lane roundabouts with a passion. They work fine, if there is light traffic. Avoid them during rush hour.

Notice in the WSDOT example a left turning vehicle enters a two lane wide roundabout's inside lane, proceeds to drive around the interior, and completes the intended left turn by cutting across the outside lane, which is then on the driver's right side. So, if simple 90 degree right turning traffic has just entered the empty outside lane of the roundabout, the left turning vehicle in the inside land can no longer easily exit the roundabout.


Depending on the configuration of the roundabout if the intention is to make a 90 right then enter in the entry road right lane, which is the roundabout outside lane, signaling right, (I realise that signal is a bit of a novelty in the USA, it's activated by one of those things on the steering column). Similarly if going straight on but signal the intention to exit the roundabout so that traffic entering the roundabout knows what you intend to do. If you are intending to do more than a 180 in the roundabout, enter in the outside road lane, which is the roundabout inside lane, then change lanes in the roundabout (signaling) to take the outside roundabout lane ready to exit right, signaling that intention. It's easy once you get used to it but if everyone doesn't stick to the rules chaos and accidents are often the result.

 

[hotwheels]

Originally Posted By: javacontour
No, they go anti-clockwise if I recall my British English correctly.

Originally Posted By: Donald
In UK they go clockwise vs counter clockwise.


I hope I will never find you heading head-on for me in a roundabout.

Not many here wear a watch, especially not an analog one, so they don't know which way is clockwise. QUED.

hotwheels.

 

[javacontour]

You are right, I was correcting the word, not the direction. The British would say we go anti-clockwise around a roundabout.

Don't worry, my wife lived in Japan courtesy of the Navy, so she is in charge of driving in LHD countries. I am in charge of driving in all RHD countries.


Originally Posted By: hotwheels
Originally Posted By: javacontour
No, they go anti-clockwise if I recall my British English correctly.

Originally Posted By: Donald
In UK they go clockwise vs counter clockwise.


I hope I will never find you heading head-on for me in a roundabout.

Not many here wear a watch, especially not an analog one, so they don't know which way is clockwise. QUED.

hotwheels.

 

[hotwheels]

Originally Posted By: javacontour
You are right, I was correcting the word, not the direction. The British would say we go anti-clockwise around a roundabout.

No, they go anti-clockwise if I recall my British English correctly.


I didn't think that counterclockwise and anticlockwise required an explanation to point out their synoymity. Contraclockwise, anyone?

Now, let's all levorotate or dextrorotate in unison, wherever we may be.

hotwheels

 

[1000MPH]

We have a few real ones in my town with good signage and markings. We also have a few of the traffic calming variety in the residential areas. If they are not clearly marked as a roundabout or traffic circle, or have no yield or one way signs, I will often go the wrong direction on purpose. "As far as I can tell, officer, it is just an unmarked intersection."

 

[Whitewolf]

Don't worry, it's very confusing when you try to describe it. I just had trouble with that. When you are doing it you just do it.The thing is that if you grew up with roundabouts it's ok but if you didn't I can see why there is a problem with them and I sympathise.

 

[Whitewolf]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: Whitewolf
Whether they are 'normal' or 'mini' roundabouts is irrelevant.


In theory, I agree. But in practice there really is a HUGE difference.

REAL roundabouts are large enough so that there are 2-3 car-lengths between any pair of entry/exit roads to the roundabout. If two cars arrive simultaneously, all either one has to do is yield to any traffic already in the roundabout. If there's no traffic in the roundabout, they don't have to look at each OTHER at all, they just both enter and they'll wind up nose-to-tail. Also the entry and exits are smooth, flowing curves so that you can move through the roundabout smoothly.

"Mini" roundabouts are converted from 4-way stops. There's not even room "in" a roundabout for more than two cars (on opposite sides) at the same time. When two cars arrive simultaneously, they have to check not only for traffic in the roundabout, but also for each other. When there's stacked up traffic on two or more entries to the roundabout, it really does just revert to a 4-way stop for all intents and purposes, but there's no signage or training or anything that really makes that apparent. The entry and exits are right-angle turns, so there's no smoothness to be expected. You never know at which exit the guy in front of you is going to brake to turn out.


Yes, there is a big difference depending on the size and configuration. All of the ones that I have encountered in the USA tend to be on the small side, which does make them more difficult. As I have said, people not signaling their intent does not help.

 

[crw]

Yes, the traffic circle pictured is way too small. In this case, it's hardly a traffic circle and is dangerous IMHO.

I don't know why people don't like them. I'd rather be able to proceed without stopping (90% of the time) than have to stop for a stop sign 100% of the time. Learn to drive and get over it.

 

[Whitewolf]

Originally Posted By: crw
Yes, the traffic circle pictured is way too small. In this case, it's hardly a traffic circle and is dangerous IMHO.

I don't know why people don't like them. I'd rather be able to proceed without stopping (90% of the time) than have to stop for a stop sign 100% of the time. Learn to drive and get over it.


Exactly. The whole point is to try to maintain traffic flow, and as long as everyone obeys the rules, most of the time it works.

 

[Kiwi_ME]

Small roundabouts were tested here in the '70s but are not common now. The small ones in the UK are like a dome smoothly integrated with the road and if no one is looking you can just drive straight over the top.

Our normal roundabouts in NZ are very common and mostly work well and people don't get confused other than how to signal. You signal going in only if you are making a turn, and you always signal when leaving.

Originally Posted By: javacontour
Don't worry, my wife lived in Japan courtesy of the Navy, so she is in charge of driving in LHD countries. I am in charge of driving in all RHD countries.

It took me 10 years of back and forth in numerous countries before I could drive on the correct side without having to focus on it.

But "LHD" normally refers to the cars driven on the right side of the road.