rotate tires on a new-to-me BMW 335i?

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if you have half your brain working look at the tires and rotate if you see it would be of benefit. Benefit is usually described as evening out wear across the whole tread leading to more mileage and less waste.

In my whole life i've never seen a tire guy find the least weighted tires and put them on the front?

DT does free rotations.
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: barlowc
If I had to pick out new all-season tires today they'd probably be a set of Continental ExtremeContact DWS.

Just my opinion, but I wasn't impressed with DWS at all. Just a mediocre tire all around. There is now the new DWS 06... not sure how much they've improved on it.

+1

I wouldn't run Continental ExtremeContact DWS on any of my cars, even if it's free.

I had it on my E430 some years ago, the handling on dry surface isn't better than the cheap Kumho all-season ASX, on wet surface it was down right dangerous at 70-75 MPH, while the cheap Kumho ASX can do 80-85 without drama.

Given a choice of FREE Continental DWS and cheap no-name Chinese tire I would pay for cheap no-name Chinese tire any day.
 
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
I would rotate.


+1, I can see where they are coming from when talking about the handling, but I would trust the company that made the tire over the manufacturer of the car they are going on as far as that goes. That and it doesn't sound like you'll be "racing" through the curves. Just my 2¢.
 
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: barlowc
If I had to pick out new all-season tires today they'd probably be a set of Continental ExtremeContact DWS.

Just my opinion, but I wasn't impressed with DWS at all. Just a mediocre tire all around. There is now the new DWS 06... not sure how much they've improved on it.

+1

I wouldn't run Continental ExtremeContact DWS on any of my cars, even if it's free.

I had it on my E430 some years ago, the handling on dry surface isn't better than the cheap Kumho all-season ASX, on wet surface it was down right dangerous at 70-75 MPH, while the cheap Kumho ASX can do 80-85 without drama.

Given a choice of FREE Continental DWS and cheap no-name Chinese tire I would pay for cheap no-name Chinese tire any day.


I would say this would be region dependant.
if you live where there are seasons.. many would take the dws over a no-name chinese pos tire.

That being said the dws06(the new model) is hugely improved.
 
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My son owed a BMW and found out that they do not recommend tire rotation because the car has a 50/50 weight distribution. He never rotated his and got a long life from the Perelli tires on his bimmer. Good luck!
 
Originally Posted By: MCompact
In my experience, if you don't have a staggered wheel tire set you should rotate them. The following article is courtesy of my friend Mike Miller, the Technical Editor for Bimmer and Roundel magazines:

Tire Rotation Examined
By Mike Miller

Initially, if your BMW has staggered tire and wheel sizing, meaning the rear tires are bigger than the front tires, click the little box in the upper right hand corner of your screen. You can't rotate your tires anyway.

BMW presently recommends against rotating tires. Here's why: In the US, it's normal to bend wheels occasionally, to one extent or another. And not all tires anywhere in the world are perfectly round. When a technician mounts and balances new tires, during the balancing process he will typically note which tire and wheel assembly is the "roundest", i.e., which has the least runout and requires the least weight to achieve 000 on the balancer. These two "roundest" assemblies he will mount at the front owing to BMW's incredible sensitivity to wheel balancing issues.

Then, down the road, the owner or another well-meaning tech rotates the tires front-to-rear. Next thing you know Old Jed's a millionaire -- you've got a vibration in the steering wheel. The reason is that one of the tire and wheel assemblies formerly at the rear and now at the front are not entirely round. If a technician rotated the tires, the customer then brings the car back to the shop complaining of a vibration, requiring a road test, dismounting, balancing, more road testing, etc. Often the customer will balk at paying for the additional work.

Moreover, at BMW dealerships, the customer satisfaction index (CSI) is hugely important in dealer relations with BMW of North America. When NA does a random CSI call on a service customer, scenarios like the foregoing result in comments like, "Well, I had my car at Big Mega Dealer and now I have a front-end vibration! So, I guess I can't give them a high score now can I?" The system is not set up for further explanation, and without that further explanation, the customer input impacts negatively on the dealer's CSI score. Eventually dealers complained to BMW of North America, and the end result is the no-rotation policy.

The thinking is, when you have a BMW that doesn't shake, leave it alone.

Now, armed with this knowledge, if you want to rotate your tires front-to-rear, there's no doubt that you'll get longer tire life. Just be aware of the possible balancing ramifications.

The presumption that the customer is incapable of understanding, or unwilling to understand, these issues is, unfortunately, often correct. However, Roundel Tech Talk takes the approach that it is better to at least attempt to educate people rather than throw out the baby with the bath water.


© 2002 Mike Miller


Is that fact or speculation?
 
Originally Posted By: Rand
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
I wouldn't run Continental ExtremeContact DWS on any of my cars, even if it's free.

Given a choice of FREE Continental DWS and cheap no-name Chinese tire I would pay for cheap no-name Chinese tire any day.

I would say this would be region dependant.
if you live where there are seasons.. many would take the dws over a no-name chinese pos tire.

That being said the dws06(the new model) is hugely improved.

Of course, I never intend to use no name Chinese tire, even if it is free.

I'm comparing it with DWS to emphasize how disappoint I was with DWS.
 
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Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
As far as rotation, BMW advises against it because the rear typically has significant negative camber which wears the inner edges more. When you swap it out to the front, the handling gets negatively affected, and BMW does not want you to be unhappy that your UDM does not handle like a UDM.
smile.gif


However, if you rotate frequently enough, say every 3K miles, I'd guess the negatives would be greatly diminished. The question is, is it really worth your time and money to rotate so often?

The first rotation at 3k after that every 6k would minimize uneven wear for all tires.
 
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Originally Posted By: Rand
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
I wouldn't run Continental ExtremeContact DWS on any of my cars, even if it's free.

Given a choice of FREE Continental DWS and cheap no-name Chinese tire I would pay for cheap no-name Chinese tire any day.

I would say this would be region dependant.
if you live where there are seasons.. many would take the dws over a no-name chinese pos tire.

That being said the dws06(the new model) is hugely improved.

Of course, I never intend to use no name Chinese tire, even if it is free.

I'm comparing it with DWS to emphasize how disappoint I was with DWS.


Pirelli was recently purchased by a Chinese company. Does it count?
 
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Originally Posted By: Rand
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
I wouldn't run Continental ExtremeContact DWS on any of my cars, even if it's free.

Given a choice of FREE Continental DWS and cheap no-name Chinese tire I would pay for cheap no-name Chinese tire any day.

I would say this would be region dependant.
if you live where there are seasons.. many would take the dws over a no-name chinese pos tire.

That being said the dws06(the new model) is hugely improved.

Of course, I never intend to use no name Chinese tire, even if it is free.

I'm comparing it with DWS to emphasize how disappoint I was with DWS.

I think it depends on the car too.
I never had issues with DWS on VW Tiguan. Driving 80-85mph through rain is not an issue at all (235/50 R18).
I do not use them in snow, have snow tires. But DWS' s are about to finish their 3rd season, and it looks like they will do two more. No balancing issues, noise etc.
On other hand, had Kumho Ecsta on CC. Got them with a car, brand new when I purchased CC with 28K. Throw them after 12K since 3 lost balance and could not be rebalanced. Through rain? 85mph was never problem. Braking in wet? I am not religious person, but while braking with them was considering god!
 
You went from GM owner and became a BMW owner thinking it would entail less maintenance? You are going in the wrong direction!! I cant afford a luxury car, must be why im jealous
frown.gif

Nice car..but the fact it has no dipstick to check oil would bother me.
 
Originally Posted By: Rolla07
You went from GM owner and became a BMW owner thinking it would entail less maintenance? You are going in the wrong direction!! I cant afford a luxury car, must be why im jealous
frown.gif

Nice car..but the fact it has no dipstick to check oil would bother me.

I yet to hear it is easier to work on BMW then on Cadillac. Like one mechanic said: For one hour on BMW, I need 3 on Cadillac.
 
Originally Posted By: Rolla07
You went from GM owner and became a BMW owner thinking it would entail less maintenance? You are going in the wrong direction!! I cant afford a luxury car, must be why im jealous
frown.gif

Nice car..but the fact it has no dipstick to check oil would bother me.

I don't care much about checking oil with dipstick on a BMW, what bother me is with previous generations BMW dipstick tube were designed to siphon oil with a fluid extractor like Mityvac 7201. With cartridge filter on top of the engine oil change is a breeze. Now you have to drain the oil by a plug which is a pain.

BMW goes from easy DIY to pain in the behind to save few pennies in manufacturing cost, cheap company that sell expensive vehicles.
 
My experience with BMW is that their engineers are obsessed with handling - to the point that even rotating tires - which degrades handling a bit - is unacceptable, hence their non-rotation position.

BMW also specifies a lot of camber, and that causes irregular wear, which further degrades handling. In some respects, the camber is counter productive in the long term, but the engineers at BMW don't much care.

Personally, I think tires should be rotated on a regular basis regardless of what BMW says. I think most BMW owners aren't interested in the superb handling BMW's have - they are more into the status and image issues - and I think those folks need to ignore BMW's advice to get longer life out of their tires.
 
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
I think most BMW owners aren't interested in the superb handling BMW's have - they are more into the status and image issues - and I think those folks need to ignore BMW's advice to get longer life out of their tires.


After 32 years and 10 BMWs, I'm looking elsewhere. In the past it didn't matter how little a new BMW cost- it still delivered a superb driving experience. Today however, you have to carefully spec a new BMW to make it even remotely entertaining to drive. I suppose that BMW's current philosophy makes financial sense; the poseurs and wearers who make up 99% of BMWs clientele would buy a "Beamer"[sic] if it had the driving dynamics of a Chevrolet Cavalier- so there's little reason to build cars with communicative steering, massive braking ability, or pin-sharp handling.
 
Originally Posted By: MCompact
Today however, you have to carefully spec a new BMW to make it even remotely entertaining to drive. I suppose that BMW's current philosophy makes financial sense; the poseurs and wearers who make up 99% of BMWs clientele would buy a "Beamer"[sic] if it had the driving dynamics of a Chevrolet Cavalier- so there's little reason to build cars with communicative steering, massive braking ability, or pin-sharp handling.

It's very normal to see a BMW Mxxx takes 10 MPH right turn, while the Prius do it at 15-20 MPH. It's also normal to encounter a BMW take half minutes to get to 40 MPH and another minute to get to 50 MPH on a clear/dry surface street. When they make a left turn if there is a vehicle 500-600 ft away they couldn't do it, they need at least 1000 ft.

Many drivers don't drive at 30-40% potential of the car they own.
 
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Many drivers don't drive at 30-40% potential of the car they own.

With today's powerful cars, driving at only 40% of their potential could land one in trouble on the streets.
smile.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete


With today's powerful cars, driving at only 40% of their potential could land one in trouble on the streets.
smile.gif




On another board there was a nitwit asking what coilovers he should put on his new BMW. I asked him what handling characteristics he was trying to improve- transient response, steady state cornering, quicker turn-in, etc. The clown couldn't tell me-of course-so I advised the fool to pick the coilovers painted the coolest color.
 
May be not 40% of BMW Mxxx potential but at least get to 40 MPH in 30 sec or less, not a minute. If a Porsche Panamera is accelerated at 1/2 the pace of a Slow not fast Prius then it is absolutely a poser.

Is there a less than 5-10 year old car can't accelerate to 40 MPH in less than 20 sec ?
 
Some people buy BMW for style and/or luxury. Others buy for Ultimate Driving Machine. And of course there are the people who lease them for perceived status. If Toyota made a car that was 90% of an M5 I would buy it. The closest thing I see is the Infiniti M56 Q70 5.6 V8, but it looks odd and the interior looks like it was made to appeal to someone older than myself. And they cost too much money for a Nissan.

I know from personal experience (family members) that some people track them on weekends and drive like grannies on the street.

Myself, I like to have a nice interior and great cornering ability/brakes for the rare occasion that I can get to a track or empty winding roads.
 
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