LED tail/brake light questions

[Joe1]

I've seen a few late model high end Euro cars with a burnt out LED brake light over the last month or so. First time I've noticed this on an LED. l was under the impression that these LEDs lasted a long time.

Is it common for these lights to burn out prematurely? Second, is it easy and cheap to replace them if they do burn out?

 

[OVERKILL]

You must not have been paying attention, Cadillac had LED tail lights that failed frequently for ages. They were one of the first marques to get them and seemed to suffer unusually high infant mortality. I suspect that's mostly or fully resolved at this point however.

It won't be the LED's themselves that are failing but typically the board that runs them.

 

[el Nuke]

They’ve been standard equipment for several model years of many popular vehicle models, but I don’t see many of the OE bulbs out on cars. Aftermarket LED replacements in incandescent applications is a different story though. Quality of those LEDs can be quite random.

 

[JimPghPA]

If an original equipped LED did burn out, replacing it would not be cheap, if it was out of warranty.

 

[bdcardinal]

If an original equipped LED did burn out, replacing it would not be cheap, if it was out of warranty.

Those super bright new Ford Super Duty LED headlights that you can see from space list for $1,666.67ea. The LED taillights with blind spot are $1,083.33.

 

[A_User55555]

I dont think the LED fails directly, but something messes up in the circuit that powers it. That circuit detects too much current and shuts off the power

 

[mk378]

Would any part of a "late model high end Euro car" be cheap to replace?

 

[Oillover]

I've seen a few late model high end Euro cars with a burnt out LED brake light over the last month or so. First time I've noticed this on an LED. l was under the impression that these LEDs lasted a long time.

Is it common for these lights to burn out prematurely? Second, is it easy and cheap to replace them if they do burn out?

Lol, this thread is funny

That's "burnt out" LED is actually the rear fog light setup!

I swear, ya'll must be a buncha rednecks!

 

[Joe1]

I dont think the LED fails directly, but something messes up in the circuit that powers it. That circuit detects too much current and shuts off the power

Thanks. It is safe to say that most repairs of a malfunctioning LED headlight or tail/brake light will be a costly fix on any car regardless of make?

 

[meep]

The older LED arrays usually ran groups of 3 LEDs in series. If one burned out, the other two would go dark. As someone said above, it was often a broken solder joint or trace from heat cycling on the board. An enterprising DIYer could resolder them, provided one could break the plastic bits apart and reglue them. But not always... some actually suffered from burned out LEDs themselves. most of the earlier ones, and all of the aftermarket stuff I’ve seen tend to be overdriven, contributing to a shorter life.

philips offers a pricey led line for side markers, brakes, turns and what have you. I bench tested a couple of their 1157 type, dual brightness models. They were perfectly just-warm for side marker mode, but on brake/turn mode, became way too hot to touch when left on ‘high’ for long periods, easily over 160F (which is where I can’t hang on to something any longer). Philips is selling arguably a more reputable product. Even the well-designed units still have to run hot to get the output.

 

[Skippy722]

Thanks. It is safe to say that most repairs of a malfunctioning LED headlight or tail/brake light will be a costly fix on any car regardless of make?

Pretty much. On 2014+ Dodge Durango’s, the ones with the massive “race track” tail lights, the center section on the hatch can develop a leak which will kill the hatch part. They’re ~$600-$650 online.

The LED tail lights on my van are running about $220, the halogen assemblies for my truck are $80.... if I wanted the LED‘s for the truck they’d cost about $220.

 

[Jetronic]

The older LED arrays usually ran groups of 3 LEDs in series. If one burned out, the other two would go dark. As someone said above, it was often a broken solder joint or trace from heat cycling on the board. An enterprising DIYer could resolder them, provided one could break the plastic bits apart and reglue them. But not always... some actually suffered from burned out LEDs themselves. most of the earlier ones, and all of the aftermarket stuff I’ve seen tend to be overdriven, contributing to a shorter life.

philips offers a pricey led line for side markers, brakes, turns and what have you. I bench tested a couple of their 1157 type, dual brightness models. They were perfectly just-warm for side marker mode, but on brake/turn mode, became way too hot to touch when left on ‘high’ for long periods, easily over 160F (which is where I can’t hang on to something any longer). Philips is selling arguably a more reputable product. Even the well-designed units still have to run hot to get the output.

When the engine is running my car uses 4 LEDS as DRL, burning fairly hard. when I turn on the lights, they LEDS dim to simulate a side light. I have the option an legal possibility to turn off the DRL and just run them as side lights which I did. LEDs don't like heat, and one must question the cooling capacity inside a closed headlight in summer in full sun with the polycarbonate fully exposed.

Some people have reported the LEDs to fail. Not a huge amount but it require a whole new headlight unit to fix...

the leds are K2 Lumiled https://www.ledsmagazine.com/leds-s...79/lumileds-releases-luxeon-k2-highpower-leds

 

[Crash Bandicoot]

Not unheard of. This is a genuine issue on Cadillac XLRs

Why A Cadillac XLR Brake Light Can Cost More Than A Used Corolla

Some bad designs are noticeable right away, their poorly-considered executions slap you in the face like a slice of wet ham. Others are more insidious, with problems lurking stealthily under the surface. The Cadillac XLR’s taillights are an example of this latter group, and they’re causing the...

jalopnik.com

 

[UG_Passat]

I've seen plenty of LED's fail, from older Acura TL's to Tesla Model S'

 

[meep]

When the engine is running my car uses 4 LEDS as DRL, burning fairly hard. when I turn on the lights, they LEDS dim to simulate a side light. I have the option an legal possibility to turn off the DRL and just run them as side lights which I did. LEDs don't like heat, and one must question the cooling capacity inside a closed headlight in summer in full sun with the polycarbonate fully exposed.

Some people have reported the LEDs to fail. Not a huge amount but it require a whole new headlight unit to fix...

the leds are K2 Lumiled https://www.ledsmagazine.com/leds-s...79/lumileds-releases-luxeon-k2-highpower-leds

The unvented headlight assembly isn’t really a concern. It’s big enough to remove the heat, as there really isn’t that much to deal with. The area of concern is the LED chips themselves, whether or not they are adequately sunk to a slab of metal to take the heat elsewhere. They are tiny point sources. The super bright 1 and 3w chips I’ve played with have a backing plate that gets soldered to the board. That should tell you something, that the casing can handle solder temps during assembly. without a heat sink, I could not keep my hands on them either when powered. But once soldered to the backer board, which then typically has heat grease to something behind it, they stay reasonable.

the brake lights ive seen that are so prone to fail were good ‘ole pcb LEDs with no design for external cooling. lots of Chrysler CHMSL, and anything tucked into a spoiler/wing, were done this way. I haven’t see any of the newer high intensity form factors fail.

my wife and I both have DRLs composed of oem LEDs like tired angry circles under our eyes. We haven’t had trouble with either. And really, I haven’t noticed any other oem DRL’s missing elements on the road either.

just my $0.02. I think theyll be ok.

 

[Jetronic]

I've had to replace a few... Santa fe DRL in particular and tucson high mounted brake lights