Diff. in MPG between E0+HF Air filter and E10+OE Air filter

[jurko]

From the very first fill since I bought my Golf I used E0 Maverik (not top tier) gas and HF Afe dry air filter.
I keep detailed records of fill ups in G drive since then.
Well over 100 fill ups with this set up and I averaged 45.3 MPG.

January this year I decided to experiment with 87 Sinclair Top Tier gas and OE air filter.
So far I did 4 fill ups and I am averaging only 41.2 MPG.

The E0 cost me on the average about 40¢ per gallon more compare to 87 Sinclair.
So now I am faced with decision. Keep running Top Tier (which is prolly better choice?) and be ok with lower MPG.
Or go back to E0 and Afe dry high flow filter which probably lets more dirt thru but getting about 4MPG more?
What would you do?

Thanks.

 

[tyman]

Try E0 and OE filter.
Try Sinclair and AFE filter.

 

[OM605]

The idea of using anything else than a OE filter, especially an air filter would make me inconfortable. OE air filter always are the best ones in every test i've seen. By "best" i mean better filtration and protection. If "best" means better flow then don't install an air filter at all.

I'd run the OE filter and E0 in this case i think!

 

[jurko]

Good ideas I haven't thought about.
Yes, that HF filter was always making me somewhat uncomfortable but I thought it was cool.
Thanks gentlemen.

 

[jurko]

Is the E0 gas on the same quality level like E10 top tier as far as detergents go?
If I go back to E0 should I use every fill up little bit of Chevron Techron complete fuel system cleaner?

 

[TmanP]

As someone who likes TT gas, and tries to use it most of the time, I'd likely run the non-TT Maverik if that's the cheaper option (in cents per mile), and just throw in a bottle of Techron every oil change or so. I calculated it below, though, and that's probably not the case. I echo the responses telling you to run the stock air filter though; I'd do that and do a bit more MPG testing with each fuel then. You need to isolate your variables (change one at a time) in order to get a good answer. Without knowing the cost per gallon, and attributing the difference to the fuel alone, here's a sample calculation... it's pretty much a wash, but the Sinclair was a bit cheaper in this example (likely no Techron needed with the TT either). Generally speaking, E10 will be cheaper to run than E0 with price differentials as they are.

Maverik E0 - 1000 miles / 45.3 mpg = 22.08 used @ $3.20 = $70.56

Sinclair E10 - 1000 miles / 41.2 mpg = 24.28 gal used @ $2.80 = $67.96

While I have a preference for the TT Kwik Trip/QT/Shell/BP/Phillips 66 in the midwest market, plus Chevron/Exxon/Mobil elsewhere, I've run a fair amount of HyVee, Casey's, Sam's Club, Kum and Go, Pilot/Flying J, Love's, etc. (all non-TT) etc over the years and never had a problem doing so. If I felt like my car ran better/got better mileage on non-TT gas I'd run it handily, ditto if it was much cheaper or the location was way better. I've never seen much of a difference, though. For me, it's just a (semi-)quantifiable point of reference and makes purchasing fuel a bit easier - I usually go for the cheapest TT nearby - that is, I won't get Bob's GasMart 87 if Shell 87 or Kwik Trip 87 is the same price. But if an exit has only a Kum and Go or a Pilot for a good price, that's no big deal either and I'll stop without issue.

 

[Kawiguy454]

You left out one important value. What is octane of the E0? On a small disp turbo eng the E10 87 octane may cause the engine to go anti knock and mileage drops. Apples to apples comparison would have been to only change the filter or only the fuel not both. I have used non OEM free flow filters my whole life and never destroyed an engine. For performance the alcohol should make better power as turbos benefit from cooling effect it brings.

 

[SZR48207]

Something else to consider: If your driving is mostly interstate, can you "get by" with non-TopTier fuel since your driving is more forgiving? And similarly, is TopTier gas warranted if you are doing more stop/go driving?

Like TmanP said, I prioritize TT gas if I can get it, especially when driving around the city at home, but on a long trip most off ramps have Pilot or Love's gas which is non-TT and is considerably cheaper than some off-the-beaten-path Shell TT station. After the trip is over, I can afford to spend $6 on a bottle of Techron to make up for all the non-TT gas.

 

[TmanP]

You left out one important value. What is octane of the E0? On a small disp turbo eng the E10 87 octane may cause the engine to go anti knock and mileage drops. Apples to apples comparison would have been to only change the filter or only the fuel not both. I have used non OEM free flow filters my whole life and never destroyed an engine. For performance the alcohol should make better power as turbos benefit from cooling effect it brings.

He did mention that they're both 87 octane. Carson City is pretty high altitude, so either 87 there should be roughly (again, roughly) like 91/92 at sea level, as I remember. (I think it's about 1 octane point per 1000 feet elevation.)

 

[ragtoplvr]

It takes pretty sophiscated testing to change 2 variables at a time and have results that can determine which of the change can be attributed to which of the variables. Compare OE filter to the High flow filter, with same gas. Suspect no change.

 

[MParr]

It was January so, you were getting winter blend fuel. It has less energy than summer blend. E10 also has less energy than E0. In other words, you are not making a fair comparison. Top tier fuel labeling doesn’t really matter. Big oil just dumps their additives in the station tanks or in the fuel tanker at the distributor. A fair test would be to run the E10 with the OE air filter and do the same with your HF AFE air filter. Repeat the test using E0. Do this using either summer or winter blend fuel exclusively. This will give you a percentage difference. You are going to get lower fuel mileage using E10.

 

[Davejam]

Is the E0 gas on the same quality level like E10 top tier as far as detergents go?
If I go back to E0 should I use every fill up little bit of Chevron Techron complete fuel system cleaner?

No, E0 will have less detergents. I wonder if they're even required to use EPA mandated minimum on E0, because it is usually designated for marine, small engine, etc that would not have EPA requirements (perhaps?).
I would just run the Techron every 3-4000 miles.

 

[TmanP]

No, E0 will have less detergents. I wonder if they're even required to use EPA mandated minimum on E0, because it is usually designated for marine, small engine, etc that would not have EPA requirements (perhaps?).
I would just run the Techron every 3-4000 miles.

I don't think that's necessarily the case, at least not in areas where lots of stations offer the option. Most of our Kwik Trips have E0 91 (labeled as "premium recreational gasoline" or similar) that's marked as top tier on the pump. And I got gas at a BP today that had Amoco Ultimate E0 91, which is top tier. My guess is that top tier stations will have top tier appropriate additive concentrations in their E0 as well, and that non-top tier stations selling E0 (like Maverik, Casey's, Kum and Go, etc.) will have EPA-minimum concentrations of additives in all grades. (But I have seen a few, say, Shell stations that offer E0 marked on the pump as "Not a Shell Product" but that's relatively uncommon, in my experience. Most pumps I've seen don't make any such distinction.)

 

[MParr]

Somehow I double posted and I’m trying to delete one. I hope this takes.

 

[jurko]

Wow. Thank you all for the responses and experience you all shared.
@TmanP Thanks for the calculation of price difference over time which I was going to eventually also do. So as it looks like the difference is not really big at all. Annually it's around $30 based on my roughly 10K miles per year. Not much to talk about.

The comparison I posted is so far based on only 3 fill ups with E10 and as @MParr mentioned also running winter blend which prolly contributes to lower MPG compare to summer blend. So the price difference over time could be even less.

Yes we're are at higher elevation here, I think it's around 5,000 feet and I frequently go to Tahoe over Sierras 8,000 feet. Tahoe itself is around 7,000 feet I believe. I also read on the web that at higher elevation air becomes less dense and therefore lower octane is preferred. Don't some high elevation places like in Colorado , Utah and others sell 85 octane because of that?

After all I am reading in your responses and economics between those two choices I think I'll just stick with E0 but keep using OE air filter instead Afe dry HF even though @Kawiguy454 says he had never any problems with free flowing filters.

The Maverik gas station where I was getting the E0 is right of off Hwy 50 and is incredibly busy every day. They also have a section for big rigs. Also very good hot dogs inside I bought many times. That station was put in not even a year ago on big piece of empty land so it has a fresh new tanks underground.

 

[MParr]

Tracking my fuel mileage and I’m getting about 8% less mpg on winter blend vs. summer blend. This number is from using the same grade fuel from the same station and OEM air filters.

 

[jurko]

Tracking my fuel mileage and I’m getting about 8% less mpg on winter blend vs. summer blend.

Wow. To be honest I didn't know about summer and winter blends. I thought the gas was the same year round.

 

[MParr]

Wow. To be honest I didn't know about summer and winter blends. I thought the gas was the same year round.

It’s a lot more complex that that. Do you think the gas sold in Nevada is the same as that sold in California?

 

[jurko]

It’s a lot more complex that that.

Such as?

 

[MParr]

Such as?

I added on to my post. Gasoline formulations can change from state to state. Environmental regulations.