Did the Vibe/Matrix manual gearbox ever become reliable?

[Warlord]

The Vibe/Matrix manual trans has a well deserved reputation for unreliability. It’s basically a Corolla transmission hauling several hundred extra pounds around plus a 2000 pound tow rating. It can’t handle it and Toyota knew this all along. At any point did they improve the design to make it more reliable? Can’t seem to find any info online. I love everything about the vehicle otherwise but I refuse to get an automatic version.

 

[97prizm]

I had a vibe but never had any issues with the manual transmission.

 

[atikovi]

The Vibe/Matrix manual trans has a well deserved reputation for unreliability.

Link? First I've heard and I've had a few.

 

[StumblingElk]

I was unaware it was ever an issue, I guess.

 

[UG_Passat]

The only "unreliable" gearbox was the 6-speed manual on the XRS with the 2ZZ-GE motor... more due to operator error when they miss a downshift.

 

[Warlord]

I’m surprised you guy haven’t heard of this. It was very well documented and I think even a class action lawsuit. I’ll pull up some examples.

 

[supton]

I don’t think so? I recall some thought it was from lack of oil changes, but still, ”most” MT’s don’t get changes and seem fine.

IIRC it was the input shaft bearing.

 

[NismoNVT]

Was it still the a245e?

 

[Warlord]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prin...mission-problem-angers-toyota-owner-1.1389076

If you look on the various Toyota forums there’s a plethora of mt failure complaints. I even called around to local scrapyards to see if a guy could source a used replacement and they all said that the gearboxes get bought up right away and they never have any for very long.

 

[Warlord]

Was it still the a245e?

I’m talking about the C59 manual transmission.

 

[NismoNVT]

I’m talking about the C59 manual transmission.

Ahh read it to fast. C59 was bad dang, thats the popular AT to MT swap on a lot of Corolla forums.

Didnt know it was that bad.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

I've heard of clutch problems in the C60 6-speed in the Matrix XRS/Vibe GT because it's too weak for the car (same one used on the Celica GTS)

I don't know much about the 5-speed C59 in the base model, though.

Since you're in Canada, you should also consider the Echo hatchback. They are very roomy

 

[DriveHard]

The only "unreliable" gearbox was the 6-speed manual on the XRS with the 2ZZ-GE motor... more due to operator error when they miss a downshift.

Interesting, there was I want to say a third gear bearing issue with the 5 speed. We swapped it for a 6 speed, and it was great. My understanding is the 6 speed was more robustly built than the 5 speed.

 

[Warlord]

Interesting, there was I want to say a third gear bearing issue with the 5 speed. We swapped it for a 6 speed, and it was great. My understanding is the 6 speed was more robustly built than the 5 speed.

Yes this is a common solution but the 6speeds are unobtanium now for that very reason.

 

[meep]

I’d never heard of this. The ex and I test drove one years ago and it was an AWESOME car. It was for her, and I‘d really hoped that was the one which would have been chosen. Everything about it seemed just right. Wow.

 

[Warlord]

I've heard of clutch problems in the C60 6-speed in the Matrix XRS/Vibe GT because it's too weak for the car (same one used on the Celica GTS)

I don't know much about the 5-speed C59 in the base model, though.

Since you're in Canada, you should also consider the Echo hatchback. They are very roomy

I love the echo but finding one that isn’t rusted out with a m/t is getting to be a very difficult task.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

I love the echo but finding one that isn’t rusted out with a m/t is getting to be a very difficult task.

You could also import a Scion XA or XB from the US

 

[ProbeGT]

I am very familiar with the C59 and C60. I owned a 2003 Matrix XR with the C59 5-speed manual. This was the most reliable car I ever owned until it met its maker in a collision with a truck at 120K. Zero problems with clutch, transmission or engine.

I now own two Vibe GTs, '03 and '04, both with the 6sp C60.

My wife drives the 04. We've owned it since 36K miles. Throw-out bearing failed at 125K. Dropped the transmission, found original clutch disc almost down to rivets but not failed. Replaced with Valeo clutch and Timken bearing. Lightly sanded down flywheel and reused it. New clutch feels and engages great, better than OEM ever did.

My 03 C60 had a bad 3rd gear synchro when I bought it. I took it completely apart and rebuilt it. Big job. I knew they redesigned it the synchro in 04 so I bought a new 3rd gear synchro for an 04 and ... it didn't fit. Ugh. Fortunately, Toyota upgraded the design even for the 03 C60 so I got that and it's been good since, about 25K on it now. All gears, bearings and the rest of the synchros were in great shape, reused all of it. The car was already on its 2nd clutch which still looked good so I buttoned it up on like that. Big mistake. The aftermarket Chinese clutch failed spectacularly a few months later and took out the flywheel with it . So tranny out again and new LuK clutch, LuK flywheel and Timken bearing. Been in perfect since.



The C60 definitely feels notchy compared to the C59 and it takes time to learn how to hit every gear without grinding or missing shifts. This is helped a great deal by replacing gear oil with a mix of MT90 (1 part) and Pennzoil Synchromesh (2 parts). The friction modifiers in the synchromesh do wonders.

I have nothing but praise for the C59. It's adequate for the standard 1.8L 1ZZ 140hp engine, easier to shift and durable.

The C60 is good overall. Love having the extra gear, shorter throws and shorter gearing which allows you to stay in "LIFT" as you row thru gears. But.. the 03s are guaranteed to develop a 3rd gear synchro failure which makes it impossible to shift 3rd. Later years shouldn't have this problem. The 2ZZ-GE makes 180hp and the OEM clutch can barely handle it. Buy high quality replacement clutch and bearing. I have a heavy foot and both my C60s are still going strong. Apart from the 3rd gear synchro, IMO the transmission failures are caused by operator errors.