Change or Not Chane ATF Fluid

[chefwong]

So I was reading another thread somewhere and there was a blurb regarding ATF fluid changes and the need to do it or not.

There was more than 1 post stating that with *modern high quality* synthetic fluids...the OEM fill often enough is more than sufficient that outlast the Tranny itself ! Bear in mind, that awhile back, when I was looking into ATF fluids and such, this was the same response from a ZF tranny engineer DIRECT in regards to the OEM fluid . I ended did doing a ATF drain/refill of the same stock OEM Esso LT-71141 ---ended up getting about 1/4 out and it was a lil gunky....


With that said, I am curious what are you takes on the longevity of high-quality OEM ATF fluids, lifespan, etc...

 

[Matt89]

This is a good question...

For all the hand-wringing we do on here about fluid changes, there are probably millions of transmissions right now running fine on the orig. fluid at high miles.

 

[sw99]

Garbage! I still do a drain and re-fill every 20-30k just to be safe. I cannot beleive what can accumulate on/around the pan magnet in that amount of time...

 

[Kestas]

30K changes for regular fluid, 60K for synthetic (or "lifetime") fluid.

Yes, transmission fluids have improved. But they're still considered a wear item.

 

[benjamming]

Fluids may have improved but transmissions have not. More & more "reliable" brands are having tranny problems as well. I don't believe this is a time to be increasing OCIs.

If the transmission is a trouble maker w/o a filter, I would do a drain & refill every 15k miles or 30k with a synthetic.
If it's a pretty strong transmission w/o a filter (not sure you can have the a strong transmission w/o a filter), then every 30k miles or 60k miles with a synthetic.
I would probably double the interval if it has a true filter or just change the filter every other OCI based on the above.

The above information is worth every bit you paid for it!

 

[74DartSport]

One, all the material from the friction plates; does it eventually clog the filter, orifices and/or solenoid valves? Two, the torque converter has got to be shearing the fluid pretty badly.

 

[unDummy]

ATF can last a long time in certain transmissions and with certain driving styles. But, most transmissions and drivers beat the snot out of the fluid.

When an automaker provides a lifetime warranty, quit the maintenance. Until then, change that ATF frequently.

Extras like synthetics, full flow ATF filters, ATF coolers, bypass filters, and aftermarket mods, can do much to extend the life of the fluid and transmission. But, every transmission is lacking somewhere and usually in more then one area. So, maintain and upgrade if possible.

 

[Kestas]

The friction plate material is part of the non-magnetic silt found on the bottom of the pan during service. Some of it stays suspended in the fluid. That's why I like to do complete fluid exchanges and not just what's in the pan.

 

[Ramblin Fever]

Agree, until manufactor provides life-time warranty; keep with ATF service intervals.

Also agree that frequency of ATF servicing should be based off driving style, towing, or casual highway driving, easy driver.

 

[double vanos]

One need look no further than BMW's success with their "lifetime" fluids to see how this plays out.

It's true, the fluid DOES last as long as the transmission...between 85k to 100k miles and both the fluid and transmission are shot!!!

And BMW's response..."Hey the new transmission comes complete with new fluid".

Lifetime fluids = short tranmission life (at least as far as BMW's are concerned). You can probably guess how I know.....

 

[Steve S]

Most cars don't have really much quality built into them. Every part is computer designed to the absolute minimun to bring in the maximum profit. My 2002 Ford Superduty is a pile of junk compared to my old 1979 Ford F150. My 2006 Toyota p/u is really a big step down in quality than the 1992 Toyota that was totaled when parked.The life of trans fluid is in relationship to the operating temps of the fluid.The price of a trans whether a new or repaired is expensive.I would for the price chance the fluid. Also I would bet that parts breakage is the major cause of trans problems .

 

[KBFXDLI]

Changing the fluid is cheap insurance...even if you only do it once. But get a fluid extractor and do it yourself every 15k and then change the filter every 30k and you will extend the life of the trans dramatically.

 

[caprice_2nv]

I don't agree with not changing the fluid. Next year I'm probably buying a 1989 Caprice with over 300K miles on it with the original 2004R transmission with clean looking fluid. It would not have lasted that long without fluid changes. My friend drives an 89 Crown Vic with a transmission that was taken from a parts car and currently has over 500K miles on it. It wouldn't have lasted without fluid changes. The main reason most transmissions wear out is because people are too cheap to change the fluid (usually the previous owner).

 

[jct]

I had a 1989 Dodge Dakota that I traded in on a new 2004 Dakota had 249,000 miles on it, pulled a 17 ft skeeter fish and ski most every weekend of the year, back and forth to work, pulled a 16 ft trailer around the country helping my milatary brother move from Fort to Fort and never once changed the oil in the transmission. Front end finally wore out and was going to have to replace everything, but decided to trade. I plan to treat the new Dakota the same.

 

[bmwtechguy]

I once did an oil analysis on some synthetic ATF that had over 50k miles on it, and I remember that the results came back as good for continued use. But I had already drained, flushed and refilled with some new, same fluid because it looked and smelled not-so-good. I still felt better with that new fluid in there. This was on my sister's 95 Aerostar minivan with factory aux. ATF cooler. They're still driving it with well over 200k miles on the orig. trans. My friend who rebuilds these units said that is virtually unheard of in his shop for one of those units to go that long. But that comment was followed by one that most people never change their ATF...

 

[John_E]

I just had a pan-drop fluid-and-filter change done on my ZF tiptronic (2001 VW Passat, 6 years old, 36k miles, 80% urban / "severe service"). The old fluid was quite discolored and the transmission feels subtly "tighter" now, so I consider it money well spent. I am going to dissect the old filter; if the element looks clean, I am going to follow a schedule of biennial or triennial drain-and-fill without dropping the pan. Stay tuned ...

 

[John_E]

My friend's German car indy mechanic advised him to change the ATF every 60k miles / 100k km in his E-320, because he had three Mercedes Benzes on his lot, whose ZF automatics had blown at the 80-90k mile mark.

 

[unDummy]

3 blown ZF's at 80-90k and ONLY recommending a 60k service?? I'd advise it to be changed even earlier!

I haven't seen any OEM filtration micron numbers or holding capacity figures. So, IMO, OEM filters are lame. Even if the OEM filter looks clean, I will still recommend an aftermarket ATF filter for everyone.

 

[11secondoldmopar]

Lifetime fluid. Not in my lifetime, I assure you.

Go to any big salvage yard and look around at the late model vehicles that still have a drivetrain. The majority will have good engine/bad trans written on them. I see it all the time.

Depending on your driving habits and what tranny you have, a 30,000 mile fluid and filter change is essential IMO.

Most new cars engines outlast the tranny almost 2 to 1, and even more in many cases.

 

[PW01]

I have my transmission flushed every 30,000 miles. It may be over-kill, but I consider it cheap insurance.