0w20/30 in 5w20/30 engine?

[ARCOgraphite]

Originally Posted By: 02s4audi
So I have people here saying 0w is better and some saying not to go lower?!? Idk what to do! Lol. Ultimately I'm trying to quiet a noisy Kia Forte motor down. It's the 2.0 and is a little noisy at idle. I am currently running QSUD 5w30 but it's still noisy. I wasn't sure if any oil will help?
Run QSED or green bottle and a wix or Oem filter. If its still noisy, its shot or it just the injectors. I had a nice 2006 Rio 5 spin a rod on the 5w20 water the second day of driving - and the dealer said the noise was NORMAL. Morons.

 

[aquariuscsm]

I keep reading here that 0W oils are always superior regardless of the FSM spec. If that's the case,why are 5/10/20W oils still currently being made?

 

[KrisZ]

Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted By: zach1900
Originally Posted By: 02s4audi
What are the benefits of a 0w over a 5w other than cold weather starting?
nothing.
Im not sure there are cold start advantages at -17C. Do we have MEASURED KV or cP at this temp. NO Extrapolated data please - It's not valid at these temps.

I see NO numbers here; So no support or validity to opinions expressed. 0-Winter just means a 5 or 7 deg colder pumpability over 5w or same degree of improvement of cold temp performance before cloud point or gelling of the lubricant. 99.99 of you here willnot test these waters whatsoever. 0-winter multigrades are NOT specified by SAE or API or ILSAC for cold performance analysis at any point above minus 35 and minus 40 degC. other than that: used, aged fluid loss of pumpability shall not worsen more than one winter grade. Said again; a 5w-xx shall not degrade past the 10w-xx as a used oil.


+1

The gelation point for 5w is -35C and for the 0W is -40C. That is the advantage of 0w oils. If you are operating above these temperatures, 0w oils have no real advantage.

 

[02s4audi]

So should I stick with 5w20 or 30? What will be the difference? Do you think the noise will increase going to a lighter oil even though it's the recommended?

 

[Lolvoguy]

Clearly nobody here is addressing the issue of excessive engine noise that's the OP's main question.

OP, I'd strongly recommend checking the link below I posted yesterday. My car is also very low mileage, so whatever oil you use will make little to no difference in noise. The car was designed to be an economy car, so there have been cost cutting measures when building it. As a result, the NVH you are experiencing is expected on an econo car

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...dening_p#UNREAD

 

[Dallas69]

Run the recommended oil and turn the radio up.

 

[OneEyeJack]

What is the noise, exactly?

Looking for oil to cure an unknown noise might be a waste of time.

Looking for oil to cure any noise might be a waste of time.

For me I use 0w-30 oil. For the same cost as 5w-30 oil and the possibility that it won't be worse and might be better then, why not?

It's kind of like the extension of the argument that 5w-30 is better than straight 30 weight oil because of better protection during start up and warming up to normal temps.

Here are the numbers for my 0w-30 oil

ACEA Service Class A5 B5
API Service Class SN/SM/SL/SG/CF
SAE Viscosity Grade (Motor Oil) 0W30
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 11.7
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 69
Viscosity Index 166
CCS Viscosity, Poise, @ °C 59@-35
Pour Point, °C -60
Pour Point, °F -76
NOACK Evaporation Loss,1hr @ 482°F (250°C), % 9
HTHS Vis, cP @150°C, ASTM D4741 3.2

 

[Vuflanovsky]

If I understand the OP from his other thread, this engine is excessively noisy and then is quiet after warm up leading me to believe that there's a rod or valve train type issue involved. No oil or filter is likely to tame that if the situation is that serious. If it's more than a "tick" sound, I think it might be prudent to find someone you trust to take a look at it rather than experimenting with 0w oil.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Many here have posted Pennzoil mineral oil being the quietest/smoothest. Since your car specs a 30 wt,try PYB 10W30 next oil change and see if there's any difference.

 

[HangFire]

Originally Posted By: zach1900
How thin of an oil do you "thinner is better" want, water?


Back to school with you! It's only "thinner" when it's really cold out. Otherwise it's 20W or 30W just like the 5w-20/30.

Originally Posted By: zach1900
Originally Posted By: 02s4audi
What are the benefits of a 0w over a 5w other than cold weather starting?
nothing.

Typically 0w-'s have a higher Group IV/V content than corresponding 5w- oils.
Originally Posted By: Olas
Thinner oil might improve MPG a small amount

Only while the engine is cold.
Originally Posted By: Olas

but there's more risk of failure under heavy loads and high temps, especially if it's a worn engine.

No, it's not. It's still a 20W or 30W.
Originally Posted By: Olas

Stick with the recommended grade

A 0w-30 substituted for a 5w-30 is still the recommended grade. Same with 0w-20 and 5w-20.
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
I had a nice 2006 Rio 5 spin a rod on the 5w20 water the second day of driving - and the dealer said the noise was NORMAL. Morons.

Given your history of roaching engines, I'm sure it had nothing to do with choice of oil grade.
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
I keep reading here that 0W oils are always superior regardless of the FSM spec. If that's the case,why are 5/10/20W oils still currently being made?

They are less expensive to make than 5w's, and most people would rather blindly stick to the outdated OEM oil spec than educate themselves.
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
The gelation point for 5w is -35C and for the 0W is -40C. That is the advantage of 0w oils. If you are operating above these temperatures, 0w oils have no real advantage.

Wrong, pumpability curves are different well before gelation occurs.
Originally Posted By: 02s4audi
The car in question is a 2012 Kia Forte ex 2.0. Want the quietest, smoothest, best all around oil.

Try a few different brands and see what runs most quietly.

 

[gregk24]

Originally Posted By: 02s4audi
So I have people here saying 0w is better and some saying not to go lower?!? Idk what to do! Lol. Ultimately I'm trying to quiet a noisy Kia Forte motor down. It's the 2.0 and is a little noisy at idle. I am currently running QSUD 5w30 but it's still noisy. I wasn't sure if any oil will help?


Maybe a Castrol product or a non synthetic SOPUS product with a Hyundai/Kia genuine oil filter, those combos may quiet things down.

 

[BrianC]

You are splitting hairs here. Since you are an Amsoil PC, go look at the DATA sheet for the SS oils. You'll see that the 5w-20 is thinner at KV 40C cSt than the 0w-30. So if its ok to use a 5w-20, a 0w-30 is not too thin. Either way, both are way thicker at start up than at operating temps. So any one that says the sky will fall if you use a 0w-xx is misguided and uninformed.

0w-xx provides less drag and quicker flow at a given start temp than a 5w-xx of the same grade. That's it. Any engine spec'ed for 5w-xx can use a 0w- of the same grade, in fact, would be preferred, for the less drag, faster flow benefit. At moderate temps, as in summer, the benefits would be minimal. But there is no reason to change to a 5w in the summer.

Whether any of this affects your start up noise can only be determined by trying them out. The start up noise is most likely not harmful as dealers will tell you. So run a OCI with something, if you think its too noisy try something different next time.

Again, just to eliminate the chance that the filter is the cause, I encourage to use an OEM filter.

 

[Boss302fan]

I have used a 30 weight in my wife's Hyundai SF and it is quieter on the recommended 5W20... QSUD has been the best so far at start up noise and the engine running smooth. I stated all this in the other thread. Mobil 1 products ran really loud and I also had to add oil during an OCI. QSUD the oil has not dropped on 5K miles.

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: Olas
Thinner oil might improve MPG a small amount but there's more risk of failure under heavy loads and high temps, especially if it's a worn engine.

Stick with the recommended grade, and the best oil is whichever one meets all the specs and is on sale. Spend more on better stuff if it helps you sleep better, that's why I use Redline!


Actually this is not true. 0wt oils are designed to flow faster but there is no loss in protection.


Couple of myths that you keep repeating Tig...
1) there is a trade-off, in that the 0W probably has more VII and PPDs, making the oils more shear prone than the 5W.
2) when you aren't exploring the -35/-40C end of the spectrum, they both flow about the same...the 0W is "Cold pumping", not starting at freezing.

Case in point, M1 5W30 and 0W30 are virtually identical at "normal" temperatures...and the 0W30 will likely have thinner basestocks, and more polymers etc. to get the 0W.

 

[fdcg27]

Short answer is that any engine can be run on a 0W-XX as long as the top "XX" complies with that required with a 5W-XX.
A 0W may be made with a higher quality basestock blend relative to the 5W, as appears to be the case with M1.
It may not be, though, as appears to be the case with TGMO.
Both Amsoil and XOM market their 0W-XX oils as plug and play drop in replacements for applications for which a 5W-XX is recommended, and both warrant their products not to cause engien damage if used as directed, so I doubt that a 0W-XX would do any harm.
The question remains as to whether it would do any good at the temperatures most of us living quite a few degrees below the Arctic Circle see.
You also can't really rely upon an extrapolation of two data points to predict viscosity at temeratures much below the lower of those two data points with any precision at all.
The large error range makes such a comparison meaningless.
In sum, if you want to use a 0W-XX in a 5W-XX application, then go for it.
It should do no harm and might do some good.

 

[02s4audi]

Thanks every for the replies. I still am undecided and will be until I purchase something. It seems that 0w is better overall and really doesn't have a detriment to it. It can be equal to or better than a 5w with the same warm temp viscosity grade. I will most likely side with a 0w with that in mind, it's just hard to run a 0w in my head when I read it wants a 5w lol.

 

[BrianC]

fdcg27....great response
+10

 

[BrianC]

Originally Posted By: 02s4audi
Thanks every for the replies. I still am undecided and will be until I purchase something. It seems that 0w is better overall and really doesn't have a detriment to it. It can be equal to or better than a 5w with the same warm temp viscosity grade. I will most likely side with a 0w with that in mind, it's just hard to run a 0w in my head when I read it wants a 5w lol.


Start thinking 0w is less thick rather than 0w is thinner. The 20 or 30 after the w is the same respectively.

 

[Garak]

You may get slightly better fuel economy with a higher VI oil (i.e. an ILSAC 0w-30 versus and ILSAC 5w-30). But, you'll never be able to measure it.

 

[02s4audi]

Does anybody know about the Hyundai/Kia filters? There is a Kia dealer about 45 mins away from me and a Hyundai dealer about 15 mins away. Can I go to Hyundai and get a filter for the car? Also I was reading around online and found that I need a crush washer? Does it need to be replaced each time you change the filter?