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#3165897 - 10/24/13 08:00 AM How long can you go on group III synthetic?
wolf_06 Offline


Registered: 06/11/12
Posts: 472
Loc: Atlantic, Canada
For short tripping during the week, stop and go, lots of cold start, sometime not getting to full operation temperature, hard acceleration occasionally and highway on the weekends.

I guess im good for severe service, but how long on a synthetic like PP or QSUD or Edge?

Thanks!
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#3165911 - 10/24/13 08:11 AM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
Quest Offline


Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 7362
Loc: beaver land EH?
IMHO for frequent short tripping, fuel dilution would be your biggest concern ( Fuel/Air ratio goes into rich mode during cold starts, and will wash down the cylinder wall).

In this case: it's not going to matter whether you are running conventional or syn for they both suffer from fuel dilution anyways.

I'd go with conventional or semi-syn for the sake of better pricing so as to make it economical to change oil more frequently (to rid of the fuel-diluted oil and moisture).

Syn oil only excels in terms of high temp breakdown resistance, but exhibits no better performance overall when dealing with moisture/contaminants and fuel dilution (due to frequent short trips, cold starts, etc.)

Q.
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#3165985 - 10/24/13 09:32 AM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
salv Offline


Registered: 04/21/11
Posts: 1259
Loc: Cadyville, NY
As long as you can go on group II/II+. With a stout additive chemistry even conventionals can go for a long time, look at performance of conventional versus synthetic HDEOs. Very little difference in long term performance. Detergency and TBN retention are more important than the base oil chemistry given the quality of modern group II oils.
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#3166091 - 10/24/13 11:16 AM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
tommygunn Offline


Registered: 01/27/11
Posts: 3061
Loc: usa
Your cruze has an OLM and is probably still under warranty, so just use the OCI suggested by it, which already takes into account severe service, short trips, etc.

Anything that says dexos on it should be fine.
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#3166172 - 10/24/13 12:04 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: tommygunn]
wolf_06 Offline


Registered: 06/11/12
Posts: 472
Loc: Atlantic, Canada
Well all of this sounds good, but OLM is not accurate at all. I dont use it.

But what mileage you guys recommend ??
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#3166173 - 10/24/13 12:05 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
mrsilv04 Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 7913
Loc: Illinois
I would have no worries running a good-quality synthetic in a GM vehicle with an OLM... and then changing it per the OLM.

If what the OLM is telling you seems reasonable... go with it.
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#3166183 - 10/24/13 12:10 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
mrsilv04 Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 7913
Loc: Illinois
Originally Posted By: wolf_06
Well all of this sounds good, but OLM is not accurate at all. I dont use it.

But what mileage you guys recommend ??


To *really* know, you'd need to run some UOA's.

When you say "highway on the weekends", that should be sufficient to burn off any moisture that may have accumulated in the oil. When on the highway under ideal conditions, an OLM will barely move. When I drive 2 hours on the interstate, my OLM will only tick down 1, maybe 2%.

What is the OLM telling you? Why are you suspicious of it? It is suggesting something wacky like 2,500 mile or 12,000 mile changes?
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Ask me about my junk, knocking Jasper engine, that failed and had to be replaced at only 2,200 miles, and how poorly Jasper handled the claim.

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#3166224 - 10/24/13 12:57 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: Quest]
strat81 Offline


Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 809
Loc: Nebraska
Originally Posted By: Quest
Syn oil only excels in terms of high temp breakdown resistance, but exhibits no better performance overall when dealing with moisture/contaminants and fuel dilution (due to frequent short trips, cold starts, etc.)


I thought synthetic were also better in cold weather (sub 0*C) compared to conventional. For example, I am not aware of any conventional 0W-xx oil. No?
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#3166336 - 10/24/13 02:25 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: mrsilv04]
wolf_06 Offline


Registered: 06/11/12
Posts: 472
Loc: Atlantic, Canada
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Originally Posted By: wolf_06
Well all of this sounds good, but OLM is not accurate at all. I dont use it.

But what mileage you guys recommend ??


To *really* know, you'd need to run some UOA's.

When you say "highway on the weekends", that should be sufficient to burn off any moisture that may have accumulated in the oil. When on the highway under ideal conditions, an OLM will barely move. When I drive 2 hours on the interstate, my OLM will only tick down 1, maybe 2%.

What is the OLM telling you? Why are you suspicious of it? It is suggesting something wacky like 2,500 mile or 12,000 mile changes?


well, I had use semi synthetic for 10,000 km and it was at 45% left, to me 10,000 km on a semi synthetic is too much, even on a full synthetic, maybe I would try M1 for that long.

And I know a mecanic a my local dealer, he said the dealer recommend 13,000 km on semi synthetic AC delco oil, before oil change.

Some car came back with worn cam shaft due to poor oil quality.
He usualy use that oil for his own vehicle, but for 6000km only, which make sense and give him peace of mind.

I would not take a chance risking my investment just to try stupid exaggerated OCI JUST to see how long it can last, I plan to keep my car at least 5-6 years.

My two cents...
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#3166338 - 10/24/13 02:29 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
stchman Offline


Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 1502
Loc: St. Louis, MO
Originally Posted By: wolf_06
Well all of this sounds good, but OLM is not accurate at all. I dont use it.

But what mileage you guys recommend ??


The OLM is accurate. Problem is the OLM contradicts people's "feelings".
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#3166348 - 10/24/13 02:36 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: stchman]
wolf_06 Offline


Registered: 06/11/12
Posts: 472
Loc: Atlantic, Canada
Originally Posted By: stchman
Originally Posted By: wolf_06
Well all of this sounds good, but OLM is not accurate at all. I dont use it.

But what mileage you guys recommend ??


The OLM is accurate. Problem is the OLM contradicts people's "feelings".


Tell me how you would feel opening your engine to replace parts, but be a great feeling hey!
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2011 Chevy Cruze 1.8L 6AT
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#3166356 - 10/24/13 02:41 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
99Saturn Offline


Registered: 02/25/13
Posts: 1419
Loc: NY
Given that the OLM in newer Cruze's seem to go no where near that of the '11, I would not feel comfortable making a blanket statement that the OLM is accurate.

IMO the best advice here is pick an interval you are comfortable with and get a UOA a few times, extend appropriately within your comfortable level.

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#3166361 - 10/24/13 02:44 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: 99Saturn]
wolf_06 Offline


Registered: 06/11/12
Posts: 472
Loc: Atlantic, Canada
yeah i think they re-calibrated the OLM after a while, not sure but yours is probably better than mine on your 13 cruze.
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2011 Chevy Cruze 1.8L 6AT
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#3166367 - 10/24/13 02:53 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
99Saturn Offline


Registered: 02/25/13
Posts: 1419
Loc: NY
Yup, that is what many suspect (recalibration). I believe we might have had a similar discussion on one of your other posts.

Everything I have seen indicates the LS is easy on oil. The '13 LS we have sees a round trip of 100 miles a day, mixed driving maybe 20% to 30% stop and go (depends on the traffic, day, etc). That OLM appears as if it would go to 0% ~7,500 miles.

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#3166373 - 10/24/13 02:58 PM Re: How long can you go on group III synthetic? [Re: wolf_06]
strat81 Offline


Registered: 01/09/10
Posts: 809
Loc: Nebraska
Originally Posted By: wolf_06
well, I had use semi synthetic for 10,000 km and it was at 45% left, to me 10,000 km on a semi synthetic is too much, even on a full synthetic, maybe I would try M1 for that long.

And I know a mecanic a my local dealer, he said the dealer recommend 13,000 km on semi synthetic AC delco oil, before oil change.

Some car came back with worn cam shaft due to poor oil quality.
He usualy use that oil for his own vehicle, but for 6000km only, which make sense and give him peace of mind.

I would not take a chance risking my investment just to try stupid exaggerated OCI JUST to see how long it can last, I plan to keep my car at least 5-6 years.

My two cents...


UOAs indiciate that 10,000 km is short.

Cruze Turbo (arguably harder on oil than your NA 1.8) goes 9k miles on QSUD:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2722736&page=1

Cruze Turbo goes 9.8k miles on M1:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2605626

Cruze 1.8 goes 14k miles on factory fill:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2486432&page=1
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