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#1822626 - 03/18/10 09:49 PM Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0
Tribeca Offline


Registered: 01/21/09
Posts: 18
Loc: Seattle, WA
I have just shelled out a staggering amount of money for my dream car and want to make sure we have a long and happy relation. I am thinking of changing the oil at 1000 miles and again at the regular service interval. I would like to use redline oil to help avoid cooking the turbo bearings. Opinions?
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2011 Subaru Outback 2.5i
2010 Audi A5 Cabriolet
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#1822639 - 03/18/10 09:57 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Tribeca]
Chris Meutsch Online   content


Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 2506
Loc: Cincinnati
Does PP/Ultra come in 0w40? I'd do that for 5-6k runs. Second choice, M1 EP 0w40 for 7-8k runs if they make it. Amsoil says you can run a 5w30 in it but if you're easy on things before it's fully warm, the 0w40 should work fine.
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#1822648 - 03/18/10 10:01 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Tribeca]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3060
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: Tribeca
I have just shelled out a staggering amount of money for my dream car and want to make sure we have a long and happy relation. I am thinking of changing the oil at 1000 miles and again at the regular service interval. I would like to use redline oil to help avoid cooking the turbo bearings. Opinions?


Which oil does the book mandate, still 502.00? Or have they changed to 504.00? (like all VAG engines, only full synthetic allowed since 2000)
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2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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#1822658 - 03/18/10 10:10 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: BobFout]
Audi Junkie Offline


Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 11247
Loc: PA
If it was my car, I'd do 3k miles changes with 15w-40 HD until winter then a temp-appropriate oil.

There really is no good oil for 2.0T except BioSyn. Some of the guys who followed it more closely may know which otc oil is actually working best. I seem to recall Jag stating SynPower 5w-40 did a nice job.
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#1822663 - 03/18/10 10:14 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Tribeca]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 33247
Loc: Great Lakes
Originally Posted By: Tribeca
I would like to use redline oil to help avoid cooking the turbo bearings. Opinions?

Better not if you don't want to give your dealer an excuse to potentially deny warranty claims for not using VW-approved oil.

There are plenty of decent oils out there that also meet VW 502.00 spec... M1 0w-40 and GC come to mind, off the top of my head. NAPA carries Synpower 5w-40 also.

Watch out for valve deposits.

Congrats on a new ride! Is it quattro and manual?
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'02 530i (Edge HM 10W-40)
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#1822667 - 03/18/10 10:16 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Quattro Pete]
Audi Junkie Offline


Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 11247
Loc: PA
So few new cars are manual, it's sad.
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2008 Opel Astra 1.8 VVT 5M
2010 VW Tiguan 2.0 TSI 6M
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#1822671 - 03/18/10 10:18 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Audi Junkie]
HTSS_TR Offline


Registered: 04/17/06
Posts: 19528
Loc: Lake Forest, CA
There is one over the counter oil that can safely be used in most European engines, except a few exotic one such as Ferrari or Lambo, M1 0W40.
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#1822677 - 03/18/10 10:25 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Tribeca]
Nederlander75 Offline


Registered: 09/30/07
Posts: 944
Loc: Pardon?
Renewable Lubricants Inc. If you are going out of certified oils it will protect the turbo and your intake valves from the draw backs of Direct Injection. Redline isnt a bad choice either, we dont know yet whether its better than RLI for the valves.

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#1822688 - 03/18/10 10:31 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Nederlander75]
Popinski Offline


Registered: 07/03/08
Posts: 1707
Loc: Ohio, USA
I wonder if Audi still has the oil-burning problem on their 2010 2.0T A4...

I've read that Audi considers the oil-burning problem "Normal".

I have also noticed that many new A4 owners use the Castrol Syntec 5w40 because it is the cheapest synthetic oil that is VW/A4 approved and doesn't burn a hole in your wallet when topping-off every 3,000 miles.

Nevertheless, congrats on you purchase.
_________________________
"It doesn't matter what religion you are in, who you pray for, what you believe in, because the only thing you worship is OIL".

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#1822749 - 03/18/10 11:41 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Popinski]
saaber1 Offline


Registered: 11/28/07
Posts: 1877
Loc: Pacnw
Oil burning on the "new" 2.0 Turbo TSI, introduced mid 2008 is much, much reduced compared to the 2.0 FSI (<2008) by all reports.

We don't really know yet if the TSI is as hard on oil as the FSI. The FSI is brutal on oil. Assuming the TSI is as hard on oil as the FSI (and that is not really a safe assumption because we simply don't have enough data yet) of those mentioned above, I would not run m1 0w40 (shear rate is 15-25% in a very short time on the FSI and flashpoint retention is poor) but I would run Biosyn 5w40 or that HDEO 15w40. I definitely would not run Pennzoil Ultra because it's HTHS is very low, 3.1 as I recall. That's even less than the 502 minimum of 3.5

Amsoil DEO, Motul 300V, Redline 5w40 (HTHS 4.6) or 10w40 (HTHS 4.7) would all be good ones to consider. Redline's volatility is 6% which is very low.

If I had to run a 502 oil, Motul x-lite ow30 or GC would be my pick.

In the 2.0FSI, so far the best performer in terms of shear, flashpoint retention, and possibly metals is Brad Penn 10w30. But there is only one UOA of that so far. Shear was 5% and flashpoint was around 400 as I recall which is staggeringly good. Redline 5w40 had the next best shear average at around 11-13% and flashpoint retention, followed by Biosyn 5w40. It is a large drop from these oils to the many 502 oils. Keep in mind that for FSI runs 99% highway, any oil does great. 502 oils do not cut it in the FSI engines and pretty much any oil (including the better than 502 oils) do not last beyond 5000 miles. We don't know yet if 502 oils are inadequate for the TSI.

In Europe where a lot of this testing is done, the cars run in a different mode and they don't have fuel dilution as bad as we do in the U.S.

The 2 problems I would keep in mind are fuel dilution and valve deposit buildup. Using a good oil can help alleviate these problems somewhat but is not a cure all. Chaning every 5k as recommended above is wise until we know that we can run longer on the TSI. Search for the 2.o FSI database, direct injection, valve buildup, pcv bypass, carbon deposits etc. etc. to find more info.

In parting, here are the valves of a 2.0FSI car that ran m1 0w40 according to the manual changed every 10k miles. I have posted on most topics re FSI, direct injection, valve buildup, etc. so feel free to browse my posts to find relevant threads (Bitog search engine is not the greatest). Also, re warranty, many use better than 502 oils that are not on the list and keep any of the following: maintenance log documenting 502 oil use, receipts for 502 oils that are returned, photos of oil change.



P.S. I would do exactly what you are saying if it were my car, except for the oil change interval. Change at 1000, then redline 5w40 or 10w40 every 5000 thereafter. Doing a UOA will tell you clearly if you can run it longer, say 7000 miles, 10,000 miles, etc. I bet the TSI will support longer oil runs. But it would not be wise IMO to go longer than the proven 5k FSI "limit" until we get some more UOAs on those engines to know if it is safe. ALL IMO and feel free to disregard all.


_________________________
"when 5W30 is cold, ...the oil is 35 weight (5+30),...20 w 50 starts at 70 and warms up to 50"
- Kyle, auto mechanic & VP Speedline Motorsports, INTL

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#1822769 - 03/19/10 12:13 AM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: saaber1]
Audi Junkie Offline


Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 11247
Loc: PA
Yeah, testing is important.







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2008 Opel Astra 1.8 VVT 5M
2010 VW Tiguan 2.0 TSI 6M
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#1822905 - 03/19/10 07:18 AM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Audi Junkie]
Tribeca Offline


Registered: 01/21/09
Posts: 18
Loc: Seattle, WA
It is a "rare" 6 speed manual transmission. The dealer said very few are made, and fewer people want to buy them which makes me a little nervous for resale. I have always been a Subaru fan, but after driving my wife's A5, I was instantly sold. Thanks for all the input, I appreciate it!
_________________________
Joe W. Bink
2011 Subaru Outback 2.5i
2010 Audi A5 Cabriolet
1949 Chevrolet Pickup



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#1823116 - 03/19/10 10:20 AM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Tribeca]
saaber1 Offline


Registered: 11/28/07
Posts: 1877
Loc: Pacnw
I need to correct my statement re: Pennzoil Ultra. Just read Pennzoil's responses and the HTHS of Pennzoil Ultra™ Euro 5W-40 = 3.7

I had stated it was 3.1 which is what I saw on their website but I looked a the wrong grade. So the 5w40 does exceed the vw 502 spec. I would say lets try it and see how it does by doing a UOA!
_________________________
"when 5W30 is cold, ...the oil is 35 weight (5+30),...20 w 50 starts at 70 and warms up to 50"
- Kyle, auto mechanic & VP Speedline Motorsports, INTL

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#1823144 - 03/19/10 10:51 AM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: saaber1]
Audi Junkie Offline


Registered: 11/03/02
Posts: 11247
Loc: PA
Many Euro cars requiring HT/HS of >3.5 do fine on 2.9cP over here because we don't generate the higher oil temps, and it stays thick. I could cite a bunch of UOAs showing low wear with plain 5w-30 synth.
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2008 Opel Astra 1.8 VVT 5M
2010 VW Tiguan 2.0 TSI 6M
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#1823357 - 03/19/10 02:03 PM Re: Recommendation For 2010 Audi A4 2.0 [Re: Audi Junkie]
BobFout Offline


Registered: 03/23/09
Posts: 3060
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Many Euro cars requiring HT/HS of >3.5 do fine on 2.9cP over here because we don't generate the higher oil temps, and it stays thick. I could cite a bunch of UOAs showing low wear with plain 5w-30 synth.


So, what you're saying is, don't drive over 60 MPH, exceed 3000 RPM, exceed 1000*F on EGTs, or half go-pedal. I'm sure someone with a 2.0T will do exactly that. LOL

Folks, use the right oil, don't cheap out. This is not some run-of-the-mill 4-pot. VAG really does know better than anyone else in this case.
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2003 VW Jetta TDI (Sold) / 2015 VW GTI 2.0T

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