Amsoil SSO 0w-30 VOA

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JHZR2

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Amsoil Signature Series SSO 0w-30
UOA by Oil Analyzers, Inc. (Seemingly Amsoil's own UOA lab).

Code:


Element Conc(ppm)

-------------------------

Al 0

Cr 0

Fe 1

Cu 0

Pb 0

Sn 0

Mo 0

Ni 0

Mn 0

Ag 0

Ti 0

K 0

B 15

Si 3

Na 4

Ca 3943

Mg 23

P 961

Zn 1183

Ba 0

-------------------------



cSt @ 100C 10.13

Insol % 0

TBN 10.83


JMH
 
Thanks for posting this. Lot of Ca. ZDP levels are also above SM levels. Tbn low. I'd have them re-test it maybe. Or is this within the sample error?
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Originally Posted By: buster
Thanks for posting this. Lot of Ca. ZDP levels are also above SM levels. Tbn low. I'd have them re-test it maybe. Or is this within the sample error?
21.gif

The phosporus levels are fine for the SM grade, just well above the ILSAC GF-4 max levels. So it can still be a SM oil just not an SM ILSAC GF-4 oil.
 
Seems like they boosted the additives a bit.

I'm sure this is why I questioned the "ashless" thing.

Anyway the TBN was probably a methodology thing. The R&D lab is not the same as the commercial UOA lab and VOA TBN's are determined by a different method as I recall.
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Anyway the TBN was probably a methodology thing. The R&D lab is not the same as the commercial UOA lab


How so?
 
How so?

Not sure what you mean. OAI is owned by Amsoil, but it's not the R&D lab for Amsoil.

As for the methodology, I don't have the ASTM numbers stored away, but there are at least two methodologies (maybe 3), one mainly for UOA's and the other for VOA's. And within those methods there are even some subsets for autotitration, etc. I really don't get too hung up on VOA TBN's.
 
I wouldn't doubt that a lab method is a titration of some sort that can be extremely exact and particular. R&D lab techs will also tend to have much better skills at getting good, reproducible, exact results, compared to standard analytical techs (I work R&D as my day job, I see this a lot).

ASTM methods are a good way of getting a general procedure that everyone can do. However, in my experience, they leave too much up in the air. I recall one method for analyzing fuel, where one of the instructions was to fill something with 2 +/-1 mL of fuel. With tolerances like that, there certainly can be 10% swings.

In much analysis, 6% RSD is acceptable. A "lab" TBN of 13 could be +/- 0.7 and still be fully acceptable under many analytical instruments used in labs. That said, on some of our equipment, we can get RSDs of 20-30%, which for the sake of comparisson (since we dont have to worry about fines from EPA, FDA, etc) is sometimes good enough, and Id venture to guess that for a TBN measurement, 20% compared to a "lab" analysis might be good enough... You want to see that you have reserve, not wring out every last bit of buffering ability.

Remember, if TBN goes too low, likely the kinetics of neutralization get too slow too. Think back to HS chemistry, doing titrations with an indicator... at first whatever you titrate in immediately reacts and all is fine, but as you reach the equivalence point, the rate of disappearance of indicator is much slower. Same thing is likely the case here.

JMH
 
I would think 3 points on the TBN is NOT within the marginal error....even if it is a VOA!

And,

Why would Amsoil not use OAI as its R&D lab? Do they really care about conflict of interest or just knowing that the oils work? It seems to me paying an outside lab for the sake of not creating a conflict of interest is swiming against the stream that Amsoil has been swimming for some time! Big Al is not a mainstream kinda guy...and if he worried about how his products were perceived by the public he would have a mainstream company.
 
Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
I would think 3 points on the TBN is NOT within the marginal error....even if it is a VOA!

And,

Why would Amsoil not use OAI as its R&D lab? Do they really care about conflict of interest or just knowing that the oils work? It seems to me paying an outside lab for the sake of not creating a conflict of interest is swiming against the stream that Amsoil has been swimming for some time! Big Al is not a mainstream kinda guy...and if he worried about how his products were perceived by the public he would have a mainstream company.



LCM - please show me where I said "marginal error".

Some of you are trying to make something of nothing. Do you not remember the vagaries of TBN measurement at all?

I don't think you followed what I wrote.

1) OAI is not the Amsoil R&D lab. It's a commercial UOA lab. I think it would be very tough to combine constant on-going R&D efforts in a lab where hundreds and hundreds of incoming samples arrive daily.
2) Conflict of interest? They measured the TBN (not sure how) and make a marketing chart.
3) I would hope Amsoil is concerned about how the oil works.

Most importantly - as some of us have learned you simply cannot compare TBN numbers from lab to lab. It makes NO sense.


See the other thread as well. The point there: "if it was run by a different lab, say OAI or Blackstone or even Schaeffers - the all the samples shifted according to the bias of methodology."

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1058095#Post1058095
 
I like the high additive levels at least. Still don't get the ashless part. Probably some new form of Ca?
 
This sample was tested using the ASTM 4739 method. This yields a TBN that is 2-3 pts lower than the ASTM 2896 method you see on engine oil spec sheets. This is also why oils tested after several thousand miles seem to have low TBN's -you're comparing apples to oranges.

This formulation has more Ca detergent than you find in a CI-4+, HDEO.
 
Sorry to chime in 4 months after the last reply, but based on the oil analysis, this oil is just within the upper limits of API SL (0.10%) oils but over the API SM limit (0.08%) for Phosphorus.

I noticed since I'm looking for an oil that is good for my 2008 G35 and am looking between GC which is SL rated and the SM rating mentioned in the owner's manual.
 
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Researching SSO, found this and I have a couple questions (Pablo?).

- Why would there not be any Moly in SSO?

- Is the formulation the same now as it was when this was done?

Thanks!
 
Formulation hasn't changed.

As for moly, doesn't need it - ester mix does the same or better.

I'm not sure moly 'plays well' in ultra-long OCI's (20K+).
 
Moly is one of many additives . It is not a magic ingredient . It doesn't need it. SSO is one of the most super duper oils Amsoil has on the market. One great oil for greatly extended oil change intervals. Yhe add package is similar to some of the HDEOs Designed for long oil change intervals and demanding operation.
 
Originally Posted By: Steve S
Moly is one of many additives . It is not a magic ingredient . It doesn't need it. SSO is one of the most super duper oils Amsoil has on the market. One great oil for greatly extended oil change intervals. Yhe add package is similar to some of the HDEOs Designed for long oil change intervals and demanding operation.


Agreed. I would think some would be in there though.
 
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