Home

New to the cartridge oil filter party....

Posted By: ZZman

New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 04:49 PM

We just bought a 2007 Santa Fe with a 3.3 motor. It has a cartridge style filter which is a first for me on any vehicle we have owned.

I am amazed at the size of it. It is huge. Seems like the filters could last a long time and hold lots of dirt. I have had vehicles that had tiny filters that looked better suited to a riding mower.

Any thoughts on top quality cartridge filters?
Posted By: rooflessVW

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 04:58 PM

OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.
Posted By: oil_film_movies

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 04:59 PM

Fram Ultra XG9999 .. Here is the reason: 4548-12 tests are best, and its good for 20,000 miles, wire-backed.
[Linked Image]
Big as it is, that thing will have no problem going a full 20,000 miles. I've seen bigger engines with much small oil filters. For example, GM V8's use the PF64, not big at all!
Posted By: slacktide_bitog

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:01 PM

Fram Ultra smile
Posted By: 53' Stude

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
Fram Ultra XG9999 .. Here is the reason: 4548-12 tests are best, and its good for 20,000 miles, wire-backed.
[Linked Image]
Big as it is, that thing will have no problem going a full 20,000 miles. I've seen bigger engines with much small oil filters. For example, GM V8's use the PF64, not big at all!



If that does NOT have the barb with tiny O ring, expect to see oil lamp flicker at idle. Saw it happen a lot before we used the p-989 champ labs filters. Just stating a fact
Posted By: ZZman

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:23 PM

It is my understanding that you should get a large and small o-ring as they should be replaced.
Posted By: 53' Stude

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by ZZman
It is my understanding that you should get a large and small o-ring as they should be replaced.


Correct sir smile
Posted By: ZZman

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:39 PM

When I checked the Fram website all 3 filter choices showed the 2 o-rings.
Posted By: Kira

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:51 PM

See if there is there is a preferred installation method.

It could be "click into place in the engine first" or "click into the housing first then install the complete housing" for this engine.

It may or may not matter. I do not know.

The "Do I benefit from filling the housing with oil to shorten the dry start-up" madness will be along shortly.

Best of luck with your new vehicle.

Q: Who has Pureflux? Never heard of 'em.
Posted By: MCompact

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.


Agreed.
Posted By: oil_film_movies

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.
Agreed.
None of which have the filtering performance of a Fram Ultra. Why recommend inferior filters? Are you saying it doesn't matter, and the engine won't explode? That would be true and the only possible way anybody would say to use paper oil filters over double-layer synthetic media.
Posted By: slacktide_bitog

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by ZZman
It is my understanding that you should get a large and small o-ring as they should be replaced.


They are included with the filter smile
Posted By: JohnnyJohnson

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 06:20 PM

I really like the Looks of the Santa Fe but seriously any car with a cartridge filter is off my buy list.
Posted By: Quattro Pete

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
I really like the Looks of the Santa Fe but seriously any car with a cartridge filter is off my buy list.

Why?

Assuming it's top mounted, it's the easiest to access and replace, with minimal mess.

Posted By: MCompact

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
I really like the Looks of the Santa Fe but seriously any car with a cartridge filter is off my buy list.

Why?

Assuming it's top mounted, it's the easiest to access and replace, with minimal mess.



Exactly- it's a no brainer.
Posted By: Superflan

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by Kira
Who has Pureflux? Never heard of 'em.

Purflux was (or is) OEM for Renault, and probably some other cars manufacturers.

Purflux is part of sogefi filter division, who makes the filters with those brands: Purflux, FRAM, and Coopers Fiamm. I go with those brands if I can't find a Mann (that is OEM on PSA), Mahle, Hengst, Bosch. I rely Purflux and like the same that I do for Clean Filters, Wix, Hifi, Fleetguard, Mecafilter. I tend to avoid Ashika, and I will use Klaxcar only if I have no other choice and can't wait for a mail-in order.
Posted By: marc1

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by ZZman

Any thoughts on top quality cartridge filters?


I have a cartridge in my Tacoma as well and I use the M1 line of filters. They are frequently on sale in my neck of the woods too so that is a bonus.

https://mobiloil.com/en/oil-filters/performance-oil-filters
Posted By: walterjay

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 08:13 PM

I had an 07 SantaFe with the 3.3 engine. I absolutely loved the top mount cartridge filter. I did all of my oil changes myself. At 150,000 miles I had done almost 40 of them. In the very beginning I started using the Fram filters. I always replaced both O rings. The Fram O rings were out of tolerance and always leaked. Also those filters were made in China. I switched over to the original Hyundai filter and had zero problems. You can snap the cartridge in place in the canister housing or snap it into the cap, it doesn't matter. Lubricate the large O ring and the small O rings inside the filter before snapping in. If you get an oil extractor you can do all of your oil changes without ever getting under the car.
As a side note, that engine is a workhorse. When I sold it at 150K it ran and sounded as good as the day I bought it. Always used synthetic oil and changed it around 4,500 miles. And also, I recommend getting an O ring pick to help out.
Wishing you the best with your SantaFe.
Posted By: blupupher

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 08:29 PM

For my Hyundai, I bought some OEM filters (got a deal 4 for $30).
Only reason I am not using an Ultra is they didn't make one when I was buying (they do now, still not widely available, but it will be what I use once I finish with the OEM ones I have).

Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
I really like the Looks of the Santa Fe but seriously any car with a cartridge filter is off my buy list.

??? You soon will have no cars to buy then. I think the canister filter days are numbered.

Originally Posted by Kira
...
Q: Who has Pureflux? Never heard of 'em.

They are the ones that make the zig-zag media. e-bay and Amazon are the only places I have seen them to buy.
Posted By: rooflessVW

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.
Agreed.
None of which have the filtering performance of a Fram Ultra. Why recommend inferior filters? Are you saying it doesn't matter, and the engine won't explode? That would be true and the only possible way anybody would say to use paper oil filters over double-layer synthetic media.

There are (at least) two failed Ultra cartridge threads on this board.
Posted By: MrMoody

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.

Different filter, but we always ran Hengst in our Buick Encore and never had an issue, not even the dreaded squished pleats.
Posted By: CR94

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by rooflessVW
... There are (at least) two failed Ultra cartridge threads on this board.
... and at least one about an Ultra cartridge that wouldn't fit. (or are you counting that one?)
Posted By: rooflessVW

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 09:34 PM

Originally Posted by CR94
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
... There are (at least) two failed Ultra cartridge threads on this board.
... and at least one about an Ultra cartridge that wouldn't fit. (or are you counting that one?)

Nope I wasn't counting that one.
Posted By: miden851

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 10:40 PM

another vote for Ultra here

regarding those two oil ring that come with the filter, I really replaced them just few times, never had a problem with leaking oil on my Mazda
Posted By: MCompact

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 10:57 PM

At least with respect to my BMWs, Mazda, and Mini I have never had a problem with the OEM cartridges- and in most cases the prices have been competitive(if not less than) the aftermarket alternatives.
Posted By: IllinoisSparky

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.


This. approved
Posted By: JohnnyJohnson

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 11:27 PM

Originally Posted by Quattro Pete
Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
I really like the Looks of the Santa Fe but seriously any car with a cartridge filter is off my buy list.

Why?

Assuming it's top mounted, it's the easiest to access and replace, with minimal mess.



They cost more for less filter and they can be a pain. Spin on filters are cheaper and easy. You can buy any car you want however and if its not an issue for you I don't care. I was real happy to see the spin on filter come back on some of the Toyota's.
Posted By: js1956

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/26/19 11:30 PM

Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.


Agreed.


I would add WIX to the above, acquired by Mann+Hummel. Great cartridge filter made with synthetic media.
Posted By: DoubleWasp

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 12:01 AM

Originally Posted by Kira
See if there is there is a preferred installation method.

It could be "click into place in the engine first" or "click into the housing first then install the complete housing" for this engine.

It may or may not matter. I do not know.

The "Do I benefit from filling the housing with oil to shorten the dry start-up" madness will be along shortly.

Best of luck with your new vehicle.

Q: Who has Pureflux? Never heard of 'em.


Purflux does a lot of OEM on high end Eurotrash. My OEM Maserati filters as well as my OEM Benz filters are both Purflux builds. They are responsible for the special "fleece" filter you can find referenced in Benz materials.
Posted By: CR94

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 12:07 AM

Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
... They cost more for less filter .... Spin on filters are cheaper and easy. ...
The higher cost of cartridges is annoying, I agree. However, I suspect that's a temporary anomaly, due to their novelty and tooling costs. Spin-ons obviously should be more expensive, with all their additional parts and assembly, assuming the same size and quality media.

Besides, isn't it worth more to be able to inspect the media easily, both before and after use? A manufacturer inclined to sloppy construction might be a little less careless, knowing you can see the "guts."
Posted By: blupupher

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 01:20 AM

Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
They cost more for less filter and they can be a pain. Spin on filters are cheaper and easy. You can buy any car you want however and if its not an issue for you I don't care. I was real happy to see the spin on filter come back on some of the Toyota's.

A poorly designed one is a pain, a properly designed is not.
Yes, Toyota decided to do a goofy under mounted cartridge design. No reason to make it complex.
Top mounted is easy for the most part. You can check filter status mid-OCI if you want to with a top mounted cartridge with no oil loss.

I do agree on the cost.
$8-9 for a spin-on Ultra, $12-15 for a cartridge Ultra.

Originally Posted by CR94
...

Besides, isn't it worth more to be able to inspect the media easily, both before and after use? A manufacturer inclined to sloppy construction might be a little less careless, knowing you can see the "guts."

I don't think I have seen a cartridge filter with poor media spacing like we see on so many of the spin-on filters. I agree with it being seen, it has a little tighter tolerances.
Posted By: BHopkins

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 01:21 AM

Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.


Being new not only to cartridge type oil filters, but also to Mercedes engines, I followed the advice of many on MBWorld where I researched how to care for my new-to-me SL550. The recommendations for oil cartridge were overwhelmingly for the Mann, which is the manufacturer for the Mercedes OEM filter. In fact there are a number of pictures that show the end caps of the M-B and Mann filter side by side. The only difference is presence of the M-B tri-star on the OEM. So it was a no brainer. I ordered a couple Mann filters. Mann and Mercedes say this is a fleece filter, which according to M-B, is a must to give the protection M-B says the engine needs. It doesn't look that much like a fleece filter, but they say it is, so OK. Made in Germany, so they have got to be good, right? Everyone on BITOG says Made in Germany Mann filters are top notch.

Then on my occasional visit to Walmart I pick up the equivalent in a Fram Ultra, open the box and inspect it. What? This filter is clearly far superior to the Mann filter. Now this looks like what I would expect a fleece filter to look like. It doesn't have the number of pleats that the Mann has, but by far it makes up for that it filter media thickness. Holding it in my hand, I can feel the mass is significantly more than the Mann. It does have the glued on end caps that is so widely trash talked on every discussion board and video sharing site on the internet. But so does the Mann. In fact the end caps on the Mann are entirely made of glue.

So I'm going to use my last Mann for a mid-oil change filter exchange. But after that, it will be a Fram Ultra protecting my SL550 when I take it out for a spirited drive.
Posted By: Chuckh

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 02:33 AM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.
Agreed.
None of which have the filtering performance of a Fram Ultra. Why recommend inferior filters? Are you saying it doesn't matter, and the engine won't explode? That would be true and the only possible way anybody would say to use paper oil filters over double-layer synthetic media.


Mann filters are used by many Audi and Volkswagen owners. They are usually pretty good. I bought Purolator and the last Purolator I bought for my Volkswagen was a Purolator Boss. It sold for close to the price of the Mann filter and looked almost identical except for the color of the filter. The Purolator was white but looked identical to the Mann filter. These days that Mann filter is made in Mexico but the Purolator was made in Germany. The Mann filter for my car was usually German (probably still is if the VW dealer has some old stock). I don't doubt the quality of the filter at all just because it is not German, it is the brand that counts. Just as long as the quality is all still there that is what I like. I personally don't like Fram at all. I have seen the what they try to hide in the metal can. With a cartridge filter they can't get away with those shenanigans because you can see the filter media for yourself. Does the Mann filter cost too much? Shop around and look online for prices. There are places where you can find these things cheaper sometimes.
Posted By: Talent_Keyhole

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 02:41 AM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.
Agreed.
None of which have the filtering performance of a Fram Ultra. Why recommend inferior filters? Are you saying it doesn't matter, and the engine won't explode? That would be true and the only possible way anybody would say to use paper oil filters over double-layer synthetic media.


I went to Fram website and could not find any performance data on the Ultra or any other filter. Maybe I missed something.
Posted By: Garak

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 02:42 AM

I believe the Mahle is also like that, with a more "obvious" fleece construction and slightly different ends. A Baldwin I saw pictured for a Mercedes application looked like a Mahle, and another looked like a Hengst. It's probable that Baldwin outsources Benz cartridge filters.

Take a look at some of the competitors online, notably the Mahle, and see how it compares to the Ultra you saw.
Posted By: ZeeOSix

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 03:20 AM

Originally Posted by Talent_Keyhole
I went to Fram website and could not find any performance data on the Ultra or any other filter. Maybe I missed something.


The ISO 4548-12 efficiency is shown on their website.
Posted By: rooflessVW

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by BHopkins
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
OE, Mann, Mahle, Hengst, Purflux.

*snip*

So I'm going to use my last Mann for a mid-oil change filter exchange. But after that, it will be a Fram Ultra protecting my SL550 when I take it out for a spirited drive.

I hope the Fram works well for you.

Fram Ultra Failure

Fram Ultra P.O.S.
Posted By: 53' Stude

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 12:22 PM

Here you go

Attached picture 20190527_025441.jpg
Attached picture 20190527_025501.jpg
Attached picture 20190527_025554.jpg
Attached picture 20190527_025517.jpg
Posted By: MCompact

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 03:20 PM

An excerpt on my experience with Fram cartridges- from another forum:

I recently encountered a textbook example of why you NEVER take a BMW to "Bubba's Fix-It Emporium."

First off, the drain plug was extremely difficult to loosen; when I finally did break it loose I found that the plug was missing its copper sealing washer. Odds are that Bubba didn't see the washer fall off when he drained the oil; so when he reinstalled the plug without the washer it probably dripped- so he really cranked down on the drain plug to stop the leak. Idiot.

Next up was changing the filter. Bubba had used a Fram cartridge which had plastic end caps(which were crumbling) and a filter medium that had started to distort. The correct BMW filter -manufactured by Mann of Germany- cost me $10.85 while Fram's alleged "filter" costs $2.50 more. Such a deal...

The BMW filter also comes with a new drain plug sealing washer and a new o-ring for the oil filter housing cap. Anyway, I wiped out the filter housing as best I could, and I think I got 99.99% of the plastic bits from the worthless Fram piece
.
Posted By: oil_film_movies

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by rooflessVW

I hope the Fram works well for you.

Fram Ultra Failure

Fram Ultra P.O.S.


Neither of those cases resulted in a tear or hole in the media, nor was there any path for dirty oil to get through.
The function of an oil filter is to get the best efficiency and not get tears or holes in them. Fram Ultra does that, regardless of whether you like how it comes out at the end.

For a while, there was one part number Fram Ultra cartridge that had a 1.091" inside (tube) diameter, when it should have been 1.110", a delta difference of about 0.02" which caused a very snug fit.
The filter does need to drop in the tube housing or cage-guide easily, and Fram did have a problem for a while with that.
"funflyer" posted those measurements years ago.
Posted By: CR94

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
... For a while, there was one part number Fram Ultra cartridge that had a 1.091" inside (tube) diameter, when it should have been 1.110", a delta difference of about 0.02" which caused a very snug fit.
The filter does need to drop in the tube housing or cage-guide easily, and Fram did have a problem for a while with that. ...
That problem evidently was not limited to the Ultra version. Only a little over one year ago, I bought a WalMart ST10358, which appears extremely similar to a Fram CH10358. (Whether made by Fram or by somebody else on old Fram tooling, I don't know.) It has the same defect as the Ultra---"very snug fit" on the center tube of the cap.

I get the impression somebody designing these Fram 10358 cartridges sadly misunderstood how the cartridge fits and seals against oil bypassing. Contrary to your implication, that dimension does not need to be a high-precision fit, because the way it fits on the center tube is not primarily what blocks oil from bypassing around the end. It could just as well, or probably better, be 1.12" diameter. There's no need for it to be tight, or almost tight. Sealing is against the flat surfaces at the ends, aided by a spring that maintains constant axial load on the cartridge.

The Toyota (Denso) cartridges have that dimension perfect---large enough to slip easily over the center tube, yet small enough that the bump on the tube functions well as a detent to keep the cartridge from falling off when you tilt the cap with filter in place. My made-in-China Fram TG10358 fits well on the center tube, too.

I also used a Purolator L16311 which had very generous clearance between that diameter and the center tube. That wouldn't have caused oil to bypass the media, but when I took the cap off, with filter inside, I made the mistake of tilting it to let the oil drain out. Because the Purolator fit too loosely to be retained by the detent bump, the cartridge slid out and plopped into my pan of warm oil, about a foot from my face. Ick!!
Posted By: Talent_Keyhole

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by Talent_Keyhole
I went to Fram website and could not find any performance data on the Ultra or any other filter. Maybe I missed something.


The ISO 4548-12 efficiency is shown on their website.


No spec sheet, I finally had to watch their promo video. They claim 99% efficiency. In the fine print in the video it says *FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency of PH8A, 3387A and 4967 or equivalent FRAM TG or EG models under ISO 4548-12 for particles greater than 20 microns." Ok, then what is the absolute efficiency? I can find chinese made, $2.50 filters that will filter at that efficiency above 20 microns, 25, 30. Love how they play word games in marketing.
Posted By: ZeeOSix

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/27/19 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by Talent_Keyhole
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by Talent_Keyhole
I went to Fram website and could not find any performance data on the Ultra or any other filter. Maybe I missed something.

The ISO 4548-12 efficiency is shown on their website.

No spec sheet, I finally had to watch their promo video. They claim 99% efficiency. In the fine print in the video it says *FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency of PH8A, 3387A and 4967 or equivalent FRAM TG or EG models under ISO 4548-12 for particles greater than 20 microns." Ok, then what is the absolute efficiency? I can find chinese made, $2.50 filters that will filter at that efficiency above 20 microns, 25, 30. Love how they play word games in marketing.


What kind of "spec sheet" are you looking for? You don't really need the "absolute efficiency" when you have the ISO 4548-12 efficiency rating. Doubt you'll find $2.50 Chinese filters rated at 99% @ 20 microns. In fact, I doubt those Chinese filter will even have a published ISO 4548-12 efficiency number.

It's not "word games" if you understand the ISO efficiency rating system. ISO 4548-12 is where the "greater than xx microns" comes from, so Fram is actually mirroring the spec. And as has been hashed over about 100 times, saying "at 20 microns" is essentially saying "for particles greater than 20 microns" since 20.00001 microns is greater than 20 microns.
Posted By: ZeeOSix

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/28/19 12:04 AM

Originally Posted by Talent_Keyhole
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by Talent_Keyhole
I went to Fram website and could not find any performance data on the Ultra or any other filter. Maybe I missed something.

The ISO 4548-12 efficiency is shown on their website.

I finally had to watch their promo video. They claim 99% efficiency. In the fine print in the video it says *FRAM Group testing of average filter efficiency of PH8A, 3387A and 4967 or equivalent FRAM TG or EG models under ISO 4548-12 for particles greater than 20 microns."


The same statement is all over their website.

Attached picture Fram Efficiency Statement.JPG
Posted By: oil_film_movies

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/28/19 02:05 PM

ZeeOSix is the best filter analyst we have on these threads;;; whatever he recommends, just follow it and don't ask questions. I'm not kidding.

CR94, I do wonder why Fram couldn't get their filter tube diameter correct. It's as if they don't do quality control on that aspect, and it does make one pause. Still, Fram Ultra's usually do fine. Hoping they fixed thier tube dimension issues several years ago when they surfaced.

And, yes, 4548-12 with stated micron level (20 microns typical) is all one needs to know. Forget 'absolute rating' worthless info.
Posted By: CR94

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 02:01 AM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
... CR94, I do wonder why Fram couldn't get their filter tube diameter correct. It's as if they don't do quality control on that aspect, and it does make one pause. Still, Fram Ultra's usually do fine. Hoping they fixed thier tube dimension issues several years ago when they surfaced. ...
In case this wasn't clear, the dimension in question is not actually a tube diameter. It's the diameter of the center hole in the end cap (or corresponding hole in endcapless designs such as Denso), which must fit over the steel center tube built into the cartridge housing cap.

From what I read on BITOG, evidently spin-on Ultras indeed "usually do fine." I'm not fully convinced they know what they're doing with their US-made cartridges. On another hand, the made-in-China Fram TG10358 looks good and fits properly.

Purolator cartridges for the same application have questionable aspects, too.
Posted By: ChrisD46

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 10:59 AM

+1 !!!! .... I have been using this Fram Ultra 9999 in my 3.8L Sedona with excellent results - this is one very high quality filter which can go 2 or 3 5K mile oil changes if you prefer .
Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
Fram Ultra XG9999 .. Here is the reason: 4548-12 tests are best, and its good for 20,000 miles, wire-backed.
[Linked Image]
Big as it is, that thing will have no problem going a full 20,000 miles. I've seen bigger engines with much small oil filters. For example, GM V8's use the PF64, not big at all!
Posted By: 4WD

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 01:04 PM

Just admit the model number factors in … wink
Posted By: Ponchinizo

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 04:05 PM

From what I've seen on BITOG, Purolators and Frams fail occasionally. Seems to me Purolator more often with more severe failures, but that could be chalked up to bias from the community.

Regardless, I won't use either of them, and just stick to OEM. Never had a denso filter fail on me and i haven't seen one fail online anywhere either. They seem to prioritize flow over efficiency, but those Toyota's last a long long time so I figure the engineers who spec'ed that filter know what they're talking about. At any rate they know more than me!
Posted By: kschachn

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 04:40 PM

Where have you seen flow rates and efficiency ratings for Denso filters?
Posted By: Ponchinizo

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by kschachn
Where have you seen flow rates and efficiency ratings for Denso filters?


I haven't! That's why i said "seems like", i did not want to come off as claiming I had any hard data on them. Apologies if I did.

I've only read here and on Toyota forums that the denso filters prioritize flow over efficiency, but without hard data to back it up. I probably shouldn't trust those opinions at all, but I consider BITOG fairly credible in general.

My primary reason for using them is to just default to what the Toyota engineers designed for that car since I don't really know enough to justify changing the vehicles filtration in any way, given I find the OEMs for ~$4 a filter. And I've never ever seen a failed Denso filter. If the FU or PureOne was cheaper than OEM I would consider them for the savings, but as it is I see no reason to use anything other than the OE filter.
Posted By: PimTac

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Ponchinizo
Originally Posted by kschachn
Where have you seen flow rates and efficiency ratings for Denso filters?


I haven't! That's why i said "seems like", i did not want to come off as claiming I had any hard data on them. Apologies if I did.

I've only read here and on Toyota forums that the denso filters prioritize flow over efficiency, but without hard data to back it up. I probably shouldn't trust those opinions at all, but I consider BITOG fairly credible in general.

My primary reason for using them is to just default to what the Toyota engineers designed for that car since I don't really know enough to justify changing the vehicles filtration in any way, given I find the OEMs for ~$4 a filter. And I've never ever seen a failed Denso filter. If the FU or PureOne was cheaper than OEM I would consider them for the savings, but as it is I see no reason to use anything other than the OE filter.




I started to use Denso filters in the early 90’s and by the mid 90’s I was using them exclusively for years. Never a problem and I put hundreds of thousands of miles in those vehicles.

Now I’m using Roki since they are OEM and I suspect I will have the same experience with them as I did with the Denso.
Posted By: oil_film_movies

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 06:03 PM

Originally Posted by Ponchinizo
From what I've seen on BITOG, Purolators and Frams fail occasionally.
Only filters I can remember failing on bitog (holes-tears-rips-breaches) are lots of Purolators, Motorcrafts, and one AC-Delco PF64. Frams, no. ....

Can somebody find one, at least one, incident of a Fram allowing unfiltered dirty oil to get past the media?

This would requre some kind of hole, and is not the same as the odd tight-fit issue on some models from years ago.

On your bias accusation, there is no basis for that. .... If a filter performs well, people on here usually rally around it. ... If they don't, it will get excoriated here.

Just to explain clearly, I'm looking for oil filters that are "Rip Torn", as in:
[Linked Image]
Posted By: CR94

Re: New to the cartridge oil filter party.... - 05/29/19 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by oil_film_movies
... Can somebody find one, at least one, incident of a Fram allowing unfiltered dirty oil to get past the media?

This would requre some kind of hole, and is not the same as the odd tight-fit issue on some models from years ago. ...
No, it wouldn't. Other defects in cartridges can have the same effect.
© 2019 Bob Is The Oil Guy