pH and voltage testing coolant - reliable?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Sep 20, 2014
Messages
3,327
I have been reading about these tests and can't really find any credible source that says this is a solid way to evaluate used coolant. I find lots of advice and recommendations, but no real scientific testing/evidence.

For oil, we'd obviously accept a used oil analysis to confirm the oil is good. Can we likewise credibly use pH and/or voltage readings to continue to run coolant?

For example - vehicle flushed and filled with IAT green coolant, 5.5 years ago. Used <30k miles in mild climate, and it still has a pH of ~8.5, right where it should be, and healthy voltage reading of 0.070V. Continue to use it?
 
Voltage reading is hokus but testing the pH makes sense. Ethylene glycol breaks down to become an acid over time which will reduce pH.
 
Your pH looks good. Pick up a coolant hydrometer to test your freezing/boiling point, they're not that expensive. But at 5.5yrs I'd D&F with fresh stuff, especially since coolant isn't that expensive. I think you'll sleep better at night...
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by Mad_Hatter
Your pH looks good. Pick up a coolant hydrometer to test your freezing/boiling point, they're not that expensive. But at 5.5yrs I'd D&F with fresh stuff, especially since coolant isn't that expensive. I think you'll sleep better at night...

They start at $2.07 at WM.
 
Originally Posted by BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted by Mad_Hatter
Your pH looks good. Pick up a coolant hydrometer to test your freezing/boiling point, they're not that expensive. But at 5.5yrs I'd D&F with fresh stuff, especially since coolant isn't that expensive. I think you'll sleep better at night...

They start at $2.07 at WM.


Yeppers...I have both the Chaslyn brand and the slightly more expensive Prestone brand. All total for like $8...i use both as reference to one another. I try to check once a month (if I remember too) and it takes less than 5mins.
 
Last edited:
I never check my coolant with a hydrometer . Not for years .

I use 100% variety of coolant and never put water in a cooling system , baring a mishap / emergency .

No problem , works fine . No calcium build up ( our tap water is pretty hard ) . Cools fine . Never gets cold or hot enough to cause problem .

If there is no water in the system , it is not going to rust .

Let the flames begin .
 
Flames are not necessary. It has been explained to you, in technical detail and on numerous occasions as to why that is not a good idea. If you choose to continue to do so that is your business but I would suggest it isn't proper to advocate what is contrary to the requirements of every automaker on the planet.
 
Originally Posted by WyrTwister
I never check my coolant with a hydrometer . Not for years .

I use 100% variety of coolant and never put water in a cooling system , baring a mishap / emergency .


You use 100% coolant?

I have hard water too. I'm on well and the cal/mag/lime is waaaay high. Great buffer for my aquarium but not so much for the home plumbing. I only use distilled or DI when I do a D&F / flush.
 
Originally Posted by kschachn
Flames are not necessary. It has been explained to you, in technical detail and on numerous occasions as to why that is not a good idea. If you choose to continue to do so that is your business but I would suggest it isn't proper to advocate what is contrary to the recommendations of every automaker on the planet.


I live in the NW and 50/50 has kept the OE radiator practically brand new. We rarely get temps above 90f and when we do it's not usually for extended periods (maybe a week or two at most). So most of the summer it's fairly moderate. Winter temps are another story though...we can spend weeks with sub freezing morning temps.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted by Mad_Hatter
Your pH looks good. Pick up a coolant hydrometer to test your freezing/boiling point, they're not that expensive. But at 5.5yrs I'd D&F with fresh stuff, especially since coolant isn't that expensive. I think you'll sleep better at night...

They start at $2.07 at WM.



Got busy the last few days with some work things that had me off my routine. Wanted to say thanks for the advise; I'll pick one up next time I am in WM.

I mix my coolants at 60/40 and as mentioned, we very rarely see cold temps. I'll track the pH and freeze point and see how long it actually takes to start to see evidence of modest compromise in the fluid. Should be interesting.
 
Originally Posted by WyrTwister
I never check my coolant with a hydrometer . Not for years .

I use 100% variety of coolant and never put water in a cooling system , baring a mishap / emergency .

No problem , works fine . No calcium build up ( our tap water is pretty hard ) . Cools fine . Never gets cold or hot enough to cause problem .

If there is no water in the system , it is not going to rust .

Let the flames begin .

there is water in the 100% coolant, sir. it is an aqueous solution. also rust preventers. I'm a biochemist, just in case you doubt me.
 
Change every five years and fogetaboutit.
laugh.gif
 
Originally Posted by WyrTwister
I never check my coolant with a hydrometer . Not for years .

I use 100% variety of coolant and never put water in a cooling system , baring a mishap / emergency .

No problem , works fine . No calcium build up ( our tap water is pretty hard ) . Cools fine . Never gets cold or hot enough to cause problem .

If there is no water in the system , it is not going to rust .

Let the flames begin .

You can get away with it in Texas as long as it stays above freezing but I'm not sure what your trying to prove by using 100% since it costs more. A coworker used 100% in his car until the temps dropped down into the teens one night. He started his car before leaving work one day and it ran for about 15 minutes and quit. Burned the motor up. Don't be foolish....use coolant as it was intended.
 
Originally Posted by PaulH
Originally Posted by WyrTwister
I never check my coolant with a hydrometer . Not for years .

I use 100% variety of coolant and never put water in a cooling system , baring a mishap / emergency .

No problem , works fine . No calcium build up ( our tap water is pretty hard ) . Cools fine . Never gets cold or hot enough to cause problem .

If there is no water in the system , it is not going to rust .

Let the flames begin .

there is water in the 100% coolant, sir. it is an aqueous solution. also rust preventers. I'm a biochemist, just in case you doubt me.


There is water, but only a very small amount. I tried to evaporate straight coolant in a wide, shallow pan (lots of surface area) in my garage. No dice. It's like 3-5%, and under ambient temperatures, it just doesn't evaporate any time soon.
 
Originally Posted by mk378
Voltage reading is hokus but testing the pH makes sense. Ethylene glycol breaks down to become an acid over time which will reduce pH.


Voltage readings hokus? One would think corrosion by products in depleted AF would raise coolant conductance and be reflected in raised voltage readings.
Regarding the OP and searches that are not credible or scientific regarding voltages- pick up a chemistry book and you will likely find what you need.
 
Originally Posted by Warstud
Originally Posted by WyrTwister
I never check my coolant with a hydrometer . Not for years .

I use 100% variety of coolant and never put water in a cooling system , baring a mishap / emergency .

No problem , works fine . No calcium build up ( our tap water is pretty hard ) . Cools fine . Never gets cold or hot enough to cause problem .

If there is no water in the system , it is not going to rust .

Let the flames begin .

You can get away with it in Texas as long as it stays above freezing but I'm not sure what your trying to prove by using 100% since it costs more. A coworker used 100% in his car until the temps dropped down into the teens one night. He started his car before leaving work one day and it ran for about 15 minutes and quit. Burned the motor up. Don't be foolish....use coolant as it was intended.


Coolant doesn't absorb heat as well as water, which is why depending on where you live it's advised to do a 50/50 mix of water/coolant...if you run straight coolant you run the risk of not being able to remove heat for the combustion chambers and cause engine overheating. So I think the cold weather may have caused the heat exchange into the coolant to be even more difficult (maybe) and caused the engine to overheat.

But the argument of running straight coolant just to save corrosion buildup is a very poor argument. I've yet to see a rusted cooling system that was properly maintained - water is not an issue - anti-freeze has corrosion inhibitors. The only time I've seen rust is when the system has been severely neglected and the person developed some sort of leak and constantly topped up with straight tap water. THEN I've seen issues...rust, frozen blocks, clogged radiators and heater cores. Otherwise I've never seen an issue. Even the GM debacle of Dexcool (early 2000's), it wasn't really rust, it was sludge because the coolant couldn't be mixed with air...and the Dexcool ate away at the materials on their intake gaskets, causing air to enter the system . It really was the perfect storm. GM has since finally fixed this HUGE issue by making their gaskets with materials that won't be affected by the Dexcool (and now I see people never even changing their coolant). And that's the real issue. Maintenance. Outside of Bob is th Oil Guy, a lot of people don't give one once of attention to maintenance. Just ran into a guy last week that had 161,000 miles on his Ford Edge...came in for a misfire (original plugs), fixed that, then I asked if he had ever changed the coolant...he looked at me and said, no but why don't we do it now while it's here? And he has never changed the tranny fluid either or differential fluid (that one did bite him pretty good at the tune of $2,500 last year - front diff burned out).
 
pH and voltage testing still doesn't determine wether the corrosion inhibitors are in good shape.

With modern OAT coolants though, since the depletion rate of the corrosion inhibitors is so low, in most cases they will still be in perfectly good shape.
With HOAT coolant the IAT inhibitors like Silicate, Phosphate or Nitrite will deplete, but the backbone of the corrosion inhibitor package which is the OAT inhibitor/s will still probably be in good shape.
IAT coolants are really the only ones that can potentially completely break down in terms of corrosion inhibitor because the work differently than OAT.

IAT inhibitors work by the method of passivation, the metal absorbs the corrosion inhibitors, this means that within 48-72h hours of putting fresh coolant into an engine the inhibitors already partially degrade, for example the Silicate is absorbed by the Aluminium, Phosphate by the cast iron, and azoles by copper.
 
Evaluation of pH would indicate if buffers are present in there. How much of a proxy pH buffers are for other additives is a different question.
 
Please forgive my poor chemistry knowledge, but wouldn't any voltage depend not only on the pH, but also on the metals present in the system ?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top