Amsoil EAO filter Microns

[harry j]

TimVipond,
Doesn't any other manufacturer make a similar nanofiber material besides Donaldson? When vehicle owners discover the filtering abilities of the new technology and move in droves for the Eao filter, don't you think other filter providers will want to adopt the superior media?

 

[TimVipond]

Harry - I don't know what the "exclusive" agreement that Donaldson has with AMSOIL. I would think Donaldson holds the patent, so others may not be able to make a similar filter for a long time.

Also look how long it took all the oil companies to jump on the synthetic oil bandwagon. Seems ideas like this are slow to work their way to market.

 

[Gary Allan]

There's probably no motivation to build such a distinctive filter for mass consumer purchase. Amsoil doesn't seel common consumer products. They're a niche product organization. Donaldson is a leader in spin-on filter technology ..well beyond automotive applications. They don't have a marketing system to sell that level of filtration on the consumer level. They're into industrial/commercial. Amsoil gives them a nationwide distribution system. I've noted that most of the internet offerings of discounted Donaldson filters have evaporated.

So, Amsoil sells a niche filter to a niche market. Donaldson gets a broader distribution system ..and Donaldson and Wix provide filler product for stuff that Amsoil doesn't offer under their label.

Just my thoughts

then again ..someone could have just said "Oh! You want to buy our media? And won't be competing with our offerings in the market? Really!! Hey, how about distributing our filters too? You game?? Yee-ha!!! Yaaaaaaaaaaa-hoo!!!

 

[leel]

Quote:

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OK Guys sorry about the delays but the results are in.
The EAO filter is the best spin oil filter that I've tested to date, regarding filtration.

I used the same testing method that I outlined in the Grease oil filter study where I bubble point tested the media with glycerol and 40w oil. Both measurements were a little trickyer to get consistent measurements. I had to degas the solutions prior to use otherwise I had microbubbles in the solution that threw off the measurements. The reason is the smaller pore size of the media required more attention to detail.

Results are:
FIlter Largest Pore Smallest pore measurement
AMSOil EAO 30µm 10µm
Pure 1 in 2004 42µm 10µm
Fram TG in 2004 41µm 15µm

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I thought 30w oil was used in your other test, or am I just missing something?

And if so would the 40wt oil make the test come out differant?

 

[harry j]

Tim,
The fact that other companies are jumping on the bandwagon (and advertising), seems to me to quicken the move to synthetics. At the very least, people who never heard of synthetic oil, now know of it. As drivers who use it speak of it's virtues, I think others will follow suit. I have found this to be partially true, there are those who will never use this technology and others who jump in with both feet. I have experienced first hand the effectivness of synthetic oil and recently, the Superb filtering ability of the Eao filter.A guy I work with, changed to the Amsoil 0W-30 oil and coupled with the Aeo filter, now changes his oil once a year. He noticed the better acceleration the combo afforded his Mitsu 3000, and how clean his oil remained, despite having well over 100,000 miles on his car. there are others.My experiences have influenced others to try syn oil, they tell me they will never go back to Dino oil.What I am saying, is advertising combined by word of mouth, articles etc., will hasten the proliferation of these products.

 

[harry j]

TeeDub,
The ability to flow at lower temperatures, (without going into bypass mode,) is by itself a very important characteristic. This is sure to be a boon for our friends in the colder climates. meanwhile, where's my sweater, it's in the sixtys today and the temperature will plummet to the 40's tonight, did I say sweater?, make that a coat!

 

[harry j]

leel,
I would like to know that too, it would seem that a 40 wt oil would skew the results. Perhaps Schultz could run the test again using a 30 wt this time.

 

[harry j]

My Civic calls for the Eao20 filter.It has a higher bypass pressure than the larger Eao36. Given that the filters are reluctant to going into bypass mode, does anyone think I would have a problem going to the larger capacity filter?

 

[cmhj]

Quote:

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My Civic calls for the Eao20 filter.It has a higher bypass pressure than the larger Eao36. Given that the filters are reluctant to going into bypass mode, does anyone think I would have a problem going to the larger capacity filter?

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I for one wouldn't screw around. With the superior Amsoil filter, why take any chances that a filter might be in by-pass mode too much?

 

[harry j]

cmhj,
Precisely why I have not gone to the Eao36. The new technology is uncharted territory though, I looked into the SDF36 some time ago and was strongly advised by an engineer not to try it. I don't want to take a chance on this issue. I am just wondering if the new Eao36, with it's low impedance to oil flow would change the equation.

 

[Gary Allan]

What did this engineer warn you about, Harry?? The gasket size appears a little different.

Quote:

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My Civic calls for the Eao20 filter.It has a higher bypass pressure than the larger Eao36.

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Well, Harry, let's just explore this a bit here.

If you used either of those filters from Wix:

(Eao36 xref'd)
Part Number: 51347
UPC Number: 765809513471
Principal Application: Ford Courier (72-82), Hyster, Komatsu, Merc. Bobcat (75-79), Pinto (75-79), Thermo-King, Yanmar Excavators
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 4.828
Outer Diameter Top: 2.921
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 20X1.5 MM
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Burst Pressure-PSI: 325
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 20

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.734 2.430 0.226

Eao20 xref'd

Part Number: 51334
UPC Number: 765809513341
Principal Application: Acura (88-05), Chevrolet (85-88), Dodge (91-96), Ford (88-96), Honda (72-05), Hyundai (89-07), Isuzu (85-04), Kia (01-07), Mercury (87-91), Mitsubishi (89-98), Subaru (87-07), John Deere, Kobelco, Komatsu, Kubota, Onan, Toro & Yanmar Diesel
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 3.194
Outer Diameter Top: 3.252
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 20X1.5 MM
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=22/40
Burst Pressure-PSI: 280
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 19

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.475 2.173 0.233

Now those two xref'd to Donaldson

P552849 (51347)



Lube Filters Product Attributes
A - OD (Inches): 2.96
B - Thread Size (Inches): M20 X 1.5
C - Length (Inches): 3.4
D - Gasket OD (Inches): 2.7
E - Gasket ID (Inches): 2.33
Relief Valve Setting (PSI): 11 - 17
Anti Drain Valve (Y/N): Yes
Product Type Description: LUBE SPIN-ON FULL FLOW
Primary Application: FORD, MAZDA

P550162 (51334)

Lube Filters Product Attributes
A - OD (Inches): 3.18
B - Thread Size (Inches): M20 X 1.5
C - Length (Inches): 3.39
D - Gasket OD (Inches): 2.5
E - Gasket ID (Inches): 2.11
Relief Valve Setting (PSI): 11-17
Anti Drain Valve (Y/N): Yes
Product Type Description: LUBE SPIN-ON FULL FLOW
Primary Application: Kubota 70000-15241

In Purolator L14459 (51334)

Height: 2.95
Type of Filter: Spin-on
O.D.: 3.15

Relief Valve P.S.I.: 12-15
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Threads: M20x1.5

L20073 (51347)
Threads: M20x1.5-6H
Type of Filter: Spin-on
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes

Height: 4.74
Relief Valve P.S.I.: 12-15
O.D.: 2.98

If you have ever bought a Donaldson or Purolator ..did you experience any "fear" due to the bypass setting being so much higher then the WIX???

What is common to all three of the above filter offerings? They all share a common bypass valve setting for the manufacturer. Why is this? What does the bypass valve do? What does the bypass valve setting do? Not in functional terms ..but in design/conceptual terms.

The bypass valve protects the engine from oil starvation

The bypass valve setting protects the filter media from too much PSID

That is, if you see a high bypass valve setting ..it is assured that the media is beefed up to withstand it. Conversely, if you see a lower bypass vavle setting, the media cannot withstand that much differential pressure. This is exclusive of what happens to flow when this occurs. Or rather ..what happens to flow to allow this to occur and what role it plays in it.

I'm speaking generically here, Harry. There can, and are, engines that spec a certain bypass valve setting in their scheme of things. VW/AUDI is one. I'm sure there are others ..but as you can see, WIX, Purolator, and Donaldson view all the respective applications ..as vast and diverse as they may be, to fall under ONE bypass valve setting ..yet each bypass valve setting is different for all of them.

Quote:

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Given that the filters are reluctant to going into bypass mode

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Reluctant? They don't have a choice in the matter. Either conditions dictate that they start opening ..or conditions don't

What you should appreciate is/are the conditions that dictate the action.

 

[harry j]

The engineer warned me that the bypass setting for the SDF36 was lower than the SDF20. I used the term reluctant to mean that the Eao filter will not go into bypass as easily as other filters.My computer is crashing so I have to make this brief. Thankyou for the Eao specs, it is obvious that the Eao36 will not fit my application, making all other considerations irrevelant. Gotta run, thanks again Gary Allan.

 

[Gary Allan]

But WAIT!!! I haven't given you enough rhetoric and other senseless ponderings that give me such a feeling of self importance!!

How rude!!

 

[427Z06]

Quote:

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My Civic calls for the Eao20 filter. It has a higher bypass pressure than the larger Eao36.

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Not according to the specs I have...unless they were recently changed.

 

[cmhj]

Thanks for the chart 427. How old is this?

 

[Tempest]

Another chart here: http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/s...part=1&vc=1 Scroll down a little.

 

[Tempest]

Quote:

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The bypass valve setting protects the filter media from too much PSID

That is, if you see a high bypass valve setting ..it is assured that the media is beefed up to withstand it. Conversely, if you see a lower bypass vavle setting, the media cannot withstand that much differential pressure. This is exclusive of what happens to flow when this occurs. Or rather ..what happens to flow to allow this to occur and what role it plays in it.

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Interesting as always Gary. Can we infer from this that a filter built with a higher bypass setting is better constructed? I believe the Eao uses the same media for all filters though...

And that those with a higher bypass will filter better due to the fact that the bypass valve will be open less?

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:

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Can we infer from this that a filter built with a higher bypass setting is better constructed?

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Generally speaking, YES. I don't think "better" is quite the right term, though. Surely something spec'd for an Audi/VW has a reinforced media to withstand the 30 PSI bypass setting. The engines are apparently engineered to cope with whatever side effect this presents. Now you surely would not want to use that filter on something that typically spec's a 8-16 psi bypass valve (accounting for Wix through Purolator).

..but the media must be more able to withstand the added pressure. It's probably not indicative of it's filtering ability.

Here's a VW filter by WIX ..the micron rating isn't all that good ..the burst pressure is a little up there ..but it doesn't sport any high volume ..at least not above any of the other WIX offerings with the 8-11 bypass valve..

Part Number: 51393
UPC Number: 765809513938
Principal Application: Audi (71-06), Volkswagen (96-05), Lotus (71-74)
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 4.820
Outer Diameter Top: 3.020
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 3/4-16
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 33
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Burst Pressure-PSI: 410
Max Flow Rate: 7-9 GPM
Nominal Micro Rating: 28

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.800 2.450 0.230


I don't know the reason for this high bypass valve setting ..but the media is surely reinforced to withstand it and the engine designed to cope with a potential for a 30 lb difference in integrated flow between pump production and flow to the engine. This could be a good reason why VW/AUDI use coolantil exchangers and probably have some advisories in the owner manual that people ignore anyway.

I don't know if the EaO uses the same media for all applications. One would think so. The only thing I can offer is to compare regular Wix filters to the EaO and see if the Wix is also of a higher bypass setting for that application. From the chart ..the EaO line doesn't appear to be too far off of the standard 12-16 for Purolator.

So, the argument would still be reduced to "would you be afraid to use a Purolator on your car if the bypass setting matched or was near the higher rated EaO setting?" If yes, then the fear is not rational ..since there are millions of units using Purolator that are subjecting their engine to the higher bypass with zero options because of the brand choice.

There is one rational reason for different bypass settings for specific applications from my point of view. If the OEM spec is to have the oil pump near or continually in the relief state (some engines start off at 45lb and stay at 45lbs ..they're just in varied states of relief) then a higher bypass setting would assure more filtered flow under that condition. There will be a higher potential for PSID due to viscosity.

 

[427Z06]

Quote:

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There is one rational reason for different bypass settings for specific applications from my point of view. If the OEM spec is to have the oil pump near or continually in the relief state (some engines start off at 45lb and stay at 45lbs ..they're just in varied states of relief) then a higher bypass setting would assure more filtered flow under that condition. There will be a higher potential for PSID due to viscosity.

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Hmmm...I can't see anyone designing an engine like this. I mean, your counting on a commodity part that's continually replaced, and thus susceptible to wrong part selection. I'd rather think they just like to cover transients where other designers may accept a little bypass.

 

[427Z06]

Quote:

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Thanks for the chart 427. How old is this?

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I got the data last summer from one of the oil saleman and made a chart of it. That's why I made the spec change caveat...always good to double check stuff.