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What is non-detergent oil for? #689462
09/15/06 07:48 AM
09/15/06 07:48 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 338
North Texas
63Avanti Offline OP
63Avanti  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 338
North Texas
I see racks of non-detergent oil around here. The last time I heard of someone using non-detergent oil was about 30 years ago when a 70 year old mechanic refused to follow the oil recommended in the manual because he did not trust the new fangled stuff, "not enough data to prove that it will not fail."

My question is: What is non-detergent oil
1. used for?
2. recommended by manufacturers for?

just curious

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689463
09/15/06 08:12 AM
09/15/06 08:12 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 550
Wisconsin
BigAl Offline
BigAl  Offline
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 550
Wisconsin
I believe that Roots recommends it for the gearboxes on some of their industrial positive displacement blowers. . . but that might be an old spec. The idea was to let the contaminants fall out of suspension so they would not continue to circulate through the gears and bearings of an unfiltered system.

It can be used to lubricate plain journal bearings like those found in old furnaces. It might be suitable for some hydraulic jacks.

I think the stuff in stores is mainly there to dupe ignorant customers into buying plain, unadditized base oil for about the same price as a fully formulated oil.

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689464
09/15/06 08:28 AM
09/15/06 08:28 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,974
New Brunswick
55Test Offline
55Test  Offline
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,974
New Brunswick
A quart of non-detergent oil in Canadian Tire is something like $3.19 while the cheapest oil Canadian Tire stocks is $1.98, same situation with Walmart, the Tech2000 non-detergent oil is about 40 cents more than normal motor oil. I guess that should be enough to keep most people away from it.

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689465
09/15/06 08:54 AM
09/15/06 08:54 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,250
The Garden State
Whimsey Online content
Whimsey  Online Content
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,250
The Garden State
My electric trimming chainsaw uses nondetergent 30 wt oil for lubing the chain. My electric nail gun compressor uses 20 wt ND. Though that's been converted over to my left over 5W-30 synthetic oils since my workers never changed or checked the oil and almost made toast out of the motor. The synthetic motor oil seems to help the damaged motor work ok.

My REAL leaky 1961 Chevy Impala use to use re-refined ND oil 35 years ago [Roll Eyes] . That car used more oil than gas. Leaky sidepan gasket in the L-6 motor. My father didn't trust me to change it and he didn't care himself until the motor seized on the way home from a drive-in movie and he had to come and pick me and my date up off the side of the interstate [Wink] . In the span of less than 100 miles I leaked 2 1/2 gallons of oil.

Whimsey

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689466
09/15/06 11:06 AM
09/15/06 11:06 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 855
Arizona
MC5W20 Offline
MC5W20  Offline
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 855
Arizona
I'm guessing its not for doing the laundry. [LOL!]

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689467
09/15/06 05:13 PM
09/15/06 05:13 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 789
Hopewell, Virginia, USA
ekrampitzjr Offline
ekrampitzjr  Offline
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 789
Hopewell, Virginia, USA
It's for ripping off the unwary. They then lunch their engines, and the manufacturer in that circumstance won't honor the warranty, so said unwary get to buy another engine too. In many parts of the country, including here, convenience and grocery stores sell off-brand non-detergent "API SA" or "SB" SAE 30 for a little less than they would normal SL/SM oil. All the oil is sold at ripoff prices using the philosophy, "If they need it that bad, we'll stick it to 'em," so the uninformed or those in a hurry grab the cheapest oil. Which happens to be the ND.

Some compressors and other shop and industrial equipment call for ND SAE 30 or other ND weight. Years ago, some mechanics used to advise customers to run a quart of ND 30 in a full tank of gas for breaking in new engines. Wouldn't try that these days in most cars, as this would probably clog fuel injectors.

I have long advocated banning non-detergent oils sold as motor oil from store shelves. Only cars built before World War II specified and would still use ND. California and some other states have instituted stringent labeling requirements on these oils to alert the consumer not to use it in a newer car, but out here these warnings do not appear. There is no reason for this stuff to be in regular stores because of the potential damage it can cause. As a special-order oil for antique cars, this would be all right, but not to sell to some naive young adult topping off his newer car.

This topic has come up before on other threads. On ND oil, some of the other BITOGers believe that "let the buyer beware" should hold at all costs, free market yadda yadda, but I vehemently disagree. Some of the same people would probably also allow infants' elixirs containing opium still to be sold over the counter as was done 100+ years ago. And they would probably still allow sales of fresh bagged spinach leaves containing E. coli bacteria (in the news as we speak, and the subject of a big recall) without warnings to the consumer as well. Hey, caveat emptor!

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689468
09/15/06 06:52 PM
09/15/06 06:52 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,804
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
Chris142 Offline
Chris142  Offline
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,804
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
It's getting pretty scarce here. Been replaced by Super tech and Chevron oil [Cheers!]

I needed 4 qts of it for our shop air compressor and I couldn't find any at the local liquer stores.

I ended up paying $3 a qt for some @ Napa.

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689469
09/15/06 07:52 PM
09/15/06 07:52 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 338
North Texas
63Avanti Offline OP
63Avanti  Offline OP
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 338
North Texas
quote:
Originally posted by Chris142:
It's getting pretty scarce here. ...I ended up paying $3 a qt for some @ Napa.

Check out the Rural chains, Orscheln, Tractor Supply, etc.

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689470
09/16/06 08:17 AM
09/16/06 08:17 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 615
Alma, Michigan USA
pastmaster Offline
pastmaster  Offline
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 615
Alma, Michigan USA
I was down in Texas for a while about 20 years ago and one of the local customs was using non-detergent oils in automotive engines. I would get into vigorous discussions about it. One of the reasons stated was that detergent oil had only 50% oil and the rest additives. That if the det. oil was any good it wouldn't burn off and oil use was less with non-det. Also you were getting gipped because there was less oil and more other stuff, REALLY!

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689471
09/16/06 08:28 AM
09/16/06 08:28 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,974
New Brunswick
55Test Offline
55Test  Offline
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,974
New Brunswick
quote:
Originally posted by Chris142:
It's getting pretty scarce here. Been replaced by Super tech and Chevron oil [Cheers!]

I needed 4 qts of it for our shop air compressor and I couldn't find any at the local liquer stores.

I ended up paying $3 a qt for some @ Napa.

They sell oil at the liquor store?

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689472
09/15/06 10:13 PM
09/15/06 10:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,478
Southern California
Ray H Offline
Ray H  Offline
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,478
Southern California
Unadditized mineral oil is great for padlocks, electric motors, hinges, bicycle chains, squeaky casters, whetstones, children's wagon and tricycle wheels, sewing machines, one piece garage door linkages, etc.

(The last car I sold privately was a '94 Hyundai Sonata. Three months later, the guy showed up one Sunday morning and demanded I change the car's engine and A/T oils for him. I asked him if he brought any oil. He showed me a cardboard box in the trunk with ten quarts of 30 wt. "SA" oil he bought. I complied - five quarts went in the engine and the other five went in the tranny after draining each. He must've been happy - never saw 'im again afterward...)

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689473
09/15/06 10:22 PM
09/15/06 10:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,804
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
Chris142 Offline
Chris142  Offline
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,804
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
quote:
Originally posted by 55:

They sell oil at the liquor store? [/QUOTE]

Ya. Strange I know. Thats the only place I've ever seen it.............Right next to the little bottles of Johnsons brake fluid.

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689474
09/15/06 11:01 PM
09/15/06 11:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 855
Arizona
MC5W20 Offline
MC5W20  Offline
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 855
Arizona
quote:
Originally posted by Chris142:
quote:
Originally posted by 55:

They sell oil at the liquor store?
Ya. Strange I know. Thats the only place I've ever seen it.............Right next to the little bottles of Johnsons brake fluid. [/QUOTE]

Is there a meth problem in that neighborhood?

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689475
09/15/06 11:04 PM
09/15/06 11:04 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,804
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
Chris142 Offline
Chris142  Offline
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 17,804
Deplorable in apple valley, ca
quote:
Originally posted by MC5W20:

Is there a meth problem in that neighborhood? [/QUOTE]

This area (San Bernardino county,Ca) was the Meth capitol of the USA for quite some time.

Re: What is non-detergent oil for? #689476
09/15/06 11:32 PM
09/15/06 11:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 12,385
Northern CA
XS650 Offline
XS650  Offline
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 12,385
Northern CA
quote:
Originally posted by Chris142:
quote:
Originally posted by MC5W20:

Is there a meth problem in that neighborhood?
This area (San Bernardino county,Ca) was the Meth capitol of the USA for quite some time. [/QUOTE]

In one of the rural counties of Northern California (Lake, IIRC) I heard the Sherrif being interviewed on the radio about drug problems and he said that "Beavis and Butthead" meth labs were his biggest drug related problem. A memorable description.

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