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BMW Diesels #5446099 06/04/20 12:21 PM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 42
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Trix Offline OP
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In general interested in LL-04 and LL-12 FE for a BMW 328d F31. It seems that LL-04 is disappearing, with the Mobil 1 oil selector giving me 0 products that 'officially' would work. In the meantime the 5QT jug of Pennzoil Euro 5w30 L from Walmart is the best deal out there, if not the only choice. It seems like the on paper spec is stifling in choice, and makes the BobIsTheOilGuy debate that much more interesting or boring depending on the personality.

In general would you guys think any ESP formula would be acceptable in an out of warranty situation? HDEO, or Corvette Spec 0w40 ESP?

It is a bit odd that my diesel (even if tiny and eco focused) will be with the thinest oil out of the fleet, but if it meets spec it meets spec. If there are conspiracies with CAFE ... etc perhaps that could be part of it. Finding LL-04 or any follow on spec (LL-12 FE) in anything above a 30 weight is difficult at this time. N47 engine used to be known for timing chain issues and sensitivities to longer OCIs, but seems like the later revisions are okay. If a reliable on sale oil is had, 5k OCIs will doable. Unsure how often the 5qt jug of 5w30 L Pennzoil is offered at 23 bucks! Hopefully for decades.


2005 Subaru Legacy 2.5GT (Mobil 1 0w40 FS)
2014 Porsche Carrera S (A40 - Something TBD)
2017 VW Golf GTI (Mobil 1 0w40 FS)
2015 BMW 3 Series Wagon Diesel (Pennzoil Euro L 5w30)
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5446103 06/04/20 12:25 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
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Jimmy_Russells Online Content
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I would use C3 oil. The Pennzoil is fine, Mobil1 ESP is good too I'm not sure why it doesn't carry LL04. Total Ineo Long Life is good oil too on Amazon for $38, but the Pennzoil is way cheaper and probably makes more sense.

Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5446110 06/04/20 12:49 PM
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Bjornviken Offline
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Easy.. Pennzoil with the bmw LL04 approval. And dont worry about the engine, some had the timing chain issue but they have fix it.

Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5446112 06/04/20 12:57 PM
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BMWTurboDzl Offline
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Well even the B58 300+ hp I6 BMW gas engines run 20w oils.

Do the BMW dealerships no longer carry LL04 5w30? Btw..5k mile oci is incredibly short on an diesel running ULSD.

Last edited by BMWTurboDzl; 06/04/20 12:57 PM.

“It took untold generations to get you where you are. A little gratitude might be in order. If you’re going to insist on bending the world to your way, you better have your reasons.”

435i
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5446115 06/04/20 01:05 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,523
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kschachn Online Content
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My local NAPA store sells a variety of Liqui Moly products, one of which has Longlife-04 approval and is reasonably priced. They always try and sell the brand to me when they see my old BMW.

You can ignore the grade designation if it has the approval since it has to meet a minimum HTHS.


1994 BMW 530i, 253K
1996 Honda Accord, 289K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 437K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 290K
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Bjornviken] #5446126 06/04/20 01:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 42
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Trix Offline OP
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Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
Well even the B58 300+ hp I6 BMW gas engines run 20w oils.

Do the BMW dealerships no longer carry LL04 5w30? Btw..5k mile oci is incredibly short on an diesel running ULSD.


Noted, I can go the full 10k if other folks have had good luck there. If the spec is robust!

Originally Posted by kschachn
My local NAPA store sells a variety of Liqui Moly products, one of which has Longlife-04 approval and is reasonably priced. They always try and sell the brand to me when they see my old BMW.

You can ignore the grade designation if it has the approval since it has to meet a minimum HTHS.


Ah good ol NAPA and their German supplies. I had not considered Liqui Moly. If LL-04 / LL-12 FE spec a decent HTHS, I agree.

Originally Posted by Bjornviken
Easy.. Pennzoil with the bmw LL04 approval. And dont worry about the engine, some had the timing chain issue but they have fix it.


Not really worried. I suspect the High Pressure Fuel Pump and maybe the DPF solution are the only worries. I do want to keep this car forever. I doubt we'll see another BMW Wagon in the US. It is a beautiful car, great for winter, and 45 MPG ....


2005 Subaru Legacy 2.5GT (Mobil 1 0w40 FS)
2014 Porsche Carrera S (A40 - Something TBD)
2017 VW Golf GTI (Mobil 1 0w40 FS)
2015 BMW 3 Series Wagon Diesel (Pennzoil Euro L 5w30)
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5446132 06/04/20 01:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,523
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kschachn Online Content
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Originally Posted by Trix
Ah good ol NAPA and their German supplies. I had not considered Liqui Moly. If LL-04 / LL-12 FE spec a decent HTHS, I agree.

For Longlife-04 approval the HTHS must be greater than or equal to 3.5.


1994 BMW 530i, 253K
1996 Honda Accord, 289K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 437K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 290K
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5446165 06/04/20 02:13 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 3,372
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Kamele0N Offline
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Those DPF standards go like...

ACEA Cx (usually it is C3) as a "base"

And then every carmaker adds something on top of it...

If you are using the "holly thrinity" specs (aka VW-MB-BMW) you really have nothing to worry about...

So if you cant get LL-04.....use MB 229.51/229.52 or VW 504/507 instead...

Range goes from VW as toughes to MB and BMW....

https://online.lubrizol.com/relperftool/pc.html


2008 Toyota Yaris 1ND-TV 1.4 D4-D Tech9 (Shell?) 5W30 C3 VW 504/507
1997 Toyota Landcruiser KZJ95 3.0 TD Shell Rimula R6M 10W-40
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5447303 06/05/20 10:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 9,890
edyvw Online Content
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Posts: 9,890
Originally Posted by Trix
In general interested in LL-04 and LL-12 FE for a BMW 328d F31. It seems that LL-04 is disappearing, with the Mobil 1 oil selector giving me 0 products that 'officially' would work. In the meantime the 5QT jug of Pennzoil Euro 5w30 L from Walmart is the best deal out there, if not the only choice. It seems like the on paper spec is stifling in choice, and makes the BobIsTheOilGuy debate that much more interesting or boring depending on the personality.

In general would you guys think any ESP formula would be acceptable in an out of warranty situation? HDEO, or Corvette Spec 0w40 ESP?

It is a bit odd that my diesel (even if tiny and eco focused) will be with the thinest oil out of the fleet, but if it meets spec it meets spec. If there are conspiracies with CAFE ... etc perhaps that could be part of it. Finding LL-04 or any follow on spec (LL-12 FE) in anything above a 30 weight is difficult at this time. N47 engine used to be known for timing chain issues and sensitivities to longer OCIs, but seems like the later revisions are okay. If a reliable on sale oil is had, 5k OCIs will doable. Unsure how often the 5qt jug of 5w30 L Pennzoil is offered at 23 bucks! Hopefully for decades.

Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5W30 is very similar to what SOPUS supplies to BMW (BMW TPT 5W30 LL04).
Online you have numerous LL04 options, 5W30 and 5W40.
This one is one of the better ones on the paper and it is pretty affordable on Amazon:
https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/8100-x-clean-5w30--2
Motul Amazon

You can get Castrol:
Castrol Edge 5W30 C3


11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5447909 06/06/20 07:29 PM
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DallasTexas Offline
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Not a BMW but on my Benz E320 CDI I use Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5W30 and it meets MB 229.31 and above. Engine doesn't sounds angry.


06 E320 CDI 121k miles
14 Sienna 42k miles
96 E300 297k miles Donated
90 Volvo 240 donated.
2001Sienna donated
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5451191 06/11/20 09:29 AM
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andreigbs Offline
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I run the full 10K (sometimes a bit over) on my X3d, using PP Euro L 5w30. Easy to find, cheap to buy.


MB GLK250 Bluetec // 122,xxx miles // 32 MPG // M1 ESP 5w30
BMW X3 x28d // 59,xxx miles // 36 MPG // PP Euro L 5w30
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: andreigbs] #5451259 06/11/20 10:48 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
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edyvw Online Content
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Originally Posted by andreigbs
I run the full 10K (sometimes a bit over) on my X3d, using PP Euro L 5w30. Easy to find, cheap to buy.

Yeah, you cannot go cheaper than that for LL04.


11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5457555 06/19/20 08:58 AM
Joined: Apr 2018
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andreigbs Offline
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Perhaps next OC cycle I'll use PP Euro L in both, since it carries 229.51 and LL04. I think it's a great oil and quite easy to find locally for a great price. The fact that it comes in handy 5L jugs is also good. That M1 ESP is quite a bit more expensive.
I've been tempted to run a great HDEO like Rotella T6 in both and call it a day, but when the prices for the correct spec stuff is basically the same, why bother?


MB GLK250 Bluetec // 122,xxx miles // 32 MPG // M1 ESP 5w30
BMW X3 x28d // 59,xxx miles // 36 MPG // PP Euro L 5w30
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5458034 06/19/20 07:59 PM
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Trix Offline OP
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I am content with PP Euro L. Right now it is still available cheaply, if that remains static I am happy. If LL-04 remains relevant that is also helpful. TBH, I wonder if I could run the Euro L in my other vehicles (GTI?). The new GTI requires with VW 508 (which is lower SAPs I think?) and a very similar if not the same EA888. Either way I can share oil with my 911 and VW, or BMW and VW. I'll always need two sets of oil.


2005 Subaru Legacy 2.5GT (Mobil 1 0w40 FS)
2014 Porsche Carrera S (A40 - Something TBD)
2017 VW Golf GTI (Mobil 1 0w40 FS)
2015 BMW 3 Series Wagon Diesel (Pennzoil Euro L 5w30)
Re: BMW Diesels [Re: Trix] #5458149 06/19/20 10:45 PM
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BMWTurboDzl Offline
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Originally Posted by Trix
I am content with PP Euro L. Right now it is still available cheaply, if that remains static I am happy. If LL-04 remains relevant that is also helpful. TBH, I wonder if I could run the Euro L in my other vehicles (GTI?). The new GTI requires with VW 508 (which is lower SAPs I think?) and a very similar if not the same EA888. Either way I can share oil with my 911 and VW, or BMW and VW. I'll always need two sets of oil.


VW 504/507 would be a close equivalent to LL04 as they are both ACEA C3.

VW 508 is C5 or something. Basically a 20w with a hths under 3.5

Last edited by BMWTurboDzl; 06/19/20 10:46 PM.

“It took untold generations to get you where you are. A little gratitude might be in order. If you’re going to insist on bending the world to your way, you better have your reasons.”

435i
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