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Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 #5442631 05/30/20 04:36 PM
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sharpmoney Offline OP
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anyone know much about this oil?

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/specific-ll-01-fe-5w-30

is this a better oil than BMW twin power turbo FE 0w-30 that the dealer uses? looking for a good oil every 5k for in between dealer changes on S55 engine.

Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5442824 05/30/20 10:51 PM
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edyvw Offline
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You should use in S55 LL01 not LL01FE.


11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5442841 05/30/20 11:43 PM
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sharpmoney Offline OP
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they put LL01-FE on my 1200 mile break-in service, i believe they are doing LL01-FE even in M engines, someone correct me if i'm wrong? i know for sure they (the BMW dealer) put the FE oil in my car.

Last edited by sharpmoney; 05/30/20 11:43 PM.
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5442953 05/31/20 07:55 AM
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MCompact Offline
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I'd just use TPT 5W-30 and perform a UOA at 5,000 miles. I suspect that a 10,000 OCI is perfectly fine.


Mine:
2014 M235i
2009 Cooper Clubman
1999 Wrangler Sahara
1995 318ti Club Sport

Wife's:
2015 X1 xDrive28i M Sport


Son's
2009 328i

Buy what makes you smile...
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5443605 05/31/20 10:53 PM
Joined: Mar 2012
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edyvw Offline
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Originally Posted by sharpmoney
they put LL01-FE on my 1200 mile break-in service, i believe they are doing LL01-FE even in M engines, someone correct me if i'm wrong? i know for sure they (the BMW dealer) put the FE oil in my car.

BMW dealers do all kind of stuff. And yes, they are all gun hoe on fuel efficent oils.
Your engine is built with LL01 in mind and in your manual you can find where it says that you can use LL01 if you are concerned about warranty.
You do not have to change oil at the dealer.


11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5444348 06/02/20 01:46 AM
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wemay Offline
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A gun hoe is much different than gung-ho. But i know what you meant. 😉


19 Passat Wolfsburg TSi, GTX Magnatec 5W-30 - CH11784
13 Santa Fe Sport 2.0T, GTX Magnatec 5W-30 - M1-104A
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: wemay] #5444700 06/02/20 02:48 PM
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edyvw Offline
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Originally Posted by wemay
A gun hoe is much different than gung-ho. But i know what you meant. 😉

LOL.


11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5444724 06/02/20 03:13 PM
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GJM120 Offline
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If LL01 is in fact going away & being replaced by a LL01 FE, are NA engines missing out on anything with the FE oils vs plain old LL01 ?

Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: edyvw] #5444927 06/02/20 09:22 PM
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Gokhan Offline
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Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by sharpmoney
they put LL01-FE on my 1200 mile break-in service, i believe they are doing LL01-FE even in M engines, someone correct me if i'm wrong? i know for sure they (the BMW dealer) put the FE oil in my car.
BMW dealers do all kind of stuff. And yes, they are all gun hoe on fuel efficent oils.
Your engine is built with LL01 in mind and in your manual you can find where it says that you can use LL01 if you are concerned about warranty.
You do not have to change oil at the dealer.

BMW recommends LL-01 FE 0W-30 for this M engine. There is no mention of LL-01 anywhere in the owner's manual.

2019 BMW M4 owner's manual

LL-01 FE is basically ACEA A5/B5 with TBN ≥ 10.0. Therefore, I think any flagship ACEA A5/B5 5W-30 would do well in this engine. Mobil 1 5W-30 and Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5W-30 are both ACEA A5/B5 and have TBN ~ 10, and they would be excellent choices for this engine, the Extended Performance version being even better.

BMW makes a lot of money from dealer-provided services. I wouldn't hesitate using Mobil 1 FS 0W-40 and Castrol 0W-40 for LL-01, Mobil 1 5W-30 or Mobil 1 EP 5W-30 for LL-01 FE, and the PAO-based Mobil 1 EP 0W-20 for any Euro-OEM or ACEA C5/C6 0W-20 spec. These oils are very cheap at Walmart, and I bet they outperform the BMW "Twin-Power Turbo" OEM oils in any application.


2020 Toyota Prius Prime XLE plug-in hybrid, 2ZR-FXE engine, ~ 65 mpg on regular gasoline, ~ 5,000 mi
TGMO 0W-16 SN/RC Japan
OEM spin-on oil filter Japan
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: Gokhan] #5444968 06/03/20 01:01 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 9,839
edyvw Offline
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Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by sharpmoney
they put LL01-FE on my 1200 mile break-in service, i believe they are doing LL01-FE even in M engines, someone correct me if i'm wrong? i know for sure they (the BMW dealer) put the FE oil in my car.
BMW dealers do all kind of stuff. And yes, they are all gun hoe on fuel efficent oils.
Your engine is built with LL01 in mind and in your manual you can find where it says that you can use LL01 if you are concerned about warranty.
You do not have to change oil at the dealer.

BMW recommends LL-01 FE 0W-30 for this M engine. There is no mention of LL-01 anywhere in the owner's manual.

2019 BMW M4 owner's manual

LL-01 FE is basically ACEA A5/B5 with TBN ≥ 10.0. Therefore, I think any flagship ACEA A5/B5 5W-30 would do well in this engine. Mobil 1 5W-30 and Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5W-30 are both ACEA A5/B5 and have TBN ~ 10, and they would be excellent choices for this engine, the Extended Performance version being even better.

BMW makes a lot of money from dealer-provided services. I wouldn't hesitate using Mobil 1 FS 0W-40 and Castrol 0W-40 for LL-01, Mobil 1 5W-30 or Mobil 1 EP 5W-30 for LL-01 FE, and the PAO-based Mobil 1 EP 0W-20 for any Euro-OEM or ACEA C5/C6 0W-20 spec. These oils are very cheap at Walmart, and I bet they outperform the BMW "Twin-Power Turbo" OEM oils in any application.

S55 engine is developed from N55 engine. Again, stop with your "recommendations" that are based on your Google knowledge. N55 engine as well as it's cousin, S55 engine is developed around heavy oils, LL01. If owner is going to use any other oil, it should be LL01, and not Mobil1 Extended Performance. BMW NA only recommends FE oils in last few years. LL01 oil was recommended before for the same engine. Change is due to CAFE requirements and does not have anything to do with engine design:
Page 185
https://carmanuals2.com/get/bmw-m3-2016-owner-s-manual-83032
Also, LL04 (HTHS above 3.5) is only recommendation for S55 engines in Europe.
And no Wal Mart oils like EP etc. do not outperform BMW TPT. You bet wrongly.
Again, stick to Toyota.

Last edited by edyvw; 06/03/20 01:06 AM.

11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: sharpmoney] #5444974 06/03/20 01:28 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 9,839
edyvw Offline
Offline
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Posts: 9,839


11' BMW 328i xDrive 6MT (Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40+ MANN filter)
11' VW Tiguan 2.0T (Castrol 0W30+OE filter)
15' Toyota Sienna AWD (Mobil1 5W30 EP+OE filter).
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: edyvw] #5444980 06/03/20 01:54 AM
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Gokhan Offline
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Originally Posted by edyvw

And? Noack is very low because it barely passed the CCS test.


2020 Toyota Prius Prime XLE plug-in hybrid, 2ZR-FXE engine, ~ 65 mpg on regular gasoline, ~ 5,000 mi
TGMO 0W-16 SN/RC Japan
OEM spin-on oil filter Japan
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: edyvw] #5444983 06/03/20 02:27 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
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Gokhan Offline
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Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by sharpmoney
they put LL01-FE on my 1200 mile break-in service, i believe they are doing LL01-FE even in M engines, someone correct me if i'm wrong? i know for sure they (the BMW dealer) put the FE oil in my car.
BMW dealers do all kind of stuff. And yes, they are all gun hoe on fuel efficent oils.
Your engine is built with LL01 in mind and in your manual you can find where it says that you can use LL01 if you are concerned about warranty.
You do not have to change oil at the dealer.
BMW recommends LL-01 FE 0W-30 for this M engine. There is no mention of LL-01 anywhere in the owner's manual.

2019 BMW M4 owner's manual

LL-01 FE is basically ACEA A5/B5 with TBN ≥ 10.0. Therefore, I think any flagship ACEA A5/B5 5W-30 would do well in this engine. Mobil 1 5W-30 and Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5W-30 are both ACEA A5/B5 and have TBN ~ 10, and they would be excellent choices for this engine, the Extended Performance version being even better.

BMW makes a lot of money from dealer-provided services. I wouldn't hesitate using Mobil 1 FS 0W-40 and Castrol 0W-40 for LL-01, Mobil 1 5W-30 or Mobil 1 EP 5W-30 for LL-01 FE, and the PAO-based Mobil 1 EP 0W-20 for any Euro-OEM or ACEA C5/C6 0W-20 spec. These oils are very cheap at Walmart, and I bet they outperform the BMW "Twin-Power Turbo" OEM oils in any application.
S55 engine is developed from N55 engine. Again, stop with your "recommendations" that are based on your Google knowledge. N55 engine as well as it's cousin, S55 engine is developed around heavy oils, LL01. If owner is going to use any other oil, it should be LL01, and not Mobil1 Extended Performance. BMW NA only recommends FE oils in last few years. LL01 oil was recommended before for the same engine. Change is due to CAFE requirements and does not have anything to do with engine design:
Page 185
https://carmanuals2.com/get/bmw-m3-2016-owner-s-manual-83032
Also, LL04 (HTHS above 3.5) is only recommendation for S55 engines in Europe.
And no Wal Mart oils like EP etc. do not outperform BMW TPT. You bet wrongly.
Again, stick to Toyota.

You said the OP shouldn't use LL-01 FE in his engine and the dealer put the wrong oil by using it. Should people follow recommendations by an accountant like you with minimal technical and scientific understanding of engine oil instead of following the recommendations in their owner's manuals?

Engines have many versions. You don't know if the newer versions have better oil cooling among other things. Most new BMW, Audi, Jaguar, etc. engines spec 0W-20, and there is engineering research and development going into that.

The oils I suggested are very similar to the their BMW OEM counterparts. Castrol and Mobil 1 are not "Walmart oils." You can shout as much as you want that BMW OEM oil is better than Mobil 1, but you have zero backing and zero understanding of it.

Driving a BMW makes you as much an oil expert as using an iPhone makes you an electronics expert.

Stick to accounting. wink


2020 Toyota Prius Prime XLE plug-in hybrid, 2ZR-FXE engine, ~ 65 mpg on regular gasoline, ~ 5,000 mi
TGMO 0W-16 SN/RC Japan
OEM spin-on oil filter Japan
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: Gokhan] #5444995 06/03/20 04:08 AM
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Gokhan Offline
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Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by edyvw
And? Noack is very low because it barely passed the CCS test.

BMW Twin-Power Turbo 5W-30 LL-01 is almost without a doubt identical to Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W-30 LL-01. Yes, the former is also manufactured by Shell in the US. Their KV values are virtually the same and their CCS values are very similar. I ran them in my calculator and the VII content and base-oil viscosity (HTFS = BO DV150) came identical between the two. They are also similar in base-oil viscosity and VII content to Mobil 1 ESP Formula 5W-30, which was more "stout" as BITOG'ers would say than Mobil ESP 5W-30 that replaced it, albeit these ESP oils being mid-SAPS (ACEA C3) oils.

They are very good oils, blended with a very thick base oil, which I like for lowering wear. 2.6 cP is a very high base-oil viscosity for a 5W-30. The base-oil type would be GTL, suggested by the low Noack value; however, the reason it is that low is because the CCS viscosity is right at the upper passing limit (6,600 cP at −30 °C), which means these oils are almost a 10W-30 and can probably be labeled as a 10W-30 according to SAE J300 viscosity-spec rules—there is nothing wrong with that unless you are in an extremely cold climate.

I also ran the calculation for the mid-SAPS Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5W-30 LL-04—a Walmart oil wink —and its base oil is only slightly thinner and VII content is a bit higher. It is a good oil, too. A few years ago they had an older version that had a significantly thinner base oil and a significantly higher VII content.

>> Automated calculator for the A_Harman index, VII content, and base-oil viscosity <<


2020 Toyota Prius Prime XLE plug-in hybrid, 2ZR-FXE engine, ~ 65 mpg on regular gasoline, ~ 5,000 mi
TGMO 0W-16 SN/RC Japan
OEM spin-on oil filter Japan
Re: Motul Specific LL01-FE 5w-30 for BMW S55 [Re: Gokhan] #5445093 06/03/20 08:44 AM
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BMWTurboDzl Offline
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Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by sharpmoney
they put LL01-FE on my 1200 mile break-in service, i believe they are doing LL01-FE even in M engines, someone correct me if i'm wrong? i know for sure they (the BMW dealer) put the FE oil in my car.
BMW dealers do all kind of stuff. And yes, they are all gun hoe on fuel efficent oils.
Your engine is built with LL01 in mind and in your manual you can find where it says that you can use LL01 if you are concerned about warranty.
You do not have to change oil at the dealer.

BMW recommends LL-01 FE 0W-30 for this M engine. There is no mention of LL-01 anywhere in the owner's manual.

2019 BMW M4 owner's manual

LL-01 FE is basically ACEA A5/B5 with TBN ≥ 10.0. Therefore, I think any flagship ACEA A5/B5 5W-30 would do well in this engine. Mobil 1 5W-30 and Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5W-30 are both ACEA A5/B5 and have TBN ~ 10, and they would be excellent choices for this engine, the Extended Performance version being even better.

BMW makes a lot of money from dealer-provided services. I wouldn't hesitate using Mobil 1 FS 0W-40 and Castrol 0W-40 for LL-01, Mobil 1 5W-30 or Mobil 1 EP 5W-30 for LL-01 FE, and the PAO-based Mobil 1 EP 0W-20 for any Euro-OEM or ACEA C5/C6 0W-20 spec. These oils are very cheap at Walmart, and I bet they outperform the BMW "Twin-Power Turbo" OEM oils in any application.


A little history on the S55. BMWNA has been all over the map for this engine with regards to viscosity. Initially it was 0w40* then 0w30. M-owners were getting hung up on viscosity because depending on the MY the under hood sticker would state either 0w-40 OR 0w-30. Of course the owners manual specifically states only 0w-30/40. No 5w-30/40!! In any case if one goes by the manual then they are limiting themselves to just a few oil choices. Basically the S55 is spec'd for HTHS of 3.0 or higher with a viscosity of 0w-30/40.

*There used to be a TPT 0w40 sold at the dealerships.


Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by Gokhan
Originally Posted by edyvw
And? Noack is very low because it barely passed the CCS test.

They are very good oils, blended with a very thick base oil, which I like for lowering wear. 2.6 cP is a very high base-oil viscosity for a 5W-30. The base-oil type would be GTL, suggested by the low Noack value; however, the reason it is that low is because the CCS viscosity is right at the upper passing limit (6,600 cP at −30 °C), which means these oils are almost a 10W-30 and can probably be labeled as a 10W-30 according to SAE J300 viscosity-spec rules—there is nothing wrong with that unless you are in an extremely cold climate.

>> Automated calculator for the A_Harman index, VII content, and base-oil viscosity <<


10w-30? Interesting. I never thought about that.

Last edited by BMWTurboDzl; 06/03/20 08:48 AM.

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