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Interesting Read #5438061 05/25/20 03:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,068
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montero1 Offline OP
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Joined: Jan 2006
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Tech Facts, Not Myths


In particular, I thought this was interesting.

"Here are a couple of examples that I am personally familiar with, of using far superior 5W30 Resource Conserving Automotive motor oil in wet clutch motorcycles:
A Mechanical Engineer Colleague of mine has a wet clutch 2006 Suzuki GSXR 1000cc Sport Bike with around 7,000 miles on it, at the time of this writing. He is running 5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability (often abbreviated as QSUD) synthetic, Resource Conserving Automotive motor oil in it. And he has NOT had any problems at all with the clutch or shifting. At this time, that oil ranks 4th in my Engineering Motor Oil Torture Test, Wear Protection Ranking List, out of 229 motor oils tested so far.
And as a matter of fact, he was so happy with that 5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability synthetic, Resource Conserving Automotive motor oil in his Suzuki wet clutch motorcycle, that when he got a new 2018 Yamaha XSR900 Triple wet clutch motorcycle, he used that oil in it as well. So far, his Yamaha has fairly low mileage on it, but he has NOT had any problems at all with the clutch or shifting. He highly recommends using that or similar 5W30 Resource Conserving Automotive motor oil in wet clutch motorcycles.
Simply put, it is NOT true to say that wet clutch motorcycles cannot use 5W30 Resource Conserving Automotive oil. The fact is:
Virtually any wet clutch motorcycle will work just fine with most any automotive oil, including 5W30 Resource Conserving oil, as long as the clutch is in good condition.
***
Just below is a comparison between the top High Performance Automotive 5W30oils and the motorcycle oils I have tested (the higher the psi, the better the wear protection). Keep in mind, that my Engineering Motor Oil Torture Test determines every oil’s “film strength/load carrying capability/shear resistance value”, which all mean the same thing and exactly apply to motorcycle conditions with the transmission gears sharing the same oil with the engine, and are represented by the psi value posted in my Wear Protection Ranking List.
Therefore, my testing DOES take into account a motor oil’s capability to withstand with the higher levels of mechanical shearing found in most motorcycle engines. Oils marketed as “Motorcycle Oils” sometimes make claims about their better ability to deal with the higher levels of mechanical shearing found in most motorcycle engines. But, my Engineering Testing shows that those motorcycle oils are only making false advertising claims that do NOT stand up when actually put to the test.
* 5W30 Amsoil Signature Series synthetic “automotive oil” = 134,352 psi, ranked 3rd out of 229 motor oils tested so far.
* 5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Duty synthetic “automotive oil” = 133,125 psi, ranked 4th out of 229 motor oils tested so far.
* 5W30 Motul 300V motorcycle oil = 112,464 psi, ranked 25th
* 10W40 Mobil 1 Racing 4T motorcycle oil = 93,661 psi, ranked 90th
* 20W50 Mobil 1 V-Twin motorcycle oil = 75,855 psi, ranked 163rd
* 10W30 ProHonda HP4S motorcycle oil = 66,852 psi, ranked 205th
* 10W40 Valvoline 4 Stroke motorcycle oil = 65,553 psi, ranked 210th
* 10W40 Spectro Motor-Guard High Performance Motorcycle Oil = 57,977 psi, ranked 224th
As you can see, the best High Performance Automotive oils provide FAR BETTER engine and transmission wear protection than most “motorcycle oils”. And as mentioned above, automotive motor oils also typically provide more HP and better MPG, compared to the lower performing motorcycle oils.
Most motorcycle engines:
* Make far more power per cubic inch, than car engines.
* Rev far higher than car engines.
* Typically get run much harder than most car engines.
*Share the same oil for both the engine and the transmission, which subjects the oil to considerably higher levels of mechanical shearing.
Therefore, I recommend using High Performance Automotive oils in motorcycles, wet clutch or not.
So, at the end of the day, motorcycle owners have to ask themselves if they really want to run a poor performing motorcycle oil in their beloved bike, or if they would be better off using a FAR SUPERIOR High Performance Automotive motor oil? The choice is theirs."


'07 Z4 3.0 SI
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Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438084 05/25/20 05:59 AM
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 627
Superflan Offline
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I had numerous cases of using car or truck oils in wet clutch motorcycle engines led to immediate clutch slipping the first run after oil change. Those clutches weren't new, but weren't slipping under any power condition before switching to car oil.

That's when it happened twice to my bikes that I stopped using car oil. And thats when my clutch problems stopped too.


‘01 Peugeot Partner 1.9 D, 15W40 E7, 276000 Km, running straight WVO
Wife's '19 Suzuki Vitara 1.0 Boosterjet (TGDI), 5W40 A3/B4, 31000 Km
Backup ‘01 Toyota RAV4 3-dr 2.0 VVTi, 5W40 A3/B4, 170000 Km
Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438111 05/25/20 06:38 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,878
sloinker Offline
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Maybe after the initial slippage the clutches weld themselves together and the slipping goes away?


'16 Tiguan TSI Vaico 5W40
'15 VW Golf TDI Red Line 5W30 Euro
'15 VW Golf Sportwagen TDI M1 ESP 5W30
'14 Dodge Grand Caravan 3.6 Valvoline 5W20 Semi Synthetic
'64 Plymouth Fury440 Pending
Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438126 05/25/20 07:02 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,695
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MrHorspwer Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,695
Two things always sent up red flags about 540Rat:

Never believe anybody who is not willing to share their name, especially if they purport themselves to be a "professional". Part of being a professional is standing behind your word. You can't do that if nobody knows who "you" are.

Quote
Those critics have tried to discredit my Engineering test data, but they have failed miserably, as you can see from the continual amazing growth and success of this Blog.


This reeks of "flat Earth" logic. Like this: If I say something and nobody can present evidence to discredit me to my own satisfaction, what I am saying must be true. Also, my blog is really popular, so it must be correct.

Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438191 05/25/20 08:41 AM
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bullwinkle Offline
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As soon as I see it's a "one armed bandit" type test, my belief in the results disappears. Any gear oil would win every time!


06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4(FG Venturi), 89 F-450 7.3, 98 XJ 4.0(XG8A), 05 xB(XG3600), 18 Transit 3.7 (MC), 03 Merc Grand Marquis 4.6 2V(XG2), 11 Express 3500 6.0 (Fram PH10060 for now)
Re: Interesting Read [Re: bullwinkle] #5438207 05/25/20 09:12 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,476
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kschachn Offline
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Yep this is the same truckload of garbage that guy has been pushing since he started. Nothing new here except that he’s still sucking in people who fall for it.


1994 BMW 530i, 253K
1996 Honda Accord, 289K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 437K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 290K
Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438213 05/25/20 09:26 AM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,127
Astro14 Offline
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Posts: 11,127
These are not “Tech facts”

These are one guy’s “tech opinions”

And they’re worth what you paid for them...


32 Packard 15W40
01 Volvo V70 T5 0W30 AMSOIL SS
02 Volvo V70 T5 0W30 Edge
02 Volvo V70 XC 0W40 Edge
05 MB S600 0W40 M1
16 Tundra 1794 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra
Re: Interesting Read [Re: kschachn] #5438249 05/25/20 10:21 AM
Joined: Sep 2010
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4WD Offline
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Posts: 13,233
Wait … wasn’t there a shampoo that did really well on his test … ?
can’t think of the brand but it was head and shoulders above the rest … 🤪

Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438252 05/25/20 10:23 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
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Trav Offline
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They guy likes blowing his own horn almost as much as blowing smoke up readers rear ends.


ASE L1, Master. Deutsch Meisterbrief.
Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438257 05/25/20 10:28 AM
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 547
IMSA_Racing_Fan Offline
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Posts: 547
From Rat Blog
Quote
My advice is, ignore any critics of my Blog, because they have always been wrong, and cannot be trusted.

Haha

Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438294 05/25/20 11:15 AM
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 547
IMSA_Racing_Fan Offline
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Someone is going to follow his advice and be sorry.

The only time I would consider it is for a dedicated race bike with a fresh clutch pack for that extra bit of HP that may mean a win at the drag strip or pass at the road course.

Re: Interesting Read [Re: montero1] #5438335 05/25/20 11:46 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 21,234
MolaKule Offline
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Quote
...But, my Engineering Testing shows that those motorcycle oils are only making false advertising claims that do NOT stand up when actually put to the test.


What engineering testing and what standards of testing were followed?

I am going to lock this thread because I believe this to be the same RAT that generated a questionable motor oil rating list devoid of any real scientific basis.

Last edited by MolaKule; 05/25/20 11:52 AM.

"So many shows out there dumb-down the country. It's so admirable to be part of a show that wants people to think." (David Krumholtz 'Charlie Epps' of NUMB3RS)
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