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Shotgun ammo question #5437323 05/24/20 09:39 AM
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clarkflower Offline OP
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20 Ga 18 inch barrel

Looking for apartment home defense very short range. 15-20 feet.

Choices

I was using 9 pellet of Rio #1 Buck advertised at 1345 FPS

Since then 2 new rounds are out:
10 pellets #0 Buck advertised at 1150 FPS
8 pellets of #00 Buck advertised at 1200 FPS

My observations. Rio seems to have a bit more kick but the least total weight if I'm correct at 360 grain. Does weight matter?

I have tried the Fed 3 inch Mag 18 pellet #3 buck but its really too much kick.
From all I've read the 4 buck just does not seem to always have the penetration needed.

Last edited by clarkflower; 05/24/20 09:44 AM.
Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437337 05/24/20 09:52 AM
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ABN_CBT_ENGR Offline
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Originally Posted by clarkflower


very short range. 15-20 feet.

the 4 buck just does not seem to always have the penetration needed.


At that range, unless the target is wearing level III armor with trauma plates, any selection will be lethal and penetration isn't going to be an issue for any soft target unless you have to fire through an obstruction- if that's the case wait till you have a clear shot

Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437344 05/24/20 09:59 AM
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JohnG Offline
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Yes, more weight = more kick if you drive to loads at similar velocity. Either of those lower velocity rounds should perform fine, and kick less.
If you're worried about too little penetration, follow up with a slug. Just remember, walls are thin and won't stop a slug.

Don't forget to get a pattern at your intended shooting distance. You may not see any spread at all @ 15'.

Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: JohnG] #5437348 05/24/20 10:07 AM
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clarkflower Offline OP
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Originally Posted by JohnG
Yes, more weight = more kick if you drive to loads at similar velocity. Either of those lower velocity rounds should perform fine, and kick less.
If you're worried about too little penetration, follow up with a slug. Just remember, walls are thin and won't stop a slug.

Don't forget to get a pattern at your intended shooting distance. You may not see any spread at all @ 15'.


Thanks...
Glad you brought it up. At 17 the Rio spread was like a big softball to vollyball size.
When I first shot the 00, the spread was medicine ball size.
Then they had a "new improved OO round" (The 10 pellets #0 Buck advertised at 1150 FPS) and its baseball size. When I took it apart its a 0 buck not a 00. The old round was 00

In some ways I like the big spread for eye opening 1st shot at 3 am.

I don't think I can shoot a slug (but they do have a 58 ga ball with 4 #4 buck)

Last edited by clarkflower; 05/24/20 10:09 AM.
Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437352 05/24/20 10:10 AM
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jstert Offline
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at practical and lawful in home defensive uses any 20ga should be effective. my own choice is #5 gameshot in a h&r 20” 20ga single shot. with its automatic ejection of spent rounds i can run it fast. with an added recoil pad it is quite ok on the shoulder. lots of utube videos helped me choose game or bird shot confidently, here are two:

https://youtu.be/f8EL9MXY2S4

https://youtu.be/TwXiQvKwcVs


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Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437371 05/24/20 10:36 AM
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hatt Offline
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Any buckshot that's reliable in your gun is going to be fine at close range.


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Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: jstert] #5437375 05/24/20 10:39 AM
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hatt Offline
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Originally Posted by jstert
at practical and lawful in home defensive uses any 20ga should be effective. my own choice is #5 gameshot in a h&r 20” 20ga single shot. with its automatic ejection of spent rounds i can run it fast. with an added recoil pad it is quite ok on the shoulder. lots of utube videos helped me choose game or bird shot confidently, here are two:

https://youtu.be/f8EL9MXY2S4

https://youtu.be/TwXiQvKwcVs

You must be incredibly skilled to run a single shot shotgun fast in the middle of the night after just being awaken.


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Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437378 05/24/20 10:42 AM
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Everything I have been reading says #1 shot is the "best" for self defense.
Good shot size, increased # of pellets over #0 or #00, good velocity and penetration.

How long are the 9 shot #1? I have some 2 3/4" #1 shot 12 pellet as my home defense round.

Edit: Oops, just saw it is a 20 gauge, that would account for the lower shot count (mine is a 12 gauge).

Last edited by blupupher; 05/24/20 10:43 AM.

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Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437398 05/24/20 11:00 AM
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ABN_CBT_ENGR Offline
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Different thought

you want shotgun stopping power for self defense only and don't want to worry about stray shots going through walls and maybe the need for a follow up shot

Buy a Judge

Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: ABN_CBT_ENGR] #5437419 05/24/20 11:43 AM
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Inspecktor Offline
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Paul Harrell on youtube has many videos on shotguns and loads for home defense.


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Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: blupupher] #5437422 05/24/20 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by blupupher
Everything I have been reading says #1 shot is the "best" for self defense.
Good shot size, increased # of pellets over #0 or #00, good velocity and penetration.

How long are the 9 shot #1? I have some 2 3/4" #1 shot 12 pellet as my home defense round.

Edit: Oops, just saw it is a 20 gauge, that would account for the lower shot count (mine is a 12 gauge).



I've read the same (best) though I don't really get it as OO goes further in gel.

I still like it that I feel more punch than the 0 and 00 buck.

Edit -add Also its cheap vs 2 bucks a round in the 0 sizes

Last edited by clarkflower; 05/24/20 11:55 AM.
Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437441 05/24/20 12:45 PM
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Stacking efficiency for 20 gauge is different than 12 gauge. Personally I’m ok with anything from #4 buck on up. Even with #4 buck you’re hitting a guy with 24 .25” pellets moving at 1100fps all at once. Ain’t nobody gonna shrug that off. They might not die, but they gonna know they been shot.

Generally for picking shotgun ammo for defensive purposes I pay more attention to recoil and ability to get follow up shots quickly. You can miss with a shotgun, especially at ‘across the room’ distances.

You also can’t ignore shotgun shot’s ability to penetrate through common building materials. Those lead pellets will go though more drywall than many people think.
Link to drywall penetration with 12ga #4: https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-3-the-shotgun-meets-the-box-o-truth/

BSW

Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437480 05/24/20 01:36 PM
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clarkflower Offline OP
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> I pay more attention to recoil and ability to get follow up shots quickly.

I get that. That’s why no 18# 3 buck in that federal magnum 3 inch load. I thought it broke my index finger.

Is the quantity of 20 odd 4 buck better than the 10 0
buck?

The way I’m set up I don’t see going through a (side) wall as an issue.

Last edited by clarkflower; 05/24/20 01:38 PM.
Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: Inspecktor] #5437577 05/24/20 03:21 PM
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Gebo Offline
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Originally Posted by Inspecktor
Paul Harrell on youtube has many videos on shotguns and loads for home defense.




Thanks!


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Re: Shotgun ammo question [Re: clarkflower] #5437625 05/24/20 03:56 PM
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bsmithwins Offline
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Even #4 buckshot gets decent penetration in ballistics gel. More pellets mean more chances for one of those pellets to intercept the vital structures inside a human.

Link below has gel results from a lot of shot, from birdshot to buckshot: https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/shotgun-penetration-with-various-rounds/

BSW

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