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Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged #5417000 04/30/20 05:33 AM
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
K
Keleent Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
Hey everyone, I have a 2005 Lotus Elise Supercharged. I have primarily ran Pentosin Pento High Performance II 5W-40 Synthetic Motor Oil in my car under the recommendation of my former boss who is a renowned Lotus Specialist.

I Pair the Pentosin oil with a Mobil 1 Extended Performance Oil filter.

It's been at least 8 years of using Pentosin... I'm wondering if there's an equally good or better oil for cheaper after all this time.
Through 10 hours of searching online yesterday and today, most of the threads that pertained to my curiosity was over 10 years old...

I live in Central California so the coldest nights where I am is around 38 Degrees Fahrenheit.

Few things to consider:

1. Lotus recommends Havoline 5w-40. I don't know why.

2. The Lotus Elise\Exige uses a high revving 2ZZ-GE engine made by Yamaha for Toyota- which Lotus used for their Elise\Exige platform. (Engine is also found on Toyota Celica GT-S, Corolla XRS, Matrix XRS, Pontiac Vibe.) The engines commonly see RPM's of up to 8,XXX.
It uses VVTL-I (Variable Valve Timing Lift with Intelligence ) (Video here if you want to learn about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vV_wcAybpc)

3. Early 05 Elise and Elise with Sport package and Exiges had twin oil coolers in the front of the car. (Only 2ZZ-GE engine equipped car to have them)

4. Up to about MY 2008 Intake cam wiping was\ Is common on the Elise\Exige.
The root cause is still unknown, because the manufacturer does not recognize the problem.
Some theories are:
Sticking valves causing rocker arm breakage from too low oil temperature
(There is an ECU flash available from Lotus that prevents high lift cam engagement until the engine is at 80C or about 176F Coolant temp)
Oil sprayer over number 3 cylinder spraying sub-optimally
(While this problem has been shown to exist, the sprayers are so close to the cams that it seems unlikely to be a root cause)
Lotus set the maximum engine speed too high
Improper hardening of the camshafts from Toyota
Improperly offset lifters or overly-centered lifters
Lotus owners spend more time driving the cars on the high cam lobe
The factory lash spec on the intake valves is too tight for cars that are revved high consistently
They need to be set to 0.010" between the valve and rocker, which is the maximum end of the stock spec. The valves grow too much under high temp and speed to set it any looser.

5. A lot of Lotus owners run Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel oil as it contains alot more ZDDP which is supposed to protect the intake cams and valve train at a greater rate than normal.

After all this information what oil would you suggest?

As far as the Winter number.. should I stay at 5W-40 or drop down to 0W-40?

I was leaning towards the following options:

Pentosin Pento High Performance II
Motul 8100 X-cess 5w-40 (Recommended by Lotus cup racing)
Liqui Moly 2332 Leichtlauf High Tech 5W-40
Mobil 1 0W-40 European Car Formula
Castrol EDGE 5W-40 US
Castrol EDGE 0W-40 A3/B4

Thank you for reading my post and the time you will take replying to my post.

Last edited by Keleent; 04/30/20 05:36 AM.
Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5417008 04/30/20 06:08 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 4,171
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Zaedock Offline
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 4,171
Good Morning! Welcome to the forum.

Nice car! I love the Elise and have been looking for one (my wife says it's mid-life). The 4C is also on my radar. I traveled to the Mecum auto auction down in Florida back in January and there was one Lotus Elise in the entire auction - and it was a base!

I have built engines, hot rods and off road toys, but I am certainly not a Lotus guru (yet!). The spec sheet I could find on that oil didn't offer much in terms of add pack, just general info. A virgin oil analysis would be needed.

I have used Pentosin oils before in my trail Jeep and rock buggy. It was excess oil I had from servicing a customers Land Rover. I had posted up here regarding the oil and didn't receive a lot of responses as I don't believe many use it. That's probably due to the better availability of high performance domestic oils.

At this point, I think following your former boss's recommendation is good. I don't think my advice should supersede a renowned Lotus Specialist. He's probably dealt with the issues you described above and has the experience on the best methods to keeping these cars going. I will say, thank you!, as I was not aware of some of the issues you mentioned. I have a lot of research to do before pulling the trigger on an Elise.


2019 Escape EB AWD/2016 KIA Optima SXL 2.0L Turbo/2012 F150 Ex-cab 5.0L
1992 YJ "The Heep"/2015 Chrysler 200 Limited
1975 Ford Bronco/1959 Willys CJ5/Tube Rock crawler
Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5417022 04/30/20 06:30 AM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 946
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Vladiator Offline
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 946
I've used it before in a couple 1ZZ engines, a couple 2JZ engines, and a 1UZ. In all of these engines Pentosin seemed to burn off a lot quicker with high RPMs, compared to some other oils. Favorite oil across all of these engines was "Delo 39146 400 XSP SAE 5W-40", and it is priced below $20 per gallon on Amazon and Wal-Mart. With other oils I noticed a bigger oil pressure drop after a spirited drive, not an issue with Delo 5w40 though. It kept oil pressure in good range, and seemed to actually clean the engines up just a little. At least that is what it seemed like below the valve covers. And one of the 2JZs had blue smoking when I got it. After 10k miles on Delo the blue smoke on start-up was gone completely. In my experience - this oil is best bang for the buck. I like to think of it as sleeper oil. And it is SN rated.

P.S. Many bikers confirm that Delo 5w40 is a lot more shear stable than Rotella t6 5w40/0w40 for their applications.


0W20 in summer at Death Valley is as good as 25w70 in winter at Alaska. Both can be done, neither is good for the engine long term. Oil grade is chosen by CLIMATE and OPERATING CONDITIONS.
Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5417032 04/30/20 06:53 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,554
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aquariuscsm Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,554
I always knew its was a Toyota,but never knew it was a Yamaha. Interesting! I knew Yamaha made the Ford Taurus SHO engines. I wonder how many other cars used Yamaha engines?


1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
Quaker State Ultimate Durability 10W30
2012 Honda Accord Coupe EX-L 2.4,auto,San Marino Red
Pennzoil Platinum High Mileage 10W30

Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: aquariuscsm] #5417106 04/30/20 09:05 AM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 946
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Vladiator Offline
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 946
Originally Posted by aquariuscsm
I always knew its was a Toyota,but never knew it was a Yamaha. Interesting! I knew Yamaha made the Ford Taurus SHO engines. I wonder how many other cars used Yamaha engines?

Lexus LFA, Volvo 4.4L V8, in XC90 and S80. Toyota Altezza, same as Lexus IS300, but with a 200hp 4 cylinder, aka Beams engine. Also I believe Toyota 2000GT.


0W20 in summer at Death Valley is as good as 25w70 in winter at Alaska. Both can be done, neither is good for the engine long term. Oil grade is chosen by CLIMATE and OPERATING CONDITIONS.
Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Vladiator] #5417224 04/30/20 11:06 AM
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
K
Keleent Offline OP
OP Offline
K
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by aquariuscsm
I always knew its was a Toyota,but never knew it was a Yamaha. Interesting! I knew Yamaha made the Ford Taurus SHO engines. I wonder how many other cars used Yamaha engines?

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/5-cars-built-with-help-from-yamaha/
Theres 5 more you can add.


Originally Posted by Vladiator
I've used it before in a couple 1ZZ engines, a couple 2JZ engines, and a 1UZ. In all of these engines Pentosin seemed to burn off a lot quicker with high RPMs, compared to some other oils. Favorite oil across all of these engines was "Delo 39146 400 XSP SAE 5W-40", and it is priced below $20 per gallon on Amazon and Wal-Mart. With other oils I noticed a bigger oil pressure drop after a spirited drive, not an issue with Delo 5w40 though. It kept oil pressure in good range, and seemed to actually clean the engines up just a little. At least that is what it seemed like below the valve covers. And one of the 2JZs had blue smoking when I got it. After 10k miles on Delo the blue smoke on start-up was gone completely. In my experience - this oil is best bang for the buck. I like to think of it as sleeper oil. And it is SN rated.

P.S. Many bikers confirm that Delo 5w40 is a lot more shear stable than Rotella t6 5w40/0w40 for their applications.


I actually noticed that my car doesn't seem to burn any oil. However, I DO absolutely have an oil catch can to capture blow by. (By the way this is a LEGAL emissions modification which does not need approval.)
I made a video on it here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6GZRL_0kuI

Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5417261 04/30/20 11:59 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,371
W
wings&wheels Offline
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,371
Hi, after much research I have only used Redline 5w-40 (and Lotus or the equivalent Toyota filter) in mine since break-in. Summer only use here in Mass. I have an early '05 with the twin oil coolers and the factory Lotus Sport supercharger kit.

Why Redline? It has good specs, is on the thicker end of 5w-40's and has higher levels of ZDDP than most of the commonly available, or mainstream choices. I was concerned about the cam issues, as rare as they are. Also, a couple track rat friends, Porsche and BMW folks, recommended it. I have a magnetic drain plug and cut my filters, and haven't seen any metal at all, but I do not abuse the car and am careful to be fully up to operating temp before any fun.

Which supercharger kit do you have? Please post a pic of your car. Here is mine:
[Linked Image]




'05 Lotus Elise S/C
'85 Land Rover 90 diesel
'74 Triumph TR6
'74 BMW 2002
'72 Land Rover Series III 88"
'99 Porsche 996
'01 Porsche Boxster S (mostly Wife's...)
'19 VW Golf R (Wife's)
Piper Pa28-236


Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5417283 04/30/20 12:31 PM
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 15,234
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CT8 Offline
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 15,234
Oil will not make up for quality short comings use a recommended rating and 0w works to about -35*F and 5W about 5 or 10*f higher so why would you think you need a 0 W ? Thicker is better [the engine is hot rodded to increase the performance] and notice you posted about the programming holding back the RPMs when cold? What does that tell? When i lived in Palo Cedro Calif a local guy had one.


2015 F150 2.7
2018 F350 6.2
Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: wings&wheels] #5417675 04/30/20 07:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
K
Keleent Offline OP
OP Offline
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Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by CT8
Oil will not make up for quality short comings use a recommended rating and 0w works to about -35*F and 5W about 5 or 10*f higher so why would you think you need a 0 W ? Thicker is better [the engine is hot rodded to increase the performance] and notice you posted about the programming holding back the RPMs when cold? What does that tell? When i lived in Palo Cedro Calif a local guy had one.

I only got the idea from here after checking out previous posts.

Originally Posted by Zaedock
Good Morning! Welcome to the forum.

Nice car! I love the Elise and have been looking for one (my wife says it's mid-life). The 4C is also on my radar. I traveled to the Mecum auto auction down in Florida back in January and there was one Lotus Elise in the entire auction - and it was a base!

I have built engines, hot rods and off road toys, but I am certainly not a Lotus guru (yet!). The spec sheet I could find on that oil didn't offer much in terms of add pack, just general info. A virgin oil analysis would be needed.

I have used Pentosin oils before in my trail Jeep and rock buggy. It was excess oil I had from servicing a customers Land Rover. I had posted up here regarding the oil and didn't receive a lot of responses as I don't believe many use it. That's probably due to the better availability of high performance domestic oils.

At this point, I think following your former boss's recommendation is good. I don't think my advice should supersede a renowned Lotus Specialist. He's probably dealt with the issues you described above and has the experience on the best methods to keeping these cars going. I will say, thank you!, as I was not aware of some of the issues you mentioned. I have a lot of research to do before pulling the trigger on an Elise.


I'm always open to answer questions. Feel free to add me on IG @keleent and I can guide you with questions you may have.

Originally Posted by wings&wheels
Hi, after much research I have only used Redline 5w-40 (and Lotus or the equivalent Toyota filter) in mine since break-in. Summer only use here in Mass. I have an early '05 with the twin oil coolers and the factory Lotus Sport supercharger kit.

Why Redline? It has good specs, is on the thicker end of 5w-40's and has higher levels of ZDDP than most of the commonly available, or mainstream choices. I was concerned about the cam issues, as rare as they are. Also, a couple track rat friends, Porsche and BMW folks, recommended it. I have a magnetic drain plug and cut my filters, and haven't seen any metal at all, but I do not abuse the car and am careful to be fully up to operating temp before any fun.

Which supercharger kit do you have? Please post a pic of your car. Here is mine:
[Linked Image]



Nice Elise! My car was actually featured by Pasmag, there's some pictures there and on my IG @keleent

mag.com/features/5129-performance-through-lightness-clint-yesui-2005-lotus-elise

Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5418850 05/02/20 12:17 AM
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
K
Keleent Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 5
I decided to go with the Motul 8100 X-cess 5W-40

Re: Lotus Elise\ Exige Supercharged [Re: Keleent] #5418975 05/02/20 09:06 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,371
W
wings&wheels Offline
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,371
You'll be fine.. Nice car.


'05 Lotus Elise S/C
'85 Land Rover 90 diesel
'74 Triumph TR6
'74 BMW 2002
'72 Land Rover Series III 88"
'99 Porsche 996
'01 Porsche Boxster S (mostly Wife's...)
'19 VW Golf R (Wife's)
Piper Pa28-236


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