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OEM Oil Pan Engineering #5412392 04/24/20 10:57 PM
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DirtyOilGuy Offline OP
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why do some manufacturers engineer their oil pans to require a rubber gasket and others require RTV. my two examples are the honda B-series engines that have the rubber gaskets compared to the nissan sr20det engines that call for RTV.

is it cost savings or is one a better design than the other?

Last edited by DirtyOilGuy; 04/24/20 10:59 PM.
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412395 04/24/20 11:03 PM
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clinebarger Offline
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RTV is cheaper than a quality gasket, All automakers seem to be gravitating toward FIPG/RTV.


2001 Chevy Camaro L92/4L80E
2006 Chevy 2500HD LBZ/Allison 1000
2010 Toyota Corolla 2ZR-FE/U341E
2000 Toyota Avalon 1MZ-FE/A541E
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: clinebarger] #5412396 04/24/20 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by clinebarger
RTV is cheaper than a quality gasket, All automakers seem to be gravitating toward FIPG/RTV.


Ditto. The assembly line robots that dispense glues or sealants do it with amazing precision. No waste or errors like with humans, so it's basically equivalent to a gasket while being a fraction of the cost.

Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412461 04/25/20 02:07 AM
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joegreen Offline
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Probably seals better to if there are any imperfections plus the dealer doesn't need to wait for a gasket they may not have in stock when working on an oil pan.


1978 Chevrolet k20
Engine: Delo 10w30xle
Transmission: Castrol transmax dex/merc

1984 Mercedes-Benz 300 turbo diesel
Engine: Delo 400 15w40le
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: clinebarger] #5412471 04/25/20 03:25 AM
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OilUzer Offline
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Originally Posted by clinebarger
RTV is cheaper than a quality gasket, All automakers seem to be gravitating toward FIPG/RTV.


I recall reading that FIPGs are more prone to minor leaks or seeps with synthetic oil and/or PAO after a long time. Basically the material is not as compatible with synthetic oil.
Any truth to that?

Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412484 04/25/20 05:09 AM
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It's all about reducing production costs and increasing production efficiency. RTV is not becoming popular because it is better.

Last edited by Lubener; 04/25/20 05:11 AM.

The "thinking" man's friend.
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: OilUzer] #5412495 04/25/20 05:54 AM
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The Critic Online Crying
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Originally Posted by OilUzer
Originally Posted by clinebarger
RTV is cheaper than a quality gasket, All automakers seem to be gravitating toward FIPG/RTV.


I recall reading that FIPGs are more prone to minor leaks or seeps with synthetic oil and/or PAO after a long time. Basically the material is not as compatible with synthetic oil.
Any truth to that?

No.

I rarely see leaks from oil pans sealed using RTV. But Timing Covers seem to be a different story.


2011 Toyota Prius 1.8L - 207K - Valvoline Premium Blue Restore 10W-30
2007 Honda Accord 2.4L - 146K - Valvoline Premium Blue Restore 10W-30
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412504 04/25/20 06:16 AM
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Honda has been using RTV on their engines since atleast 2000. I remember doing a 2000 Accord V6 oil pan replacement last year...and Honda has their own very well known RTV that works great. The closest equivalent is "The right Stuff" RTV and it works great. Beings that that Honda had 445k miles on the original oil pan until it started to leak leads me to believe RTV is a perfectly acceptable replacement to a traditional gasket given how technology has improved.

Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: GMBoy] #5412557 04/25/20 08:05 AM
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14Accent Offline
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Originally Posted by GMBoy
Honda has been using RTV on their engines since atleast 2000. I remember doing a 2000 Accord V6 oil pan replacement last year...and Honda has their own very well known RTV that works great. The closest equivalent is "The right Stuff" RTV and it works great. Beings that that Honda had 445k miles on the original oil pan until it started to leak leads me to believe RTV is a perfectly acceptable replacement to a traditional gasket given how technology has improved.


Ah, good ol' Honda-Bond.... how I detest the stuff. It seals great, but it's very thick. I just finished an oil pump and pan reseal on an Acura ZDX with the 3.7, by the time I got the bead of sealant laid my hands were so tired I could barely manipulate the parts and bolts to re-install the pieces in the 5-10 minute window you have after sealant application.


2013 Chevrolet Volt - Saves enough in fuel to pay for itself!

1980 Honda CB900C - 15k mile cream puff
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: OilUzer] #5412566 04/25/20 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by OilUzer
Originally Posted by clinebarger
RTV is cheaper than a quality gasket, All automakers seem to be gravitating toward FIPG/RTV.


I recall reading that FIPGs are more prone to minor leaks or seeps with synthetic oil and/or PAO after a long time. Basically the material is not as compatible with synthetic oil.
Any truth to that?

No, I has a 92 and a 96 Toyota pu the 92 mine and the 96 my dads last almost 20 years until totaled mine and sold my dads running synoil in all holes since new and no leaks. Replaced the1992 with a 2006 Tacoma and that that had syn oil as well without any leaks.


2015 F150 2.7
2018 F350 6.2
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412599 04/25/20 09:04 AM
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FWIW, I recently replaced the valve cover gasket on my Pontiac since it was leaking pretty bad. After 12 years and 208,000 miles the valve cover gasket cracked and leaked while the RTV sealed oil pan is spotless, no leak whatsoever.


A couple GM's and a Hyundai.
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: 14Accent] #5412604 04/25/20 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by 14Accent
Originally Posted by GMBoy
Honda has been using RTV on their engines since atleast 2000. I remember doing a 2000 Accord V6 oil pan replacement last year...and Honda has their own very well known RTV that works great. The closest equivalent is "The right Stuff" RTV and it works great. Beings that that Honda had 445k miles on the original oil pan until it started to leak leads me to believe RTV is a perfectly acceptable replacement to a traditional gasket given how technology has improved.
Ah, good ol' Honda-Bond.... how I detest the stuff. It seals great, but it's very thick. I just finished an oil pump and pan reseal on an Acura ZDX with the 3.7, by the time I got the bead of sealant laid my hands were so tired I could barely manipulate the parts and bolts to re-install the pieces in the 5-10 minute window you have after sealant application.

I wouldn't use Hondabond anyway, the current product is Ultra Flange II which is very similar to Toyota FPG and Permatex Right Stuff. With the time frame you're mentioning that must be what you used.


1994 BMW 530i, 252K
1996 Honda Accord, 288K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 434K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 284K
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412607 04/25/20 09:23 AM
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ABN_CBT_ENGR Offline
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Originally Posted by DirtyOilGuy
why do some manufacturers engineer their oil pans to require a rubber gasket and others require RTV. my two examples are the honda B-series engines that have the rubber gaskets compared to the nissan sr20det engines that call for RTV.

is it cost savings or is one a better design than the other?


Give you a piece of information I get frequently from my gasket/seal vendors when I consult with their engineering on application specifics.

Whether its factually true or not I don't know but both manufacturers say basically the same but I don't do anything in automotive design to know personally.

Its a cost savings as a result of a design in many cases. ( not to mention that modern sealants are often superior in traditional sealing applications where high pressures or temperatures are present)

In applications where the gasket is also not moonlighting as a shim, there is a requirement for both a certain material rigidity as well as compression for a gasket to function properly.

I am told that in order to try to meet CAFE standards and cut costs overall that the traditional thicknesses and sizes of components are often reduced to where sometimes traditional gaskets would be prone to fail. That would either mean a different gasket configuration ( rubber, O ring, Groove or machined fit) or a different sealing technology like RTV products.

Personally I don't know but it sounds like exactly what I see clients doing in everything else for the sake of the bottom line.

Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412610 04/25/20 09:31 AM
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kschachn Offline
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On my old vehicles, I've not seen leaks of any sort from a properly made RTV joint using a high quality sealant such as Honda Ultra Flange II or Toyota FPG. But I have seen all the gasket joints leak eventually.


1994 BMW 530i, 252K
1996 Honda Accord, 288K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 434K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 284K
Re: OEM Oil Pan Engineering [Re: DirtyOilGuy] #5412611 04/25/20 09:31 AM
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PimTac Offline
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Or simply put, the robots can apply the sealant much easier and faster than trying to lay a gasket.


2017 Mazda CX5
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Roki OEM filter.
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