2010 Camry camber question

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So my student driver took all 4 wheels of the 2010 Camry V6 LE over a curb in a panic moment avoiding another vehicle. After replacing a right front pinch flat tire and dented rim, and getting all the wheels checked out and RF balanced, I took it back to Firestone to use my lifetime alignment policy.

They were unable to get Left Side Camber within specs, and thus recommended new Front Struts.

But looking at the alignment, it started out in spec, and ended up out of spec. I realize adjusting one thing may affect the other, but I wanted to get some expert opinions before dropping time & money on a new set of struts. Seems to me if it started out in spec, they should have been able to keep it there, as all other adjustments were quite small.

The car has only 70.8K mlies, but it is 10 years old. The car does not appear to be riding low and rides and handles just fine. I am also aware there are Camber Kits. I've replaced front struts before, and I'm not afraid to do it again, but I want to know the absolute need, and other options first.

I'll attach a picture of the before & after. If it's not readable, I'll be happy to type in the specs.

10camryalgn_15k_104426417.jpg
 
It's Firestone. They upsell anything they can. They can get that aligned if they want too.

I have seen so many Firestone "recommendations" from customers that I have absolutely no faith in their integrity and quality of work. The lifetime alignment is one of their biggest scams. You come in and they "find things" you must do so they "can align it". Makes the lifetime alignment "deal" not such a deal anyway!
 
Originally Posted by GMBoy
It's Firestone. They upsell anything they can. They can get that aligned if they want too.

I have seen so many Firestone "recommendations" from customers that I have absolutely no faith in their integrity and quality of work. The lifetime alignment is one of their biggest scams. You come in and they "find things" you must do so they "can align it". Makes the lifetime alignment "deal" not such a deal anyway!


This, all of this. I'll take the bus before ever paying Firestone a penny ever again after my multiple experiences.
 
Perhaps there is something wrong, loose or worn out that is causing the left front to go out of specs. Maybe the strut is bad, but they should have found that before attempting any kind of alignment.
 
Originally Posted by Chris Meutsch
Originally Posted by GMBoy
It's Firestone. They upsell anything they can. They can get that aligned if they want too.

I have seen so many Firestone "recommendations" from customers that I have absolutely no faith in their integrity and quality of work. The lifetime alignment is one of their biggest scams. You come in and they "find things" you must do so they "can align it". Makes the lifetime alignment "deal" not such a deal anyway!


This, all of this. I'll take the bus before ever paying Firestone a penny ever again after my multiple experiences.

You got that right Chris. I wouldn't let Firestone work on my wheelbarrow.
 
Originally Posted by painfx
So when did struts had to do with camber? Doesnt struts affect caster?

Bent struts can affect camber.

So, after reading the opinions here, I did 10 minutes worth of research, and then called up the service advisor. Basically, all I need to do is swap out the 1.75 degree eccentric bolt on the strut with a 2.5 degree, and bring it back for a follow-up alignment.

The advisor stated that Firestone cannot/will not do the swap for me because it's not strictly an OEM part, and that's all they use. (This is very debatable as Toyota sells these bolts, but whatever.) But they'll happily honor the lifetime alignment policy if I bring the car back so equipped.

I'm also well aware of the reason for the existence of these lifetime alignments, which are not free. Let's just say I've gotten more than my money's worth out of them before, and I'm about to do so again.

Thank you everyone for playing.
 
Originally Posted by HangFire
Originally Posted by painfx
So when did struts had to do with camber? Doesnt struts affect caster?

Bent struts can affect camber.

So, after reading the opinions here, I did 10 minutes worth of research, and then called up the service advisor. Basically, all I need to do is swap out the 1.75 degree eccentric bolt on the strut with a 2.5 degree, and bring it back for a follow-up alignment.

The advisor stated that Firestone cannot/will not do the swap for me because it's not strictly an OEM part, and that's all they use. (This is very debatable as Toyota sells these bolts, but whatever.) But they'll happily honor the lifetime alignment policy if I bring the car back so equipped.

I'm also well aware of the reason for the existence of these lifetime alignments, which are not free. Let's just say I've gotten more than my money's worth out of them before, and I'm about to do so again.

Thank you everyone for playing.


I HIGHLY doubt your strut is bent...
 
Camber and caster aren't adjustable in most Toyotas.

Something is bent/damaged. Control arms and tie rods would be the first things I'd look at. The CV axle could've been bent, too. The lowest suspension components under the car. A lower chance it would be something on the hub or knuckle

Any impact that could bend a strut would likely make it leak, too, since the piston would mis-strike, so the oil and pressurized gas would leak out of it, and the ride/handling deterioration would be noticeable. I don't think your struts are bent.
 
Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
Camber and caster aren't adjustable in most Toyotas.

Camber is very much adjustable on this gen Camry, and the previous gen (didn't look back any further than that.) I just ordered the 2.5 degree bolt kit from RA, it replaces the existing eccentric.
Originally Posted by slacktide_bitog
Something is bent/damaged.

Possibly... we'll see.
 
The only things that will affect camber are the strut, steering knuckle and control arm on that type of suspension. The tie rods and axles will not cause a camber problem.
 
[Linked Image from speednik.com]



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Since your front caster or camber are not adjustable, the reason for the different readings should be understood. Adjusting toe really can't change camber much at all. You'd need 10 or 15 degrees of turning motion to get significant camber change.

If, for example the rim is bent and the wheel/tire is now in a different position on the second reading, the camber would read differently. Easy enough to check for a bent rim. A bent lower control arm or strut would likely give repeatable results.

I'm not a fan of many alignment shops. All that fancy equipment may not give more accurate or more valid information than simple mechanical measurement. You could, for example use one of those "level" programs on your phone and simply place the phone on the rim itself to check real world camber.

Also keep in mind that for each inch of suspension travel in bump for example (compression) there is an specific negative camber change. Alignment with and without a driver in the drivers seat will be markedly different.
 
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I tried to give enough info in the first post to avoid going over stuff again and again.

Rims are not bent. Please see "road force balancing" in the first post. The dented rim was been replaced. Then, all 4 wheels passed RF balancing with flying colors. A non-Firestone shop did that work, where I bought the tires.

My Camry front Camber was and is and will continue to be adjustable. Just with a greater range of adjustment once the new bolts arrive. Caster is irrelevant. This has already been covered.

I am painfully aware that driver weight on that side will make the problem worse. Ideally unloaded car alignment would have a little less, not more neg camber on the driver's front. On the flip side, it's not off by much.

I crunched the trig numbers and decided that the trivial adjustments made to toe could not explain the before/after readings. I tried to explain that to the service writer when I called back, he just said he could put it on the rack and show me the numbers. May or may not bother with that. I am also aware with tenths and hundredths of a degree being measured, you can lean against a wheel and affect the measurement.

So anyway, I have a plan to move forward, at minimal expense. Once the bolts come in from RA, I'll swap them out right before an alignment appointment. If they don't get it right I'll just go back again until they do. I currently work from home and can work from there on my laptop, it's not a big inconvenience.
 
The end of the matter- got an alignment today, car steering wheel is perfectly centered and car tracks perfectly straight.

Also, I nailed the camber when I installed the eccentric bolt, purely by accident. They never even touched it, before and after readings today were exactly the same. They did tweak the toe-in a bit.

Another funny Firestone story, I was going to give them a little business and let them mount and balance the Winter tire to a new rim (it donated its rim to replace the All Season's curb-dented rim). They wouldn't do it because it was a "used tire" they only mount new tires, policy due to liability.

So I got that done at another shop, and walked out of Firestone for $0.00. At this point, my Lifetime alignment policy has paid for itself, everything after this is gravy. You just gotta use your head and know when to say "no".

They did offer a brake bleed and coolant change... which at 71K is perfectly reasonable. Sorry, but I'll do it myself.
 
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