Coolant Porsche OE vs Zerex G40

[FCD]

G40 is better than Dexcool, they specify it for a reason, they are not the same.

Dexcool is a plain OAT that uses 2-Eha
G40 is a HOAT with Silicates + usually Sebacate instead of 2-Eha.

In fact, in 1996, Porsche switched to VW's new G12 coolant which is very similar to Dexcool, a plain OAT.
However they began experiencing corrosion problems.

So from i believe 2008 onwards they switced to G12++ ( A.K.A G40 ) , which has Silicates, like the old blue G11 coolant which is the predecessor of G12.

 

[willbur]

Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
G40 is better than Dexcool, they specify it for a reason, they are not the same.

Dexcool is a plain OAT that uses 2-Eha
G40 is a HOAT with Silicates + usually Sebacate instead of 2-Eha.

In fact, in 1996, Porsche switched to VW's new G12 coolant which is very similar to Dexcool, a plain OAT.
However they began experiencing corrosion problems.

So from i believe 2008 onwards they switced to G12++ ( A.K.A G40 ) , which has Silicates, like the old blue G11 coolant which is the predecessor of G12.


Thank you Ford etc. You really are knowledgeable about coolants!

It is my understanding Porsche developed the Dexcool formula. Since Porsche is part of the VW group, that reference to VW makes sense. The G-12 coolant has been regarded by Porsche fans as the best ever coolant and is a lifetime coolant. I know of multiple I5 year Porsches running around with it with no problems. I drained it out of a 16 year old Porsche and the entire observable cooling system was like new and spotless. As was the G-12. We wondered- why are we doing this since its quite a job with 3 front radiators and an engine in the back (talk about bleeding trapped air). The forums are also empty of corrosion complaints/comments regarding G-12. If you have any references to this, please send them along.
Since the original G12, there have been many improvements to accommodate new alloys and gaskets, etc. G-40 is likely one. I use Peak Lifetime. But Dexcool will work in a pinch as long as the usual precautions are observed. A major coolant supplier tech line said as much, too.
BTW, there was a G-12+ between G-12 and G-12++ (G-40). I think the G-12++ (G-40)was later than 2008

 

[FCD]

Dexcool was developed by GM not Porsche.

However G12 and Dexcool were released in the same year, 1996.

G12 is less "aggressive" than Dexcool to gaskets, hoses and seals, both are OAT but use different inhibitors.

The full VAG coolant timeline is :

Aircooled
G11 ( mid 80s to 1996 ) , IAT with 600ppm of Silicate, Benzoate ( usually ) and Borate, Blue

G12 ( 1996-2004 ), OAT, Pink or Red

G12+ ( 2004-2008 ) OAT, Same as G12 chemically, but can be mixed with G11 unlike G12, usually Purple.

G12++ ( 2008-2012 ) HOAT, an evolution of G12+, but with 500ppm of Silicate, usually Pink or Purple

G13 ( 2012-2019 ) HOAT, same as G12++ but with around 80% Ethylene Glycol, and 20% Glycerin, usually Pink.

G12 Neo ( 2019 - Current as of April 2020 ) , HOAT, same as G13 but they have added Phosphates too.

The current G12 Neo was originally developed by Glysantin under the name G64 and was coloured green, used by Volvo.

Now the new G12 Neo is Pink, but chemically the same as Glysantin G64, Silicates + Phosphates + OAT

 

[willbur]

Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
Dexcool was developed by GM not Porsche.

However G12 and Dexcool were released in the same year, 1996.

G12 is less "aggressive" than Dexcool to gaskets, hoses and seals, both are OAT but use different inhibitors.

The full VAG coolant timeline is :

Aircooled
G11 ( mid 80s to 1996 ) , IAT with 600ppm of Silicate, Benzoate ( usually ) and Borate, Blue

G12 ( 1996-2004 ), OAT, Pink or Red

G12+ ( 2004-2008 ) OAT, Same as G12 chemically, but can be mixed with G11 unlike G12, usually Purple.

G12++ ( 2008-2012 ) HOAT, an evolution of G12+, but with 500ppm of Silicate, usually Pink or Purple

G13 ( 2012-2019 ) HOAT, same as G12++ but with around 80% Ethylene Glycol, and 20% Glycerin, usually Pink.

G12 Neo ( 2019 - Current as of April 2020 ) , HOAT, same as G13 but they have added Phosphates too.

The current G12 Neo was originally developed by Glysantin under the name G64 and was coloured green, used by Volvo.

Now the new G12 Neo is Pink, but chemically the same as Glysantin G64, Silicates + Phosphates + OAT


Thank you again-
I'm not so interested in the timeline of the G-coolants as to the corrosion problem you mentioned. Any info on that? Do you have any info on G-12 being less "aggressive" to gaskets, etc?
Dexcool is the GM version of the G12 formula. My sources suggest it was a Porsche development. I think perhaps there is a G-30 somewhere in there too.

 

[FCD]

Originally Posted by willbur
Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
Dexcool was developed by GM not Porsche.

However G12 and Dexcool were released in the same year, 1996.

G12 is less "aggressive" than Dexcool to gaskets, hoses and seals, both are OAT but use different inhibitors.

The full VAG coolant timeline is :

Aircooled
G11 ( mid 80s to 1996 ) , IAT with 600ppm of Silicate, Benzoate ( usually ) and Borate, Blue

G12 ( 1996-2004 ), OAT, Pink or Red

G12+ ( 2004-2008 ) OAT, Same as G12 chemically, but can be mixed with G11 unlike G12, usually Purple.

G12++ ( 2008-2012 ) HOAT, an evolution of G12+, but with 500ppm of Silicate, usually Pink or Purple

G13 ( 2012-2019 ) HOAT, same as G12++ but with around 80% Ethylene Glycol, and 20% Glycerin, usually Pink.

G12 Neo ( 2019 - Current as of April 2020 ) , HOAT, same as G13 but they have added Phosphates too.

The current G12 Neo was originally developed by Glysantin under the name G64 and was coloured green, used by Volvo.

Now the new G12 Neo is Pink, but chemically the same as Glysantin G64, Silicates + Phosphates + OAT


Thank you again-
I'm not so interested in the timeline of the G-coolants as to the corrosion problem you mentioned. Any info on that? Do you have any info on G-12 being less "aggressive" to gaskets, etc?
Dexcool is the GM version of the G12 formula. My sources suggest it was a Porsche development. I think perhaps there is a G-30 somewhere in there too.


Dexcool, G12 and G30 are in reality almost the same thing.

Dexcool usually uses 2-Eha as the main inhibitor
Meanwhile G12 and G30 ( Same stuff, but VW calls it G12, and Glysantin calls it G30 ) usually use less aggressive inhibitors like Sebacate.

It's true that all Organic acids, or the salt derived from them are all "plasticizers" to some degree, meaning they can soften and swell certain materials used in gaskets, seals, hoses etc, 2-Eha is one of the most aggressive ones in this regard, Sebacate is much less aggreesive but still is to some degree.

I was running G12++ in my 1988 Escort XR3i and noticed the upper rad hose began weeping again after being changed just a year ago, it was Febi Bilstein brand, supposedly no 2-Eha...
Flushed it all out, switched to the correct Ford spec ESD-M97B49-A coolant, which is conventional Blue G11, and everyhting is back to normal.
G11 is an early HOAT, most consider it an IAT, because it uses Sodium Benzoate, which is one of the oldest OAT inhibitors that you find in coolants, but it's basically "inert" in that it doesn't plasticize or react with anything in any way, it's just there to protect the cast iron and solder.

 

[vavavroom]

Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
Dexcool was developed by GM not Porsche.

However G12 and Dexcool were released in the same year, 1996.

G12 is less "aggressive" than Dexcool to gaskets, hoses and seals, both are OAT but use different inhibitors.

The full VAG coolant timeline is :

Aircooled
G11 ( mid 80s to 1996 ) , IAT with 600ppm of Silicate, Benzoate ( usually ) and Borate, Blue

G12 ( 1996-2004 ), OAT, Pink or Red

G12+ ( 2004-2008 ) OAT, Same as G12 chemically, but can be mixed with G11 unlike G12, usually Purple.

G12++ ( 2008-2012 ) HOAT, an evolution of G12+, but with 500ppm of Silicate, usually Pink or Purple

G13 ( 2012-2019 ) HOAT, same as G12++ but with around 80% Ethylene Glycol, and 20% Glycerin, usually Pink.

G12 Neo ( 2019 - Current as of April 2020 ) , HOAT, same as G13 but they have added Phosphates too.

The current G12 Neo was originally developed by Glysantin under the name G64 and was coloured green, used by Volvo.

Now the new G12 Neo is Pink, but chemically the same as Glysantin G64, Silicates + Phosphates + OAT



When you say G12 Neo do you mean G12 Evo or has VW already moved on to version 14 of their G series coolants?

 

[FCD]

Originally Posted by vavavroom
Originally Posted by FordCapriDriver
Dexcool was developed by GM not Porsche.

However G12 and Dexcool were released in the same year, 1996.

G12 is less "aggressive" than Dexcool to gaskets, hoses and seals, both are OAT but use different inhibitors.

The full VAG coolant timeline is :

Aircooled
G11 ( mid 80s to 1996 ) , IAT with 600ppm of Silicate, Benzoate ( usually ) and Borate, Blue

G12 ( 1996-2004 ), OAT, Pink or Red

G12+ ( 2004-2008 ) OAT, Same as G12 chemically, but can be mixed with G11 unlike G12, usually Purple.

G12++ ( 2008-2012 ) HOAT, an evolution of G12+, but with 500ppm of Silicate, usually Pink or Purple

G13 ( 2012-2019 ) HOAT, same as G12++ but with around 80% Ethylene Glycol, and 20% Glycerin, usually Pink.

G12 Neo ( 2019 - Current as of April 2020 ) , HOAT, same as G13 but they have added Phosphates too.

The current G12 Neo was originally developed by Glysantin under the name G64 and was coloured green, used by Volvo.

Now the new G12 Neo is Pink, but chemically the same as Glysantin G64, Silicates + Phosphates + OAT



When you say G12 Neo do you mean G12 Evo or has VW already moved on to version 14 of their G series coolants?


Sorry, i meant G12 Evo, not Neo.

 

[2EHA]

G13 can always mix with first gen silicated HOAT coolants like G05/11/48. With blue G11 and 48 the mix might turn brown, that's normal.

 

[nthach]

Use Zerex G40. BASF did give Valvoline rights to all the Glysantin G-series coolants in the US. Ford, BMW/Mercedes/VW/Volvo and Tesla all use BASF Glysantin coolants(except for Ford orange/green/yellow that come from CCI or KIK Prestone).

 

[Excellence]

Originally Posted by skyactiv
The Zerex G40 coolant is actually made in Germany by BASF for Valvoline. Good stuff.


I was going to ask you the source (because we all know the internet is the greatest source of unconfirmed information LOL) but I found this online if anyone has any doubts.

Valvoline UK - ZEREX G40