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Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included #5388861 03/29/20 06:56 PM
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NorCalHD Offline OP
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Hi, I am new here, apologies if I do something wrong.

I am interested in Redline 75w/110 for a Harley 6 speed transmission and found the below UOA on another site. It may also be on BITOG. I am curious what you think about it. The UOA results have 10k miles from a motorcycle that shares the transmission with the primary (clutch and chain). One thing that is very different then the other lubes I looked at is the large amount of Phosphorus. Again, this is after 10k miles.


Thank you.


[Linked Image]

Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5388915 03/29/20 08:10 PM
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MolaKule Offline
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If the UOA results are in the Left Column it says approx. 5700 miles, not 10000 miles.


Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "You know, that term "dark matter" has always perplexed me. It fallaciously implies that the 95% of our universe that cannot be observed is some amorphous, eventless emptiness."
Amita Ramanujan: "I'm sorry?"
Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "I guess it's all too human. Instead of admitting to the present limits of our knowledge, we just declare things to be unknowable." NUMB3RS
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5389092 03/30/20 05:46 AM
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shanneba Offline
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The Universal averages are 5700 miles. All the UOAs are 10,000 miles.

For the HD Big Twins with a separate transmission and Primary oil supply the Red Line shockproof is a popular transmission choice.
I would also consider the Red Line 75w-140 for the transmission (HD now offers a 75w-140 synthetic transmission oil)

I added the 75w-90 Red Line diff lube UOA.
I would expect the 75w-140 diff lube to have similar additives as the 75w-90 and 75w-110 diff lubes.

The calcium and zinc in the 75w-110 UOA likely is a little high from carry over from the MT-90 used before.

Code
+----------------+-----------+-----------+----------+
|  Miles on oil  |   10000   |   10000   |  10000   |
+----------------+-----------+-----------+----------+
| Total miles    | 15000     | 25000     | 35000    |
| Date           | 03/26/16  | 08/16/17  | 10/30/18 |
| Make up oil    | 0         | 0         | 0        |
| Oil Brand      | Red Line  | Red Line  | Red Line |
| Weight         | MT-90     | 75w-110   | 75w-90   |
|                |           |           |          |
|                |           |           |          |
| ALUMINUM       | 82        | 81        | 124      |
| CHROMIUM       | 0         | 0         | 0        |
| IRON           | 58        | 74        | 101      |
| COPPER         | 21        | 56        | 42       |
| LEAD           | 2         | 1         | 1        |
| TIN            | 0         | 0         | 1        |
| MOLYBDENUM     | 16        | 6         | 7        |
| NICKEL         | 1         | 1         | 1        |
| MANGANESE      | 1         | 1         | 1        |
| SILVER         | 0         | 0         | 0        |
| TITANIUM       | 0         | 0         | 0        |
| POTASSIUM      | 2         | 3         | 3        |
| BORON          | 137       | 131       | 164      |
| SILICON        | 49        | 77        | 76       |
| SODIUM         | 5         | 8         | 7        |
| CALCIUM        | 2933      | 408       | 119      |
| MAGNESIUM      | 109       | 23        | 7        |
| PHOSPHORUS     | 1957      | 2930      | 3029     |
| ZINC           | 2199      | 392       | 162      |
| BARIUM         | 0         | 1         | 1        |
|                |           |           |          |
| SUS @ 210F     | 77.2      | 92.7      | 78.9     |
| cSt @ 100C     | 14.83     | 18.63     | 15.25    |
| Flashpoint F   | 440       | 435       | 410      |
| Fuel         % |           |           |          |
| Antifreeze %   |           |           |          |
| Water       %  | 0         | 0         | 0        |
| Insolubles %   | TR        | 0.4       | 0.8      |
| TBN            |           |           |          |
| TAN            |           |           |          |
+----------------+-----------+-----------+----------+

Last edited by shanneba; 03/30/20 06:07 AM.

2003 BMW 330Ci
2013 HD Sportster XL1200C
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5389362 03/30/20 11:26 AM
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NorCalHD Offline OP
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Thanks for posting the UOA correctly.

The fluids that have been used the most in HD transmissions are HD Syn 3 20/50, possibly Mobil 1 20/50 also, and Formula+. These spec out at ~20 VI @ 100cst and are GL1 and possibly GL3. Many use gear oils 75w/90 and 75w/140. Those are typically ~15 and ~25+ VI. Given the small bearings and small size of the transmission, I was thinking anything GL5 is a lot more then enough and that a 110w could flow easily to all the small bearings and such.

Redline is a new brand to me and their products as a viable option is also new. Guess Im looking for confirmation that this is a high quality lube with the appropriate additives that will work as expected and also not cause problems with oil seals and such.

Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5389676 03/30/20 07:30 PM
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shanneba Offline
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I ran the 75w-110 shortly after it became available since it was so close to the viscosity of Formula+.

I actually like the 75w-90 better but will be changing back to the MT-90 since it showed less wear.


I would not expect any issues with seals since Red Line uses ester base stocks.


2003 BMW 330Ci
2013 HD Sportster XL1200C
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5390165 03/31/20 12:41 PM
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Thats your UOA?? A little slow here....

Lots of people run 75w/90 in baggers . Many also run 75w/140. And many run Shockproof. Redline keeps pushing the Shockproof/Vtwin 75w/90, which they told me is thinner then Formual+, but its easy to find people that dont like it or dont notice a difference compared to other lubes. And once that thick stuff is in the trans its difficult to remove.

I already have some Valvoline Synpower 75w/140 and may just use that. Was originally thinking theirs something better. And their is. But maybe it doesnt really matter in these trans.

Valvoline Synpower Gear Lubes

Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: shanneba] #5390497 03/31/20 09:25 PM
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MolaKule Offline
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Thanks for the clarification.

Originally Posted by shanneba

...I would expect the 75w-140 diff lube to have similar additives as the 75w-90 and 75w-110 diff lubes.

The calcium and zinc in the 75w-110 UOA likely is a little high from carry over from the MT-90 used before.




Dedicated MTF's use Anti-Wear additives whereas differential lubes use Extreme Pressure (EP) additives.


Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "You know, that term "dark matter" has always perplexed me. It fallaciously implies that the 95% of our universe that cannot be observed is some amorphous, eventless emptiness."
Amita Ramanujan: "I'm sorry?"
Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "I guess it's all too human. Instead of admitting to the present limits of our knowledge, we just declare things to be unknowable." NUMB3RS
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5390544 03/31/20 11:13 PM
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Dedicated MTF's use Anti-Wear additives whereas differential lubes use Extreme Pressure (EP) additives.

I have spent this quarantine time obsessing over bear oils and additive packages. I happened to view probably the best used rear differential report from a 2007 R63 amg with 100000 miles on the flluid and 120000 miles on the car. It had 138 ppm of iron and was in grade at 12.38-was filled with 75w85 gear oil. If you google Mercedes Benz rear differential oil analysis-the one I am referencing comes right up.

My main observation was the gear oil used about 3000 ppm of calcium with 700 or so magnesium 400 boron 2600 phosphorous and 1400 zinc. I often wonder why gl5 oils don’t incorporate more anti-wear additives... I love redline oils , but I have only seen one Redline gear oil analysis on here woth less than 100 ppm of iron and that was on a 2015 Tacoma. Was curious if antiwear additives could potentially damage a rear differential.


Last edited by spiderbypass; 03/31/20 11:15 PM. Reason: Added info

Insecurity with overcompensation are the root of evil deeds.
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: spiderbypass] #5390562 04/01/20 12:35 AM
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MolaKule Offline
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Originally Posted by spiderbypass


I have spent this quarantine time obsessing over bear oils and additive packages. I happened to view probably the best used rear differential report from a 2007 R63 amg with 100000 miles on the flluid and 120000 miles on the car. It had 138 ppm of iron and was in grade at 12.38-was filled with 75w85 gear oil. If you google Mercedes Benz rear differential oil analysis-the one I am referencing comes right up.


What was the original gear lube viscosity and brand put in at 20,000 miles? Without a VOA of the lube for this period it is tough to compare or analyze. Was this an LS differential?


Originally Posted by spiderbypass
My main observation was the gear oil used about 3000 ppm of calcium with 700 or so magnesium 400 boron 2600 phosphorous and 1400 zinc. I often wonder why gl5 oils don’t incorporate more anti-wear additives... I love redline oils , but I have only seen one Redline gear oil analysis on here woth less than 100 ppm of iron and that was on a 2015 Tacoma. Was curious if antiwear additives could potentially damage a rear differential.


This lube looks more like a GL-4/GL-5 combo transmission/differential fluid.


Last edited by MolaKule; 04/01/20 12:43 AM.

Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "You know, that term "dark matter" has always perplexed me. It fallaciously implies that the 95% of our universe that cannot be observed is some amorphous, eventless emptiness."
Amita Ramanujan: "I'm sorry?"
Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "I guess it's all too human. Instead of admitting to the present limits of our knowledge, we just declare things to be unknowable." NUMB3RS
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5390586 04/01/20 02:55 AM
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This was the web page that saw the oil analysis.
https://mbworld.org/forums/r63-amg-...original-fluid.html#&gid=1&pid=1

Fuchs Sintopoid 75w85 fe is gear oil specifies by Mercedes 235.7 specification. Found this safety data sheet on it
https://go.lupinsys.com/fuch/harms/...ch_api/TITAN_SINTOPOID_FE_75W-85-SDS.pdf

This is the product data sheet and it is only listed as a Gl-5 oil.

https://www.generaloils.net/PI_TITAN-SINTOPOID-FE-75W-85_e.pdf


Insecurity with overcompensation are the root of evil deeds.
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: MolaKule] #5390891 04/01/20 11:52 AM
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NorCalHD Offline OP
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Originally Posted by MolaKule


Dedicated MTF's use Anti-Wear additives whereas differential lubes use Extreme Pressure (EP) additives.




Ive only been on this site a couple days and I already learned you are someone to listen to:)


The below is from Mobile when I asked about the comparison of VTwin 20/50 and 75w/140 in a Harley 6 speed:



"Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 is a motor oil while Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lube LS 75W-140 is a gear oil. Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lube LS 75W-140 does not contain any significant amount of zinc as that additive is not beneficial to the applications it is designed for. These two products do not have the same additive packages and cannot be compared in the fashion that you are asking us to do.


If you are trying to compare these products in similar applications, one of them will generally be considerably better than the other. For example, Mobil 1 Synthetic Gear Lube LS 75W-140 will be much better at wear protection under extreme loads, this is because it is designed to provide performance in these applications. Much in the same vein, Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 will do much better in applications where friction control, detergency and lubricity are required (i.e. internal combustion engines, transmissions with wet clutches/synchronizers, etc.) as it is designed for these applications."



I asked because 20/50 has a lot of Phosphorus and Zinc compared to 75/140 thinking the 20/50 must be very good in the trans compared to 75/140. And as you know, its not that simple...



On another topic, I asked Mobile about the ASTM D130 results and Group base for 75/140. The point about D130 results under load are interesting and something I have not read about:



"The ASTM D130 test results for this product are typically 1B, which is quite good. However, as these products are API GL-5 gear oils, there is a known detriment to using them with “yellow metal” components. The testing procedure does not directly mirror the effect the EP additives will have once the equipment is operating at full load.



The 75W-90 and 75W-140 are very similar products and have very similar base oil compositions aside from the viscosity being much higher on the 75W-140. As for the base oil composition/group of these products, I cannot disclose this information as it is proprietary to ExxonMobil."

Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5390914 04/01/20 12:22 PM
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Ive only been on this site a couple days and I already learned you are someone to listen to:)

I first should have thanked you for posting this oil analysis-especially was it’s the relatively newer Redline 75w110, which I ran in my 2000 Lexus LS400 rear differential(MolaKule-mentioned liking this viscosity and he is easily on the Mount Rushmore of bitog in terms sharing his knowledge and experience of oil formulation-and I think MolaKule has a special place in his heart for Drivetrain fluids.

I have enjoyed this site for many years and even though I don’t have a natural acumen for chemistry or mechanical concepts-I enjoy reading, trying to learn about them, and asking questions. Welcome to the board and thank you again for posting this oil analysis.


Insecurity with overcompensation are the root of evil deeds.
Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: spiderbypass] #5390941 04/01/20 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by spiderbypass
Ive only been on this site a couple days and I already learned you are someone to listen to:)

I first should have thanked you for posting this oil analysis-especially was it’s the relatively newer Redline 75w110, which I ran in my 2000 Lexus LS400 rear differential(MolaKule-mentioned liking this viscosity and he is easily on the Mount Rushmore of bitog in terms sharing his knowledge and experience of oil formulation-and I think MolaKule has a special place in his heart for Drivetrain fluids.

I have enjoyed this site for many years and even though I don’t have a natural acumen for chemistry or mechanical concepts-I enjoy reading, trying to learn about them, and asking questions. Welcome to the board and thank you again for posting this oil analysis.



Shannabe deserves all the credit. I am just "following" him and his efforts.

I have read several comments about Redline UOA's not being impressive. Do you have a different opinion or experience. I'm still tempted to go with the 75w/110. It just makes a lot of sense when considering all info and possibilities for HD 6 speed trans.

I found a Shockproof UOA a with two different tests and the 100cst were 37 and 32. I understand why riders say it quiets things down.

Re: Redline 75w/110 - UOA Included [Re: NorCalHD] #5391135 04/01/20 05:52 PM
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Shannabe deserves all the credit. I am just "following" him and his efforts.

I have read several comments about Redline UOA's not being impressive. Do you have a different opinion or experience. I'm still tempted to go with the 75w/110. It just makes a lot of sense when considering all info and possibilities for HD 6 speed trans.

I found a Shockproof UOA a with two different tests and the 100cst were 37 and 32. I understand why riders say it quiets things down

I am a bit out of my league when it comes to motorcycle recommendations-I thought about trying to ride when my brother got one about 7 years ago-we are competitive like that. I ended up reading about all different types of motorcycles and remembered the philosopher Dirty Harry who said-“a man has to know his limitations” am 49 now and think you need to start earlier to ride a motorcycle. I ran the redline 75w110 out for nearly thirty thousand miles-felt similar to the Amsoil 75w90 ran previously on the car-liked having the extra viscosity protection with good cold weather starts.

I am always looking to try new gear oil’s and currently am running this MPT Industries 75w90-was 17.50 a quart on Amazon.
They reportedly do not use viscosity modifiers and this is part of the safety data sheet I emailed the company to send me

rade Secret Additives Non-Hazardous 15-22% Polyalphaolefin 68649-12-7 25-50%
Polyester Polyol Proprietary 21-55%
Ditridecyl Adipate, Diester 16958-92-2 08-21%
Zinc dialkyldithiophosphate 68649-42-3 0.5-1.0%

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...ndustries-75w90-sds-gear-oil#Post5383530

Last edited by spiderbypass; 04/01/20 05:57 PM.

Insecurity with overcompensation are the root of evil deeds.
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