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1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 #5347057 02/11/20 10:39 AM
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Danimal1q2w3 Offline OP
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I picked up and old 78 tbird for 1300 bucks with 106k on the clock. Changed the oil immediately and slowly worked on it for about a year. Only time it was ran was to move it in and out of my garage or to revv it up to show friends. Also didn’t have an air filter on it at any point in a dirty garage. Finally have it in good road worthy condition (lots of electrical problems from water damage) Currently have about 1k on the oil and will post a follow up analysis when I receive it.

E66F8698-F842-4AB0-ACAF-B606F7B22FE5.jpeg
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5347086 02/11/20 11:28 AM
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madeej11 Offline
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To accumulate 138 miles it must have been moved in and out of your garage an awful lot. Obviously plenty of cold starts and besides running around without an air filter, what's your take on why the metals are so high? Could the wear numbers be that high just from the aforementioned?

Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5347104 02/11/20 11:55 AM
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caprice_2nv Offline
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When I worked at the Ford dealer my coworker who worked there back in these days said lots of these engines had cracked blocks from the factory, needing warranty replacement. Even the ones that didn't tended to wear out prematurely compared to other engines like the 351w or 351c that came before this one, 302 etc. They didn't have a very good reputation, so it's possible it's just worn out.

Hopefully that's not the case and it's just contamination from previous work or something. I'm looking forward to hearing the update.


84 Olds Cutlass - 350 Olds
83 Chevy Caprice - 305 Sbc
79 Honda CX500
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5347156 02/11/20 12:47 PM
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bullwinkle Offline
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This engine is from the era when thick oil with lots of ZDDP, moly, etc. was the norm-I think I would be running whatever Big 3 15W40 HDEO I could find cheap, start with fairly short OCIs of 1000 miles or so, and work it up to 3000 mile ones. Super Tech/Citgo at $9.99/gallon wouldn’t be bad either.


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Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: bullwinkle] #5347449 02/11/20 05:57 PM
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Danimal1q2w3 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by madeej11
To accumulate 138 miles it must have been moved in and out of your garage an awful lot. Obviously plenty of cold starts and besides running around without an air filter, what's your take on why the metals are so high? Could the wear numbers be that high just from the aforementioned?


Forgive me if I was unclear. I had all those short starts on the oil since September 2018 until January 2020 when I got it on the road. I then drove it for 138 miles. Couldn’t justify dumping the oil with no actual miles on it.
All of the miles on the road have been with the air filter on. Hoping metals trend down over a few short ocis. Running a fram ultra for the oci hopefully pulls lots of nastiness out


Originally Posted by bullwinkle
This engine is from the era when thick oil with lots of ZDDP, moly, etc. was the norm-I think I would be running whatever Big 3 15W40 HDEO I could find cheap, start with fairly short OCIs of 1000 miles or so, and work it up to 3000 mile ones. Super Tech/Citgo at $9.99/gallon wouldn’t be bad either.


Currently my fill is Castrol edge 0w40 and I forgot to mention that I used the rislone zddp additive in this UOA and in my current fill and plan to do so moving forward except maybe when I run some hdeo in the summer. It gets cold here and I don’t want to run a 15w anything right now. Had trouble starting it with the 10w40 when it was really cold

Last edited by Danimal1q2w3; 02/11/20 06:01 PM.
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5347500 02/11/20 06:47 PM
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johnnydc Offline
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Had one of these engines in my 1977 Thunderbird. Mild build. Fun to drive. Didn't take corners very well, but went in a straight line rather quick.


2012 Ford Fusion SEL V6
2009 Mercury Milan Premier V6
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 5/20 and Motorcraft Filters
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5348042 02/12/20 11:24 AM
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sunruh Offline
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the 6.6L is the 400M motor which is just a "bigger" version of the 5.8L 351M.
both are greatly detuned and smogged up version of the very nice 351C from '70-73 that was used in Mustangs


motorcycle oil myth buster
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: sunruh] #5348669 02/13/20 01:01 AM
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Danimal1q2w3 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by sunruh
the 6.6L is the 400M motor which is just a "bigger" version of the 5.8L 351M.
both are greatly detuned and smogged up version of the very nice 351C from '70-73 that was used in Mustangs


I’m putting a 4bbl carb on it and corresponding intake to wake it up a little but my end goal is to put another engine in here down the road but for the less than $1,000 this will cost, it will hold me over

Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: caprice_2nv] #5348697 02/13/20 04:50 AM
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Originally Posted by caprice_2nv
When I worked at the Ford dealer my coworker who worked there back in these days said lots of these engines had cracked blocks from the factory, needing warranty replacement. Even the ones that didn't tended to wear out prematurely compared to other engines like the 351w or 351c that came before this one, 302 etc. They didn't have a very good reputation, so it's possible it's just worn out.

Hopefully that's not the case and it's just contamination from previous work or something. I'm looking forward to hearing the update.

I had one (400) in a Torino, ran like a top for 150k+ miles and would have gone further if the frame didn't go. I never had an issue with that engine.

Last edited by Lubener; 02/13/20 04:50 AM.

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Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5349008 02/13/20 01:08 PM
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My grandfather had a 77 F150 with a 351M in it. He bought it when it was only a couple of years old. That engine was worn out junk by 79,000 miles. Rocker arms just a thrashing, and everything else worn out. Truck wasn't ran hard either and he was good about oil changes. Probably the worst engine he ever had I'd have to say. Even up until just before he passed I'd occasionally hear him call it a piece of crap, 25+ years after getting rid of it!

Therefore I'm not really surprised with this UOA.


1986 F250. 4x2 351w Edelbrock heads, xe250h cam and the works. 245k miles
1999 Mercury Grand Marquis gs 4.6. 3.27 LSD, JMOD 120k miles
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5349060 02/13/20 02:45 PM
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supton Offline
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I wonder if the metals are from the PO not changing often enough? There is a fair amount of oil left in the engine after draining, and I wonder if a few short OCI's would get the wear metals down.


2011 Toyota Camry, base, 2.5L/6MT, 201k, hers
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1999 Toyota Camry LE, 2.2L/4AT, 223k, his
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: supton] #5349066 02/13/20 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by supton
I wonder if the metals are from the PO not changing often enough? There is a fair amount of oil left in the engine after draining, and I wonder if a few short OCI's would get the wear metals down.


It could be from infrequent changes that have resulted in deposits (like sludge, varnish) that are chalk full of wear material from previous OCI's that are now being dissolved. This will definitely drive up what's observed via a UOA.


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2020 Grand Cherokee SRT - Ravenol SSL 0w-40, FRAM Ultra
Re: 1978 Ford Thunderbird 6.6L 351m 138 mi oci QSUD 10w40 [Re: Danimal1q2w3] #5349829 02/14/20 10:40 AM
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sunruh Offline
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Originally Posted by Danimal1q2w3
Originally Posted by sunruh
the 6.6L is the 400M motor which is just a "bigger" version of the 5.8L 351M.
both are greatly detuned and smogged up version of the very nice 351C from '70-73 that was used in Mustangs


I’m putting a 4bbl carb on it and corresponding intake to wake it up a little but my end goal is to put another engine in here down the road but for the less than $1,000 this will cost, it will hold me over


how exactly does a 4bbl do anything to wake up the motor?

what cfm? vacum or mechanical 2nds?
what intake manifold?
still the snorning/boring stock cam?
anything to the rockers?
still a points n condenser ignition?

what tranny? fmx? c4? c6?
what gears in back?

1971 "R" code owner


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