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New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? #5334587 01/28/20 10:59 AM
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jayjr1105 Offline OP
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A boost of Moly in the 0w20? If I remember correctly, the most current sample from pqia.org (5w-20) showed very low moly content... http://pqiadata.org/Chevron_Havoline_ProDS_5W20_3292018.html

https://pqia.org/havoline-prods-sae-0w-20-motor-oil/

This particular bottle does not carry the SN plus logo either. Hrmmm.

Also, no NOACK testing anymore from PQIA?

Last edited by jayjr1105; 01/28/20 11:04 AM.

2013 Mazda 3 - PP 0w20
2005 Honda Odyssey - PP HM 5w20
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5334597 01/28/20 11:19 AM
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JustN89 Online Content
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I wouldn't necessarily think so, at least for the 5W-20. It seems to me that moly is more common in 0W oils than in 5W or above. I couldn't tell you why, other than a guess, but that seems to be a trend that I've noticed. The Havoline could be the same. It would be cool to see what is in the 5W too, just for an apples-to-apples comparison.

Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5334611 01/28/20 11:35 AM
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PimTac Offline
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Check out the antimony.


2017 Mazda CX5
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Roki OEM filter.
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5334615 01/28/20 11:39 AM
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RDY4WAR Offline
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That's an interesting VOA. I'm guessing it's dinuclear MoDTC.


"He who is without oil, shall throw the first rod." - Compressions 9:1
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5334762 01/28/20 03:03 PM
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volk06 Offline
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A lot of 0w-20 formulations differ from the 5w-20/5w30 variants and have a higher level of moly. Its a common theme with many brands.

Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5334988 01/28/20 09:07 PM
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painfx Offline
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That is some nice specs. Too bad no Noack specs. Looks similar, not exactly, like Rotella Gas Truck 0w20.

Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: JustN89] #5335070 01/28/20 11:35 PM
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Mad_Hatter Offline
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Originally Posted by JustN89
I wouldn't necessarily think so, at least for the 5W-20. It seems to me that moly is more common in 0W oils than in 5W or above. I couldn't tell you why, other than a guess, but that seems to be a trend that I've noticed. The Havoline could be the same. It would be cool to see what is in the 5W too, just for an apples-to-apples comparison.

There are plenty of 5w lubes out there with +100ppm moly. In fact, Chevron's own Havoline SB 5w30 HiMi has +170ppm moly. Pennzoil has some 5w's that have well over 200ppm moly and QS has 5w's approaching 200ppm.

Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: painfx] #5335127 01/29/20 05:05 AM
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PimTac Offline
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Originally Posted by painfx
That is some nice specs. Too bad no Noack specs. Looks similar, not exactly, like Rotella Gas Truck 0w20.




There was some discussion here a while back about the volatility of Noack testing. As long as it’s below the limit for the spec allowed then it’s good.


2017 Mazda CX5
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Roki OEM filter.
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: PimTac] #5335406 01/29/20 11:47 AM
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jayjr1105 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by PimTac
Originally Posted by painfx
That is some nice specs. Too bad no Noack specs. Looks similar, not exactly, like Rotella Gas Truck 0w20.




There was some discussion here a while back about the volatility of Noack testing. As long as it’s below the limit for the spec allowed then it’s good.


Agreed, with all the specs on oil, I really don't worry about noack too much as long as it's within recommended range.


2013 Mazda 3 - PP 0w20
2005 Honda Odyssey - PP HM 5w20
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: PimTac] #5335619 01/29/20 03:41 PM
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painfx Offline
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Originally Posted by PimTac
Originally Posted by painfx
That is some nice specs. Too bad no Noack specs. Looks similar, not exactly, like Rotella Gas Truck 0w20.




There was some discussion here a while back about the volatility of Noack testing. As long as it’s below the limit for the spec allowed then it’s good.



Can you help me share that thread?

My preference has been low Noack and low SAPS.

Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: painfx] #5335711 01/29/20 05:23 PM
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PimTac Offline
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It was brought up in a couple of threads, there was no specific thread regarding that.

As I recall, multiple testing on the same oil would yield varying numbers. One example presented was Pennzoil Ultra which had a super low Noack until another test was done and the number changed quite a bit.

One of the experts here might be able to shed more light on the subject.


2017 Mazda CX5
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Roki OEM filter.
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5335715 01/29/20 05:30 PM
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PimTac Offline
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Just for reference, the PDS off the Chevron website lists the Noack for 0w20 as 12.1.

https://cglapps.chevron.com/sdspds/PDSDetailPage.aspx?docDataId=518483&docFormat=PDF


2017 Mazda CX5
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Roki OEM filter.
Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5335735 01/29/20 06:12 PM
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painfx Offline
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Good find on the link.

Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: jayjr1105] #5335831 01/29/20 07:25 PM
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IndyFan Offline
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I have heard that Noack is not as precise as we assume it is. Not sure that's true, but IIRC, I heard it from a rep from an oil company, either Exxon Mobil, Pennzoil, or Valvoline. I can't remember which, though, as I've often contacted them to ask various questions. Even if true, it could still be useful data. Maybe the published Noack is typically an average?


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Re: New Havoline ProDS 0w20 boosted Moly? [Re: PimTac] #5335940 01/29/20 08:53 PM
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Mad_Hatter Offline
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Originally Posted by PimTac
Originally Posted by painfx
That is some nice specs. Too bad no Noack specs. Looks similar, not exactly, like Rotella Gas Truck 0w20.

There was some discussion here a while back about the volatility of Noack testing. As long as it’s below the limit for the spec allowed then it’s good.

Correct. The current API threshold of 15% for volatility wasn't pulled out of thin air. There is an argument to be had that lower volatility is even better from a performance perspective but from the point of setting a standard threshold (-the API), you get into the question of where do we stop? How low do we go? Do the benefits outweigh the costs?.. and so on and so on.

Fortunately, at the end of the day it's your pocketbook..if you perceive value in chasing the lowest noack lube despite the added cost and no guarantees of longer engine life, then have at it. More power to ya'...

Last edited by Mad_Hatter; 01/29/20 08:54 PM.
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