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Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? #5313814 01/05/20 10:30 AM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,480
B
Burt Offline OP
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Posts: 1,480
I have owned four fords in the last 40 years and all have developed either intake or head gasket leaks.

1981 Capri 2.3 L
1987 Taurus 3.0 Vulcan
1998 Windstar 3.8 L (intake manifold leak)
2015 Fiesta 1.0 L (TBD)

I know that some of this is due to dissimilar metals in block and head, but after making engines for 100 years, you'd think they would've perfected the design and manufacturing process. Most of these, a mechanic can make a long lasting permanent repair. And some manufacturers don't seem to have this problem.

Why is that many American manufacturers don't bother to get something like this right, when they know it is key to brand loyality? How much more can it cost to do it right?


2011 RX350 63k miles
2015 Fiesta SFE eco-boost 34k miles
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313837 01/05/20 11:11 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 3,911
Propflux01 Offline
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Posts: 3,911
Economics. Gasket lasts a few years. Person takes it in to dealer. Dealer makes money. Person chalks it up to bad luck. Mechanic fixes it permanently. Never leaks again. Flag waiver still waves his FORD flag. Trades for a newer model.Rinse, Repeat.


2014 Hyundai Elantra
2014 Hyundai Elantra GT
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313838 01/05/20 11:12 AM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 1,714
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E150GT Offline
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Posts: 1,714
I don't know but I've owned 3 Fords and no leaks.

1990 Econoline 225k miles when I sold it
1995 f150. 252k miles and counting
Both have 4.9L

1988 crown Victoria. 5.0 good car. Should have kept it.

Nothing lasts forever though. Except herpes


Last edited by E150GT; 01/05/20 11:14 AM.

1984 Mercedes-Benz 300SD - 100k
1995 F150 XL 4.9 reg cab 5MT - 251k 5w30
2016 Mazda6 Touring 6MT - 68k 5w30
2006 Buick Lucerne CXL 3.8 40k 5w30
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313844 01/05/20 11:21 AM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,597
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Imp4 Online Content
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,597
Who would believe that the 4 Toyotas I've owned have never leaked coolant. Two of them are 250k+ and still in use.
Oh, also an 18 year old Mitsubishi. Also still in circulation. It's never leaked either. And that thing has been beat to death. Another year or two and the rust demon will finally consume it.

Maybe I'm just lucky...

Last edited by Imp4; 01/05/20 11:23 AM.

2001 Mitsubishi Galant 2.4 - 165k+
Grandma's creampuff...
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313870 01/05/20 12:05 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 422
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Neely97 Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 422
Yet, you keep buying Fords.

Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313878 01/05/20 12:12 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 224
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thastinger Offline
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Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 224
I've never had a head gasket issue

88 ranger 2.3
98 f150 5.4
99 lightning
04 escape 3.0
13 gt500

Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313882 01/05/20 12:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,214
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Dave9 Offline
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,214
I haven't had my Ford leak but have had a few GM's with intake leaks.

Why can't certain brands make auto trannys that last as long as the vehicle? Something is always the weakest link.

Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313888 01/05/20 12:28 PM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,737
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tenderloin Offline
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T
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,737
Never had a leak in 17 Ford cars, vans and SUV/s Many with over 200,000 miles A few over 300,000 miles

Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313914 01/05/20 01:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 393
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nobb Offline
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Had the timing cover leak on a Ford Ranger with the 3.0 Vulcan same as yours. Only 150,000 kms and have only been using OE Motorcraft coolant. Maybe the reason is because there's hardly any material in the gasket design on the coolant side. Apparently this is a really common problem on these engines.

Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Imp4] #5313938 01/05/20 02:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 9,700
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01rangerxl Offline
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Posts: 9,700
Originally Posted by Imp4
Who would believe that the 4 Toyotas I've owned have never leaked coolant. Two of them are 250k+ and still in use.
Oh, also an 18 year old Mitsubishi. Also still in circulation. It's never leaked either. And that thing has been beat to death. Another year or two and the rust demon will finally consume it.

Maybe I'm just lucky...


Plenty of Toyotas have leaked coolant, so if you owned them a long time, I would call that luck, not just Toyota magic. The 3.0 in the 4Runner and Pickup comes to mind. It's not uncommon for 4.7s to leak from the water pump before the timing belt is due as well. And the Prius head gasket issues have been described in detail on BITOG.

Ford does their share of corner cutting, but coolant leaks are a fact of life on liquid cooled engines. Nobody has perfected it. I've dealt with coolant leaks on my Fords, all fixed in my driveway except for the water pump on my 3.0, which happened at almost 200k. I can live with a water pump, tstat, and heater hoses in 200k.


2002 Ford Ranger XLT | 3.0 V6 Auto 2WD | 236K miles
1994 Ford Ranger STX | 4.0 V6 Manual 4X4 | 202K miles
1994 Ford Explorer XLT | 4.0 V6 Auto 4X4 | 254K miles
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313950 01/05/20 02:24 PM
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,231
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joegreen Offline
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I have a Ford ranger with the 3.0 Vulcan. It has close to 200k and doesn't use any coolant.


1978 Chevrolet k20
Engine: Delo 10w30xle
Transmission: Castrol transmax dex/merc

1984 Mercedes-Benz 300 turbo diesel
Engine: Delo 400 15w40le
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: 01rangerxl] #5313951 01/05/20 02:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 393
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nobb Offline
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Originally Posted by 01rangerxl

Plenty of Toyotas have leaked coolant, so if you owned them a long time, I would call that luck, not just Toyota magic. The 3.0 in the 4Runner and Pickup comes to mind. It's not uncommon for 4.7s to leak from the water pump before the timing belt is due as well. And the Prius head gasket issues have been described in detail on BITOG.


Water pumps by the nature of their design, leak coolant in the shaft seal but at such a low rate that it's negligible. That's why there's a weep hole. Ideally if they could last 300k that would be great, but it's not unreasonable to say that water pumps are a regular service item every 200k. It is a moving part after all. But what's unreasonable is to have leaks from the various gaskets. There's a whole whack of theory behind gasket materials, design, and such...I would've thought manufacturers could have that perfected by now. But then again, I don't think most vehicle are designed with a 30 year service life like the Land Cruiser so OEMs may just do the minimum required sizing and selection of these parts to meet their design service life requirements and call it a day.

Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313956 01/05/20 02:41 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
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Nick1994 Offline
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Maybe don’t buy junk cars in the first place?


2015 Hyundai Genesis 5.0L 57k Mobil 1 5w30 & Wix
2000 Toyota Camry 2.2L 236k Mobil Super HM 10w40 & Fram Ultra
1996 Jeep Cherokee 4.0L 150k Mobil 1 HM 10w40 & Fram Ultra
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313978 01/05/20 03:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 3,581
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Lubener Offline
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Originally Posted by Burt
I have owned four fords in the last 40 years and all have developed either intake or head gasket leaks.

1981 Capri 2.3 L
1987 Taurus 3.0 Vulcan
1998 Windstar 3.8 L (intake manifold leak)
2015 Fiesta 1.0 L (TBD)

I know that some of this is due to dissimilar metals in block and head, but after making engines for 100 years, you'd think they would've perfected the design and manufacturing process. Most of these, a mechanic can make a long lasting permanent repair. And some manufacturers don't seem to have this problem.

Why is that many American manufacturers don't bother to get something like this right, when they know it is key to brand loyality? How much more can it
cost to do it right?

Weak gaskets that aren't up to sealing both aluminum and iron. Plastic manifolds do not belong on an engine.Go look at GM's 3.8 and see how their engineers screwed up a real good engine with their faulty manifolds and gaskets..


The "thinking" man's friend.
Re: Why can't they make an engine that will hold water? [Re: Burt] #5313982 01/05/20 03:36 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,060
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dareo Offline
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Gaskets and seals are going to leak eventually, and are designed to be replaceable. What is the alternative? Assemble entire engine with JB Weld?


2018 Regal TourX, 2016 Golf Wagon 5MT, 2016 GMC 1500 SLT 6.2
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