Now this is a good job.....

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They usually are good jobs, with some challenges but certainly a unique experience. A couple friends went the ex-pat pilot route, including one in Russia. As for the aircraft, given that Airbus is capacity constrained and with aircraft lead times, this will be a difficult year for the global industry.
 
Friend of mine retired after 30 yrs with Delta. He was lured to India to fly the 757. His route was to London then to NY. He was supposed to go hoe (Utah) every other month for a month but that didn't happen. He flew for Air India and there wasn't a computer in their HQ. everything was done by hand in pencil on paper. I'm sure he made a lot of money but he never got home like they said he could. Don't think he lasted over a year.
 
Assuming you have the aptitude, many don't, with a modest investment of, say, $200,000 in certificate training and type ratings and then about 20 years of experience, you, too, could command that kind of pay.

Only to have it dry up in a year because of the 737 Max problem, which is the point of the article...those jobs went away because the airplane isn't being flown. Did you read the article? The actual, complete headline: $300,000 Pilot Jobs Drying Up in China With Boeing Grounding.

So, you want a job that pays that? And then stops after a year?

Would a year of that pay level make up for the decades of effort to get there?



This is like hearing people complain about what doctors are paid...well, gee, sport, just get straight As in college, while you take biology, organic chemistry, physics, calculus, and make it a good college by the way. You should also volunteer, rock the MCAT, then you can hope to get accepted to medical school (it's about a 5% admissions rate, but you can handle that level of competition, right?). Next, spend $300,000 on 4 years of medical school, then 5 - 7 years in residency, and you, too, can be a doctor....and get paid a doctor's pay.

You just have to get started...
 
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Originally Posted by Astro14
Assuming you have the aptitude, many don't, with a modest investment of, say, $200,000 in certificate training and type ratings and then about 20 years of experience, you, too, could command that kind of pay.

Only to have it dry up in a year because of the 737 Max problem, which is the point of the article...those jobs went away because the airplane isn't being flown. Did you read the article? The actual, complete headline: $300,000 Pilot Jobs Drying Up in China With Boeing Grounding.

So, you want a job that pays that? And then stops after a year?

Would a year of that pay level make up for the decades of effort to get there?



This is like hearing people complain about what doctors are paid...well, gee, sport, just get straight As in college, while you take biology, organic chemistry, physics, calculus, and make it a good college by the way. You should also volunteer, rock the MCAT, then you can hope to get accepted to medical school (it's about a 5% admissions rate, but you can handle that level of competition, right?). Next, spend $300,000 on 4 years of medical school, then 5 - 7 years in residency, and you, too, can be a doctor....and get paid a doctor's pay.

You just have to get started...


I had a long reply typed out, but I think I'll just say:

+1
 
Nice post Astro. Best Reply of the Day.
thumbsup2.gif
 
Originally Posted by Astro14
Assuming you have the aptitude, many don't, with a modest investment of, say, $200,000 in certificate training and type ratings and then about 20 years of experience, you, too, could command that kind of pay.

Only to have it dry up in a year because of the 737 Max problem, which is the point of the article...those jobs went away because the airplane isn't being flown. Did you read the article? The actual, complete headline: $300,000 Pilot Jobs Drying Up in China With Boeing Grounding.

So, you want a job that pays that? And then stops after a year?

Would a year of that pay level make up for the decades of effort to get there?



This is like hearing people complain about what doctors are paid...well, gee, sport, just get straight As in college, while you take biology, organic chemistry, physics, calculus, and make it a good college by the way. You should also volunteer, rock the MCAT, then you can hope to get accepted to medical school (it's about a 5% admissions rate, but you can handle that level of competition, right?). Next, spend $300,000 on 4 years of medical school, then 5 - 7 years in residency, and you, too, can be a doctor....and get paid a doctor's pay.

You just have to get started...


Amen brother.
 
Originally Posted by Mr Nice
$200,000 ?

I didn't know it was that expensive to become a commercial pilot.



I was going to say, "don't get me started"...but you've got me started, so...

It's about $200,000 to get your flight training up to an ATP. Can be more. Assuming that you are able to get through the program.

Then, you, too can become a regional airline first officer, a job that, until recently, paid $24,000/year while working 12+ hour days, getting no more than a few hours' sleep each night....

Oh the luxury! The glamour!

And if you work part-time at Starbucks on every one of your days off (which aren't many) you can double your income. I'm completely serious. Google the investigation into Colgan 3407. At the time of the crash, the FO had been awake for over 24 hours, after working at Starbucks and then commuting from Seattle to New York. She lived with her parents in Seattle, and worked at Starbucks, because her airline job didn't pay enough to cover her student loans. The public was shocked, shocked!, that pilots made so little and worked such long hours.


Why do you think there is a pilot shortage now?


Because for a decade, that's how airlines paid. Borrow $200K, then, if you're lucky, get a job that won't even pay your student loans, much less living expenses...

Things have changed, and there is a global demand for pilots right now, so pilots with experience are able to command decent salaries.

But you have to have the experience first.

And that costs both time and money. Lots and lots of time and money...


If the salary in the article, $300K is attractive to you, then, please, be my guest, and go get some flight training, build your hours, see if you can get a job flying airliners, build your time in them, and then see how you do working for one of those airlines.

I get hit up by recruiters on LinkedIn weekly asking if I want to work for one of those airlines.

Not a chance....

Horrible working conditions, years away from home, micromanagement, no ability to question the hierarchy of management on safety issues. Pilots that know only how to follow procedure, but don't actually know how an airplane flies. Those airlines have to up the salaries to a very high level to get any pilots at all. I've flown with quite a few pilots who once flew for Middle Eastern and Chinese airlines and every single one of them hated it.

One need only look at Asiana 214, in which a perfectly functioning 777 crashed on a sunny day, to see what's wrong with the cultures and managements at some airlines. Salary simply cannot make up for that.
 
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Originally Posted by Mr Nice
$200,000 ?

I didn't know it was that expensive to become a commercial pilot.


Yep, I was lucky and did it in just over 100k. 100k in student loans and get a job paying little more than a school bus driver. It was a great 6 years of my life after school.
 
I got my PPL and was about to go to college at a good school for Aviation and then saw how much debt I'd be in. I decided to get a degree in Accounting instead
I still dream though...
 
Originally Posted by Aero540T
I got my PPL and was about to go to college at a good school for Aviation and then saw how much debt I'd be in. I decided to get a degree in Accounting instead
I still dream though...


Same here, started down the ATP path but stuck w/ accounting for the excitement. The upside is the business degree (and a whole lot of work) allowed me to get my own bird, and, one time, being the only finance exec who kind of knew something about aviation, I got to help build a flight department from the beginning. Flew down to Savannah to sign a $40M GIV order...

Live your dream, life is short!


I hadn't read the entire article, but none of the folks I knew made that kind of $ at that stage of their careers. Their experiences were more like the India one mentioned previously.
 
Originally Posted by wings&wheels
Originally Posted by Aero540T
I got my PPL and was about to go to college at a good school for Aviation and then saw how much debt I'd be in. I decided to get a degree in Accounting instead
I still dream though...


Same here, started down the ATP path but stuck w/ accounting for the excitement. The upside is the business degree (and a whole lot of work) allowed me to get my own bird, and, one time, being the only finance exec who kind of knew something about aviation, I got to help build a flight department from the beginning. Flew down to Savannah to sign a $40M GIV order...

Live your dream, life is short!


I hadn't read the entire article, but none of the folks I knew made that kind of $ at that stage of their careers. Their experiences were more like the India one mentioned previously.


Thanks! I definitely agree the business degree could open some doors
 
Originally Posted by SEMI_287
Originally Posted by Mr Nice
$200,000 ?

I didn't know it was that expensive to become a commercial pilot.


Yep, I was lucky and did it in just over 100k. 100k in student loans and get a job paying little more than a school bus driver. It was a great 6 years of my life after school.

I know pilots start at the regionals for peanuts out of school after having the necessary hours and ratings.
Any career field you have to start off at the bottom and pay your dues, nothing comes easy.... especially the big $$$ pay.


Astro,
Not surprised the pilot was working at Starbucks and also a regional pilot in a turboprop. PBS Frontline did a show on the Colgan crash.
 
$300k to sit in plane for hours and be away from home no thanks. A make a decent fraction of that working from home in IT field 35hrs/week.

I can barely sit in my chair , cannot imagine locked and trapped in a tiny area.
 
Originally Posted by madRiver
$300k to sit in plane for hours and be away from home no thanks. A make a decent fraction of that working from home in IT field 35hrs/week.

I can barely sit in my chair , cannot imagine locked and trapped in a tiny area.



For most people, the true love of flying is a bug, you either have it or don't.

Oh, but it can get very exciting. Yeah, the schedule can be challenging, but this is the view from your office (bigger planes though):
[Linked Image]
 
That is great you enjoy it.

The 5 pilots I know seem to enjoy the job. The local ones (AF tanker wing and Southwest) seem to have a better work/life balance. The others(united, delta x2) seem to do trains, planes, buses and automobiles to actually sit in cockpit but I guess life choice where you reside.
 
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