Recent Topics
m1 TDT vs Rotella t6?
by Stickygreen - 12/05/19 11:09 PM
Not to beat a dead horse but...
by MoPowa - 12/05/19 10:22 PM
Mitsubishi J4 CVT Fluid-Valvoline CVT Fluid
by FloridaTime - 12/05/19 09:55 PM
3 HP on a 15 Amp 120 v circuit
by Snagglefoot - 12/05/19 09:53 PM
SRT part 3 - 2020 Grand Cherokee SRT
by OVERKILL - 12/05/19 09:14 PM
My first new vehicle - first oil change
by Kurtatron - 12/05/19 09:02 PM
My wife made peanut butter fudge today(PIC)
by tig1 - 12/05/19 08:34 PM
07 Saturn Ion 2.0 L clutch replacement
by Nitronoise - 12/05/19 07:23 PM
Do You Prefer A 2 Cycle Or 4 Cycle Engine
by Warstud - 12/05/19 06:45 PM
Help with gift idea - Vacuum Sealer
by 92saturnsl2 - 12/05/19 05:49 PM
More news on the Ford Transmission Issues
by domer10 - 12/05/19 05:48 PM
Drain plug with nut welder to it. PIC
by tig1 - 12/05/19 05:29 PM
5 in 1 Rental Review
by panthermike - 12/05/19 05:25 PM
Engagement Ring Photos
by The Critic - 12/05/19 04:55 PM
Black Friday Oculus Go review
by PandaBear - 12/05/19 04:41 PM
Goodyear Wrangler buy-and a chuckle
by Lapham3 - 12/05/19 04:02 PM
2015 Mazda 3 2.0 - Intake Valve Pics
by buster - 12/05/19 03:54 PM
Timemaster had to get fixed...
by dareo - 12/05/19 03:44 PM
Newest Members
msf1344, Tank99, Ronparise, DrPcFix, benny88
70043 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
58 registered members (bbhero, Aero540T, BlakeB, ArrestMeRedZ, apollo18, 14Accent, 3 invisible), 1,562 guests, and 48 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums67
Topics298,352
Posts5,133,562
Members70,043
Most Online3,589
Nov 2nd, 2019
Donate to BITOG
Print Thread
Hop To
MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 #5284404 12/03/19 07:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 27
K
KevD47 Offline OP
OP Offline
K
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 27
First UOA post on BITOG; long time forum observer

Pretty boring run, but Blackstone marked the oil as a 5W30, while my dealership receipt called out “Bulk 5W40, 229.5 spec.” a year and almost 10,000 miles ago. I thought they told me they use Mobil 1, Blackstone noted afterward in email that their experience with that grade from M1 has a lot more magnesium among other things, but it does look a lot like M1 5W30. Anyway, I’m not sweating the details as the UOA looks to be great for this engine type. I did my own oil change this time and poured in M1 0W40 FS and a MANN cartridge filter for a 10k run.

39D38221-973D-487C-A160-E26DFBCE5588.png

2019 Acura RDX - M1 AFE 0W20
2013 MB ML350 - M1 5W40
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5284431 12/03/19 08:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 176
G
GON Offline
Offline
G
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 176
Kev,

Thanks for posting this (as a MB driver). Good stuff, especially as MB is recommending on many of its vehicles to use 5w40 instead of 0w40. I know the analysis came back 5w30 for you.

Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: GON] #5284448 12/03/19 08:51 PM
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 18
F
Fotoflame Offline
Offline
F
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 18
Originally Posted by GON
Kev,

Thanks for posting this (as a MB driver). Good stuff, especially as MB is recommending on many of its vehicles to use 5w40 instead of 0w40. I know the analysis came back 5w30 for you.


Where did you see that 5w40 is recommended over 0w40 by MB? They are both on 229.5.

Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5284460 12/03/19 09:12 PM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 628
D
Doublehaul Online Crying
Online Crying
D
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 628
Why would anyone want a 5w40 over a 0w40? Recent M1 and Castrol at least are pretty shear stable

Honest question

Last edited by Doublehaul; 12/03/19 09:22 PM.

2019 Toyota 4Runner 4x4 TRD
2019 Toyota Tacoma 4x4 TRD*

Mobil 1 0w40


The specs on the back are more important than the label on the front
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5284590 12/04/19 03:48 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 2,866
M
Mad_Hatter Offline
Offline
M
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 2,866
Bottom end of a sae40 is 12.5, so this looks like a Xw30 @10.74cSt.. unless you had a good amount of shearing, which there's no reason to believe that occurred. I'd be inclined to think that the shop got it wrong on your invoice.

Last edited by Mad_Hatter; 12/04/19 03:49 AM.
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: Doublehaul] #5284592 12/04/19 03:52 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 2,866
M
Mad_Hatter Offline
Offline
M
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 2,866
Originally Posted by Doublehaul
Why would anyone want a 5w40 over a 0w40? Recent M1 and Castrol at least are pretty shear stable

Honest question

Because they can.

Not everyone overthinks oil like you or I do and some consumers might get "freaked out" seeing a 0w on their dealership invoice. ("it's too thin")

Last edited by Mad_Hatter; 12/04/19 03:54 AM.
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: Doublehaul] #5284600 12/04/19 04:30 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 11,496
W
wemay Offline
Offline
W
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 11,496
Originally Posted by Doublehaul
Why would anyone want a 5w40 over a 0w40? Recent M1 and Castrol at least are pretty shear stable

Honest question


Because the world outside us crazies cares little about oil. crzy


2018 KIA Sportage LX AWD
Shell RGT 5W20, STP S2808

2013 Hyundai Santa Fe Sport 2.0T
M1AP 5W30, M1-104
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5284897 12/04/19 12:07 PM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 99
D
DrDanger Offline
Offline
D
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 99
Actual reason not to use the OW when you dont need it. At -15-25C there is no reason to.
Thinnest oil stocks and/or more viscosity improvers. More prone to shearing / drifting out of spec. More prone to deposits and sludge.
0W is exempt from some cleanliness test per Ford specs, not sure if industry specs, resulting in less clean piston tests.

Last edited by DrDanger; 12/04/19 12:14 PM.
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: DrDanger] #5284919 12/04/19 12:34 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,862
K
kschachn Offline
Offline
K
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,862
On the other hand there’s no “0W” exemption for Mercedes Benz approval 229.5, so for the purposes of this thread that’s irrelevant. Regardless of the winter rating the grades all have to meet the same stringent deposit requirements.

And all VII are not the same so a blanket statement that a wider viscosity spread is always less preferable is not correct, nor does it take into account the natural VI of the base stocks used in a particular oil.

Your comments above sound like a cut-and-paste from internet articles rather than a consideration of the approval and oil discussed in this thread.


1994 BMW 530i, 251K
1996 Honda Accord, 280K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 428K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 284K
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5285190 12/04/19 05:23 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 7,303
K
KCJeep Offline
Offline
K
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 7,303
Does not look like a 5w40 to me. KV @ 40 and at 100 are both too low, even for used oil. Certainly didn't cause any detectable issues though.


2018 VW Passat GT VR6 - 19k - Castrol Pro OE 5w40 - VW OEM filter
2012 KIA Sedona 104k - Valvoline Maxlife 5w30
2012 VW Tiguan 104k - Castrol 0w40
2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee, gone but not forgotten.
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: kschachn] #5285215 12/04/19 05:55 PM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 99
D
DrDanger Offline
Offline
D
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 99
Originally Posted by kschachn
On the other hand there’s no “0W” exemption for Mercedes Benz approval 229.5, so for the purposes of this thread that’s irrelevant. Regardless of the winter rating the grades all have to meet the same stringent deposit requirements.

And all VII are not the same so a blanket statement that a wider viscosity spread is always less preferable is not correct, nor does it take into account the natural VI of the base stocks used in a particular oil.

Your comments above sound like a cut-and-paste from internet articles rather than a consideration of the approval and oil discussed in this thread.


Maybe you could post the 2019 or 2020 MB 229.5 spec so we can take a look? That is hard to get. So, we are left with more or less educated guesses. Same with the great majority of oils - down to formulations and basestocks.
My comment is an attempt to tackle the issue at hand, yours sounds a bit like nitpicking.

Last edited by DrDanger; 12/04/19 05:55 PM.
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: DrDanger] #5285221 12/04/19 06:02 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,862
K
kschachn Offline
Offline
K
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,862
Originally Posted by DrDanger
Maybe you could post the 2019 or 2020 MB 229.5 spec so we can take a look? That is hard to get. So, we are left with more or less educated guesses. Same with the great majority of oils - down to formulations and basestocks.
My comment is an attempt to tackle the issue at hand, yours sounds a bit like nitpicking.

The Afton Specification Handbook is a good place to look:

https://www.aftonchemical.com/Afton/media/PdfFiles/Afton-Chemical-Spec-Handbook-September-2019.pdf

That's the 2019 edition, it should be as current as possible. Base stocks can be inferred to some extent from an SDS for the oil, or perhaps pour point.

Just wondering, what is your doctorate in?


1994 BMW 530i, 251K
1996 Honda Accord, 280K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 428K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 284K
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5285304 12/04/19 07:30 PM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 27
K
KevD47 Offline OP
OP Offline
K
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 27
Just looking at the more recent MB specs in their gas engine manuals: 229.51, 229.52, and 229.61, they are mostly 5W30 on the MB Bevo site. I’m wondering if my dealership has standardized on that grade as it also meets the 229.5 spec my 2013 vehicle manual prescribes. If I owned a dealership, I’d obviously want the least number of oil grades and types as possible. I agree with Blackstone’s analysis that it’s a 30 grade oil from the test, but I feel my invoice was misleading.

B31E2B34-654F-4AB9-8306-F160BEC621A1.jpeg

2019 Acura RDX - M1 AFE 0W20
2013 MB ML350 - M1 5W40
Re: MB 229.5 Bulk 5W40, 9,616 mi., 2013 ML350 [Re: KevD47] #5286235 12/05/19 05:10 PM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 99
D
DrDanger Offline
Offline
D
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 99
Hate to admit it but kschachn has a point. We need to compare apples to apples and stay away from blanket statements ( this is a note to self smile ).
A Ford spec is not a MB spec.

Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

BOB IS THE OIL GUY® Powered by UBB.threads™