Fuel Diluted Ecoboost: HDEO 5W30 vs PCMO 0W40

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted by Navi
If 12 is the topline for 30 weight then at 12.9 0w40 is just a little higher. So when it gets diluted it s diluted back down into 30 territory for which the engine is designed. Probably will get under 12 within a 1000 miles or less.

So your vehicle will beat that oil to a 30 grade within a thousand miles or less? Wow, not good. I'd shorten the OCI to 4,000 or 5,000 miles max.

 

[Navi]

This is Jbutchs UOA found in another thread for Rotella T6 5W30 Multivehicle. He has a turbo Subaru which dilutes like Ecoboost.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted by Jimmy_Russells
Originally Posted by dave1251
Originally Posted by Bryanccfshr
What year is this ecoboost? Has it 2018 or newer? The reason I ask is Ford added port injection and the intake valve deposits will not be an issue.



I know of a fleet hundred plus F150's with most of the 3.5 Ecoboosts pre 2018. The majority of the vehicles have close to 18000 hours of operation without an engine failure with the cheapest bulk API SN oil 5W30 threads like this can be hilarious.


Uhh

There are not even 8800 hours in a year. So if a 2015 vehicle is now four years old it would have to run for more than 50% of the time, period. Holidays, weekends, everything. If that same vehicle only averaged 20 miles per hour it would have 360,000 miles on it. I'm a bit skeptical of your numbers

It's not hard to figure each vehicle is ran more than 20 hours a day 7 days a week and about 38% are pre 2015 and the average speed of the engine 5-8MPH. I'm not an engineer but given this data I believe around the 90-95K mile mark you are approaching 18000 hours of operation.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted by Navi
This is Jbutchs UOA found in another thread for Rotella T6 5W30 Multivehicle. He has a turbo Subaru which dilutes like Ecoboost.

And it meets DEXOS specs thus it is tested to prevent timing chain stretching. You may end up making a lube selection on a oil which may or may not prevent timing chain stretching.

 

[PimTac]

Comparing a Subaru engine to a Ecoboost is pretty weak. As you may or may not have noticed, the wear metal numbers are excellent.

We have seen this time and time again where fuel dilution has been severe yet there was no wear evident.

 

[jbutch]

Originally Posted by PimTac
Comparing a Subaru engine to a Ecoboost is pretty weak. As you may or may not have noticed, the wear metal numbers are excellent.

We have seen this time and time again where fuel dilution has been severe yet there was no wear evident.



Yet, the wear is much better with an oil that stayed in grade.

 

[dave1251]

The wear is near identical in this UOA if the lube was in or out of grade.

 

[Whimsey]

Originally Posted by PimTac
What were the wear metals numbers like on your analysis?


+1 Just because an oil shears to the upper ranges of the next lower grade it doesn't guarantee extra wear metals. I've done 3 UOA's, 2 with with Mobil1 5W-30 and one with Motorcraft 5W-30 syn-blend. All three showed excellent wear metals in the UOA's. The summer run, 7,000 miles, of Mobil 1 5W-30 stayed in grade, though was at the bottom of of a 30 weight. The winter run of Mobil 1 5W-30, 6,200 miles, went into the very upper range of 20 weight but still showed excellent wear metals even with minor fuel dilution. The late summer/fall use of Motorcraft 5W-30 syn-blend for 4,275 miles was well into the lower/mid range of a 20 weight oil but still showed excellent wear for the mileage it was used. Without doing UOA's you have NO idea whether shearing and or minor fuel dilution is causing extra wear metals in the engine.

Whimsey

 

[Navi]

I dont have a lot of Ecoboost UOAs to go on but there are lots of Subaru UOAs floating out there. The Subaru turbo and Ecoboost engines are similar in that they both seem to dilute the oil. Although Subarus are not used for fleets their drivers tend to want to go fast pushing them more than the regular commuter. I see lots of WRXs around here being pushed hard as if they constantly in a race.

It seems the WRX crowd has fallen into two camps...

Rotella T6 5W40

OR

Mobil 1 0w40

The reason is probably both are readily available and cheap at the local Walmart. Other oil solutions are rather costly.

 

[ka9mnx]

Originally Posted by demarpaint
So your vehicle will beat that oil to a 30 grade within a thousand miles or less? Wow, not good. I'd shorten the OCI to 4,000 or 5,000 miles max.

I tried that approach but your talking to the hand.

 

[ka9mnx]

Originally Posted by PimTac
Comparing a Subaru engine to a Ecoboost is pretty weak. As you may or may not have noticed, the wear metal numbers are excellent.

We have seen this time and time again where fuel dilution has been severe yet there was no wear evident.

Yep...

 

[Navi]

Another thing to note is both the Navigator and the F150 are built for light duty work unlike real deal commercial trucks. Ford expects you to commute and run around town with them and maybe towing the Uhaul or small boat. What I am doing is a lot more than that and pushing the platform to where most guys are not taking it.

Thus a regular Joe who puts 20k miles a year commuting and running around town is going to have a different experience.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted by Navi
Another thing to note is both the Navigator and the F150 are built for light duty work unlike real deal commercial trucks. Ford expects you to commute and run around town with them and maybe towing the Uhaul or small boat. What I am doing is a lot more than that and pushing the platform to where most guys are not taking it.

Thus a regular Joe who puts 20k miles a year commuting and running around town is going to have a different experience.



Your duty cycle is a bit more taxing then most but it's typical of LE duty and the F150 and Explorer platforms excel at this type of duty.

 

[FA_WRX]

I would have to agree with the comments above stating a sheared oil from a 30 to high 20 grade. Does not automatically constitute high wear metals in a UOA. I've had 4 done on my WRX. All 5W30 SN+ oils after 5-6K sheared to just below 30 grade. Wear metals like copper and iron still well under umiversal averages.

 

[Navi]

I just came from Walmart and made my decision. My concern was that Rotella T6 5W40 was not made for gas engines. Looking at the shelves I saw T6 5W40 for $14 for a gallon and Mobil 1 0W40 for 5 qts/$22. Then something else caught my eye...Mobil 1 5w40 with an API SN rating and thats what I got.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted by Navi
I just came from Walmart and made my decision. My concern was that Rotella T6 5W40 was not made for gas engines. Looking at the shelves I saw T6 5W40 for $14 for a gallon and Mobil 1 0W40 for 5 qts/$22. Then something else caught my eye...Mobil 1 5w40 with an API SN rating and thats what I got.

Nice you picked an oil without any applicable certification to your vehicle it may not negate LPSI and does not have timing chain stretching performance tests which is what your engine point of failure was. Plus XOM does not recommend this for gasoline engines.

https://mobiloil.com/en/motor-oils/mobil-1/mobil-1-turbo-diesel-truck

 

[ka9mnx]

Originally Posted by dave1251
Nice you picked an oil without any applicable certification to your vehicle it may not negate LPSI and does not have timing chain stretching performance tests which is what your engine point of failure was. Plus XOM does not recommend this for gasoline engines.

Yep...

 

[Navi]

Then why does it say API SN under the label "Gasoline Engines".

The Subaru guys run Shell Rotella T6 5W40 all the time and thats because they know they need a 5W40 but when they go to Walmart this is the only 5W40 around...

If you email Shell they say not to put it in gas engines because Phosphorus too high and bad for cats.

So Mobil got smart and created a 5W40 which can be put in a gas engine. The guys like the Subi crowd go to Walmart looking at the labels and oh look here is one that says gas engines.

Blackstone verified it. These diesel 5W40 oils have the best wear...even better then Amsoils Signature Series 5W30! The Subaru crowd has confirmed these oils dont fall victim to fuel dilution.

Where am I going wrong?

 

[dave1251]

Also just because a 5W30 is recommend it's not expected to remain a 5W30 you act like a 30 grade is the absolute minimum spec. If this was the case Ford would recommend a 50 grade because Ford power train is very aware engine oils shear. You act like you know more than Ford. Well kid I'll break it to you. You don't.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted by Navi
Then why does it say API SN under the label "Gasoline Engines".

The Subaru guys run Shell Rotella T6 5W40 all the time and thats because they know they need a 5W40 but when they go to Walmart this is the only 5W40 around...

If you email Shell they say not to put it in gas engines because Phosphorus too high and bad for cats.

So Mobil got smart and created a 5W40 which can be put in a gas engine. The guys like the Subi crowd go to Walmart looking at the labels and oh look here is one that says gas engines.

Blackstone verified it. These diesel 5W40 oils have the best wear...even better then Amsoils Signature Series 5W30! The Subaru crowd has confirmed these oils dont fall victim to fuel dilution.

Where am I going wrong?



Read the link in my response. You are wrong in a couple of your assumptions.