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In seeing this thread got moved, I thought we were discussing the additive here, not the oil.
My bad!
My bad!
Is Liquimoly Overrated?
- Thread starter ad244
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Originally Posted by ChristianReske
Ask me which Company is overrated in my opinion...
Which company is overrated?
Ask me which Company is overrated in my opinion...
Which company is overrated?
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
The generating station where I worked had B&W MPS 89 coal pulverizer. A lube rep told our engineering dept that using their gear oil with moly would reduce power requirements by X amps/watts and had a nice chart showing what $$$ saving we would see. Engineering agreed to install the moly product in one of the units due for gear oil change. With one caveat. They would put a strip chart on the 600 hp motor and record the power usage. If their product performed at stated we would pay the invoice. Guess what? That moly product didn't do squat and in fact wasn't as efficient as the Mobil SHC 630 series gear oil we had been using for several years. So much for that.
Originally Posted by newbe46
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Cheaper than BMW oil, Castrol or Amsoil Ravenol or Redline?
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Cheaper than BMW oil, Castrol or Amsoil Ravenol or Redline?
Originally Posted by ad244
Originally Posted by newbe46
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Cheaper than BMW oil, Castrol or Amsoil Ravenol or Redline?
Probably it is. It is very unique market.
Originally Posted by newbe46
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Cheaper than BMW oil, Castrol or Amsoil Ravenol or Redline?
Probably it is. It is very unique market.
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
When you say "had better results" - specifically related to what parameters?
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
When you say "had better results" - specifically related to what parameters?
I've never personally used Liqui-Moly. Just going by the VOAs and UOAs I've seen on it though, it doesn't seem all that impressive for the price.
Originally Posted by TiGeo
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
When you say "had better results" - specifically related to what parameters?
Oil consumption. Car was Opel Vectra B 2.0 16V which had known valve stem issue. It could be mitigated with il for a long period of time. All oils worked well except Liqui Moly. That thing was burning like crazy. It does not matter grade, composition etc.
I used INA Sint (Croatian oil) and OLMA (Slovenian) and had much better results. Castrol was good as well as Shell Helix.
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
When you say "had better results" - specifically related to what parameters?
Oil consumption. Car was Opel Vectra B 2.0 16V which had known valve stem issue. It could be mitigated with il for a long period of time. All oils worked well except Liqui Moly. That thing was burning like crazy. It does not matter grade, composition etc.
I used INA Sint (Croatian oil) and OLMA (Slovenian) and had much better results. Castrol was good as well as Shell Helix.
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
Agreed. I am no Liquimoly fan at all.
Originally Posted by TiGeo
If LM cost $23 for 5L nobody would care. So it's not overrated m...it's overpriced compared to similar oils here in the U.S. I still buy it b/c I'm a fanboi.
It is both, overrated and overpriced.
I used LM before it ever made to the US market, and had better results with some unknown oils, locally produced in Central Europe.
Even then, LM was blasting Made in Germany and all those Auto Bild, Auto, Motor und Sport tests etc.
Agreed. I am no Liquimoly fan at all.
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
You want to know the truth?
As long as it meets the manufacturer's specs, oil is oil. Especially with German cars that have more specific requirements than your standard API stuff. As long as it's on the list you're good to go.
If you buy the cheapest oil that meets specs, it will perform so close to the most expensive that the difference, even over hundreds of thousands of miles, will be imperceptible if it even exists.
So is LM overrated? Yeah. It's not alone in that, though. The fact is, oil is very much a mature industry, every company knows how to make a product that will work, and every automaker knows what products are necessary for their applications. Furthermore, no manufacturer would warrant the use of an oil if they weren't sure it would work. Just buy whatever meets specs and don't worry about it. LM works alright but it's not magic. That said, their leak detection dyes are pretty cool and I wish they were more common. Not worth a price premium though.
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
You want to know the truth?
As long as it meets the manufacturer's specs, oil is oil. Especially with German cars that have more specific requirements than your standard API stuff. As long as it's on the list you're good to go.
If you buy the cheapest oil that meets specs, it will perform so close to the most expensive that the difference, even over hundreds of thousands of miles, will be imperceptible if it even exists.
So is LM overrated? Yeah. It's not alone in that, though. The fact is, oil is very much a mature industry, every company knows how to make a product that will work, and every automaker knows what products are necessary for their applications. Furthermore, no manufacturer would warrant the use of an oil if they weren't sure it would work. Just buy whatever meets specs and don't worry about it. LM works alright but it's not magic. That said, their leak detection dyes are pretty cool and I wish they were more common. Not worth a price premium though.
Originally Posted by ad244
Originally Posted by newbe46
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Cheaper than BMW oil, Castrol or Amsoil Ravenol or Redline?
10w60 is a unique grade which literally only covers a handful of engines (Primarily BMW M-models with engine code: S54, S65, S85).
M1 never designed an oil for this grade, Castrol (TWS) was what BMW dealers sold and Shell came out with a 10w60. LM I think is the only other.
Originally Posted by newbe46
Originally Posted by ad244
Hey BITOGers
Ive never seen a oil analysis which really showed an amazing result when using Liquimoly.... Is the stuff overrated especially when you factor in the cost?
Can't most of the same spec's be met with a lot of the Mobil 1 or Castrol offerings?
For me it is the cheapest 10W-60 option I could find.
Cheaper than BMW oil, Castrol or Amsoil Ravenol or Redline?
10w60 is a unique grade which literally only covers a handful of engines (Primarily BMW M-models with engine code: S54, S65, S85).
M1 never designed an oil for this grade, Castrol (TWS) was what BMW dealers sold and Shell came out with a 10w60. LM I think is the only other.
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This I think is a deep dark secret on Bitog. In fact, has there ever been any definitive evidence that the use of one appropriately rated oil has any statistical difference over another? We have endless posts on here that this oil or that one produced 5 ppm less iron or what-not than another with zero proof that it was even due to the oil in the first place. Many factors will influence the results on a used oil analysis, none are run in controlled environments, and yet people here hang their hats on the notion that the observed deviance is due to the oil.
In fact, what evidence we do have is that it is not due to the oil. I'd wager that the vast majority of the UOA on here are entirely worthless for this purpose yet people hang on every number as if they can glean relevance from noise.
Originally Posted by littlehulkster
You want to know the truth?
As long as it meets the manufacturer's specs, oil is oil. Especially with German cars that have more specific requirements than your standard API stuff. As long as it's on the list you're good to go.
If you buy the cheapest oil that meets specs, it will perform so close to the most expensive that the difference, even over hundreds of thousands of miles, will be imperceptible if it even exists.
So is LM overrated? Yeah. It's not alone in that, though. The fact is, oil is very much a mature industry, every company knows how to make a product that will work, and every automaker knows what products are necessary for their applications. Furthermore, no manufacturer would warrant the use of an oil if they weren't sure it would work. Just buy whatever meets specs and don't worry about it. LM works alright but it's not magic.
In fact, what evidence we do have is that it is not due to the oil. I'd wager that the vast majority of the UOA on here are entirely worthless for this purpose yet people hang on every number as if they can glean relevance from noise.
Originally Posted by littlehulkster
You want to know the truth?
As long as it meets the manufacturer's specs, oil is oil. Especially with German cars that have more specific requirements than your standard API stuff. As long as it's on the list you're good to go.
If you buy the cheapest oil that meets specs, it will perform so close to the most expensive that the difference, even over hundreds of thousands of miles, will be imperceptible if it even exists.
So is LM overrated? Yeah. It's not alone in that, though. The fact is, oil is very much a mature industry, every company knows how to make a product that will work, and every automaker knows what products are necessary for their applications. Furthermore, no manufacturer would warrant the use of an oil if they weren't sure it would work. Just buy whatever meets specs and don't worry about it. LM works alright but it's not magic.
Originally Posted by kschachn
This I think is a deep dark secret on Bitog. In fact, has there ever been any definitive evidence that the use of one appropriately rated oil has any statistical difference over another? We have endless posts on here that this oil or that one produced 5 ppm less iron or what-not than another with zero proof that it was even due to the oil in the first place. Many factors will influence the results on a used oil analysis, none are run in controlled environments, and yet people here hang their hats on the notion that the observed deviance is due to the oil.
In fact, what evidence we do have is that it is not due to the oil. I'd wager that the vast majority of the UOA on here are entirely worthless for this purpose yet people hang on every number as if they can glean relevance from noise.
Originally Posted by littlehulkster
You want to know the truth?
As long as it meets the manufacturer's specs, oil is oil. Especially with German cars that have more specific requirements than your standard API stuff. As long as it's on the list you're good to go.
If you buy the cheapest oil that meets specs, it will perform so close to the most expensive that the difference, even over hundreds of thousands of miles, will be imperceptible if it even exists.
So is LM overrated? Yeah. It's not alone in that, though. The fact is, oil is very much a mature industry, every company knows how to make a product that will work, and every automaker knows what products are necessary for their applications. Furthermore, no manufacturer would warrant the use of an oil if they weren't sure it would work. Just buy whatever meets specs and don't worry about it. LM works alright but it's not magic.
Nobody has ever shown any meaningful data that for the average person with an average car with average driving habits that there is any difference in the oil you use if it meets the specs/approvals of the manufacturer. Most people ditch their cars so soon and don't "drive them forever" it's hard to really say what makes an impact in terms of oil type, OCI, UOAs, etc.. It's like twin data - you need 2 identical cars from "birth" to do this kind of testing on. The oil debates etc. are just a way to be a car nerd and that's ok too.
This I think is a deep dark secret on Bitog. In fact, has there ever been any definitive evidence that the use of one appropriately rated oil has any statistical difference over another? We have endless posts on here that this oil or that one produced 5 ppm less iron or what-not than another with zero proof that it was even due to the oil in the first place. Many factors will influence the results on a used oil analysis, none are run in controlled environments, and yet people here hang their hats on the notion that the observed deviance is due to the oil.
In fact, what evidence we do have is that it is not due to the oil. I'd wager that the vast majority of the UOA on here are entirely worthless for this purpose yet people hang on every number as if they can glean relevance from noise.
Originally Posted by littlehulkster
You want to know the truth?
As long as it meets the manufacturer's specs, oil is oil. Especially with German cars that have more specific requirements than your standard API stuff. As long as it's on the list you're good to go.
If you buy the cheapest oil that meets specs, it will perform so close to the most expensive that the difference, even over hundreds of thousands of miles, will be imperceptible if it even exists.
So is LM overrated? Yeah. It's not alone in that, though. The fact is, oil is very much a mature industry, every company knows how to make a product that will work, and every automaker knows what products are necessary for their applications. Furthermore, no manufacturer would warrant the use of an oil if they weren't sure it would work. Just buy whatever meets specs and don't worry about it. LM works alright but it's not magic.
Nobody has ever shown any meaningful data that for the average person with an average car with average driving habits that there is any difference in the oil you use if it meets the specs/approvals of the manufacturer. Most people ditch their cars so soon and don't "drive them forever" it's hard to really say what makes an impact in terms of oil type, OCI, UOAs, etc.. It's like twin data - you need 2 identical cars from "birth" to do this kind of testing on. The oil debates etc. are just a way to be a car nerd and that's ok too.
I think the question should be whether or not LM is more overrated than other oils with the same approvals. And we need to know who is overrating the product: the manufacturers, testing facilities, consumers, mechanics, Joe the barber?
Originally Posted by vavavroom
I think the question should be whether or not LM is more overrated than other oils with the same approvals. And we need to know who is overrating the product: the manufacturers, testing facilities, consumers, mechanics, Joe the barber?
What? Are you suggesting the manufacturer or the testing entity are faking the approvals?
I think the question should be whether or not LM is more overrated than other oils with the same approvals. And we need to know who is overrating the product: the manufacturers, testing facilities, consumers, mechanics, Joe the barber?
What? Are you suggesting the manufacturer or the testing entity are faking the approvals?
Originally Posted by kschachn
Originally Posted by vavavroom
I think the question should be whether or not LM is more overrated than other oils with the same approvals. And we need to know who is overrating the product: the manufacturers, testing facilities, consumers, mechanics, Joe the barber?
What? Are you suggesting the manufacturer or the testing entity are faking the approvals?
No, I am not suggesting that at all. I'm questioning the choice or word "overrated" because we don't know who's overrating a product and based on what criteria. The manufacturer's approvals speak for themselves. Tests may show a superior product or a better value for one or another product. The term "overrated" is so vague that I find the original question unanswerable.
Originally Posted by vavavroom
I think the question should be whether or not LM is more overrated than other oils with the same approvals. And we need to know who is overrating the product: the manufacturers, testing facilities, consumers, mechanics, Joe the barber?
What? Are you suggesting the manufacturer or the testing entity are faking the approvals?
No, I am not suggesting that at all. I'm questioning the choice or word "overrated" because we don't know who's overrating a product and based on what criteria. The manufacturer's approvals speak for themselves. Tests may show a superior product or a better value for one or another product. The term "overrated" is so vague that I find the original question unanswerable.
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